setuporg Posted December 27, 2019 Share #401 Posted December 27, 2019 Advertisement (gone after registration) On 12/25/2019 at 7:15 PM, rickgrainger said: Could the S3 be going through a rework of the back to put it in line with the three button layout of the SL2, M10, and Q2? Maybe this rework would cause the delay? Just thinking out loud. Blasphemy!:) 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted December 27, 2019 Posted December 27, 2019 Hi setuporg, Take a look here When will S3 be available? {merged}. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Stuart Richardson Posted December 27, 2019 Share #402 Posted December 27, 2019 I certainly hope not...I think the interface and handling is one point that most can agree on. If anything, it might be nice to go back to the shutter speed dial that we had in the S2 and S006. The switch to the three button interface seems to be one of the few areas where the SL1 is better than the SL2. I think it would be a strange and unwise move to change that for the S system. The S3 is most likely to appeal to people already in the system, and most of us have been using the S system for a long time...it seems counterproductive to change the interface at this stage, just so that someone coming from a smaller camera has an easier time in the first five minutes they pick up the camera. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
helged Posted December 27, 2019 Share #403 Posted December 27, 2019 On 12/26/2019 at 4:15 AM, rickgrainger said: Could the S3 be going through a rework of the back to put it in line with the three button layout of the SL2, M10, and Q2? Maybe this rework would cause the delay? Just thinking out loud. We already know that S3 is (essentially) S007, with an updated sensor. According to Leica rep, the delay is (mainly) caused by tuning of the colour accuracy and focus accuracy. According to the same source, the S3 is on the street by Easter 2020. But as we know, the Leica calendar is rather flexible, so time will tell... 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BernardC Posted December 27, 2019 Share #404 Posted December 27, 2019 3 hours ago, helged said: We already know that S3 is (essentially) S007, with an updated sensor. According to Leica rep, the delay is (mainly) caused by tuning of the colour accuracy and focus accuracy. According to the same source, the S3 is on the street by Easter 2020. But as we know, the Leica calendar is rather flexible, so time will tell... According to a Leica rep, the SL2 will have a 41 MP sensor and no IBIS! The only thing we know for sure is that Leica reps are not a reliable source of information on future products. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
frame-it Posted December 27, 2019 Share #405 Posted December 27, 2019 4 hours ago, helged said: We already know that S3 is (essentially) S007, with an updated sensor. According to Leica rep, the delay is (mainly) caused by tuning of the colour accuracy and focus accuracy. According to the same source, the S3 is on the street by Easter 2020. But as we know, the Leica calendar is rather flexible, so time will tell... makes one wonder if the S3 sensor would fit in an SL2 body 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidmknoble Posted December 30, 2019 Share #406 Posted December 30, 2019 On 12/25/2019 at 10:15 PM, rickgrainger said: Could the S3 be going through a rework of the back to put it in line with the three button layout of the SL2, M10, and Q2? Maybe this rework would cause the delay? Just thinking out loud. I sure hope not. The S body is so big, having two buttons on either side of the LCD makes getting to things so much easier. I am keeping my SL and not upgrading for two main reasons: 1) the four button system on the back and 2) the missing GPS (I don't take my cell phone to remote locations and some international locations my cell phone doesn't get a signal, but GPS is everywhere). 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
davidmknoble Posted December 30, 2019 Share #407 Posted December 30, 2019 Advertisement (gone after registration) On 12/27/2019 at 6:24 AM, Stuart Richardson said: If anything, it might be nice to go back to the shutter speed dial that we had in the S2 and S006. The switch to the three button interface seems to be one of the few areas where the SL1 is better than the SL2. I think it would be a strange and unwise move to change that for the S system. The S3 is most likely to appeal to people already in the system, and most of us have been using the S system for a long time...it seems counterproductive to change the interface at this stage, just so that someone coming from a smaller camera has an easier time in the first five minutes they pick up the camera. I agree with the interface concept and agree it is better on the SL than SL2. But, I do like the shutter speed dial like the SL as well. Having started with the SL prior to the S, I like the idea of using A and having the shutter speed adjusted by turning the top dial. I.e., it is always right whatever the shutter speed is. Using a marked dial would mean that you had to set the dial to A and then use something else to adjust the EV... IMHO. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
setuporg Posted January 1, 2020 Share #408 Posted January 1, 2020 On 12/29/2019 at 7:18 PM, Outdoorimages said: the missing GPS (I don't take my cell phone to remote locations and some international locations my cell phone doesn't get a signal, but GPS is everywhere). The original X1D had a tiny hot shoe GPS that works just as well (or poorly) as the MkII embedded one (they went in your direction:). Why can’t Leica make such a unit to keep you happy?:) 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
setuporg Posted January 1, 2020 Share #409 Posted January 1, 2020 On 12/29/2019 at 7:20 PM, Outdoorimages said: I like the idea of using A and having the shutter speed adjusted by turning the top dial. I.e., it is always right whatever the shutter speed is. Using a marked dial would mean that you had to set the dial to A and then use something else to adjust the EV... IMHO. What I find really confusing with the SL2 is that sometimes the top wheel does the EV correction, and sometimes the thumb wheel. I’d rather them make the thumbwheel always do it. It is freaking confusing for muscle memory depending on the program. 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
helged Posted January 21, 2020 Share #410 Posted January 21, 2020 Approaching... https://leicarumors.com/2020/01/20/new-leica-s3-medium-format-camera-pictures-and-technical-specifications.aspx/ Apparently sharing the sensor with M10-M, M10-R, and Q2-M, the latter two in the pipeline. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Photon42 Posted January 21, 2020 Share #411 Posted January 21, 2020 What is a Q2M - a mono Q? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Richardson Posted January 21, 2020 Share #412 Posted January 21, 2020 Can any S007 owner elaborate on the areas where it differs from the 007? Looking at it, it seems like the base body is identical, just a different sensor. I know they mentioned an improved color array as well, but that is unlikely to appear on the spec sheet. One thing I did note was that it is still not possible to output 4k video to an external recorder. That is a bit disappointing, as the 4k formats look limited to only 24 fps, though it is 422 not 420. I was told awhile ago that this was because they had used the HDMI 1.3 spec in the body, so it looks like the same. The 4k is full frame now, which is good. It will be interesting to see how well it deals with the downsampling. Overall it sounds like the 007 with a bigger sensor, and it does not look like they have changed anything since the announcement, have they? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
helged Posted January 21, 2020 Share #413 Posted January 21, 2020 19 minutes ago, Photon42 said: What is a Q2M - a mono Q? yes. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
geetee1972 Posted January 21, 2020 Share #414 Posted January 21, 2020 49 minutes ago, Stuart Richardson said: Can any S007 owner elaborate on the areas where it differs from the 007? Looking at it, it seems like the base body is identical, just a different sensor. I know they mentioned an improved color array as well, but that is unlikely to appear on the spec sheet. One thing I did note was that it is still not possible to output 4k video to an external recorder. That is a bit disappointing, as the 4k formats look limited to only 24 fps, though it is 422 not 420. I was told awhile ago that this was because they had used the HDMI 1.3 spec in the body, so it looks like the same. The 4k is full frame now, which is good. It will be interesting to see how well it deals with the downsampling. Overall it sounds like the 007 with a bigger sensor, and it does not look like they have changed anything since the announcement, have they? Sensor is the same size, just higher pixel count and the new colour processing. Other than that the body and functionality will remain identical. It's an interesting release/update that in my opinion shows us a lot of what is wrong with the camera industry or perhaps more importantly with consumers in general. It seems like people's response to the S3 will be dissapointment; they were expecting something more but the camera being released does have 'more pixels' so that box is ticked. If simply doubling the pixel count and adding in something nebulous like colour processing software doesn't tick the photographer's box what will? A whole new body design, a whole new viewfinder array? If you own the 007 and yet you want more but that 'more' is defined by something other than pixel count then I suspect it's a false need or else the product you want is already provided by another manufacturer (Fuji) or another camera (the SL2). There are only two significant design shifts that Leica could make with the S other than increasing the pixel count, that would actually make any real world difference to the performance of the camera. The first is to move to EVF rather than OVF; that would open up a whole raft of new practical functional options. The problem with that, apart from the fact that Fuji already offer this, is that the OVF is likely the main reason for shooting the S in the first place. The second would be to find a way to shoe horn in a piece of 4x5 film transparency into the back 😉 after all let's face it, under the right lighbting conditions the S already looks every bit as good as 6x7 and that, along with the OVF, is the main reason I love this camera so the only way to improve it materially is to make the results look like an even bigger piece of film transparency. And that's my point - how do you improve on the S? It's already sublime in so many ways that all that is left for you to do is increase the pixel count and the reason we are a bit 'meh' about that is becuse what we already have is exceptional. 2 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Richardson Posted January 21, 2020 Share #415 Posted January 21, 2020 I should clarify my statement. I am not disappointed about the camera. I am a bit disappointed about the HDMI output. 1.3 was released in 2006, and 1.4 in 2009...I do think it sucks that everything in the camera should be capable of outputting a very good video signal, but they can't because they are using an extremely old standard. I am sure there are technical reasons why it was hard to do this, or otherwise I guess they would have, but it seems like just the thing they could have updated to make an improvement. I agree that most of the basic functionality is not in any need of an update, and I remain excited for the camera, especially since I skipped the 007 and have been waiting for an update for years. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
geetee1972 Posted January 21, 2020 Share #416 Posted January 21, 2020 Quote especially since I skipped the 007 and have been waiting for an update for years. I think that's always the sensible way to do things. You're probably in for a big treat then if you do move to the S3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
helged Posted January 21, 2020 Share #417 Posted January 21, 2020 Im not into video at all, but one thing to remember comparing S007 with S3 is that S3 use the Maestro II processor (same as in S007). Only SL2, as of now, uses the upgraded version III of the processor. According to a Leica representative, using Maestro III in S3 would significantly delay the release of the S3. Staying with Maestro II means that max frames pr second is lowered by 0.5 (fps) compared to that of the S007. Not bad given the increased resolution. Coming from S006, my preferred S3 is close to what is offered, but with the option to use an external EVF (a la M). A little higher frame rate would also be good for some of the shooting I do. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stuart Richardson Posted January 21, 2020 Share #418 Posted January 21, 2020 It is certainly a mature system, and I think it says a lot about the quality and state of development of DSLR's right now that they have had to change as little as they have. Cameras that are version 2 of a well tested design are usually the best to use. I am sure that Leica used the time with the 007 and extra testing to get everything sorted that they possibly could, as well as address as many issues with the new sensor as they could. I suspect that this will be quite a robust and reliable camera. Other than the AF issue, I have found my S006 to be extremely reliable, and hopefully the S3 will be as well. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmx_2 Posted January 21, 2020 Share #419 Posted January 21, 2020 Maybe this also implies that 007 will be kept in production as S-E and at a much lower price point. This could open up for more people to enter/come back to the system and secure the future. To be honest the whole system is extremely capable for what it was made, studio and fashion photography. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterv Posted January 21, 2020 Share #420 Posted January 21, 2020 Interesting times ahead, I can't wait to see/hear/read first impressions, video-reviews, test shoots and all that. I read the comments on Leica Rumours and obviously some people still don't get it and think Leica should have made some kind of mirrorless Fuji/Hassy but I am happy that they stayed with the original concept. I just got my 007 half a year ago and I'm still very happy with it so I am not in a hurry to upgrade to an S3 but it will be interesting to follow the discussions and see the images this new camera can produce in conjunction with the S lenses 🙂 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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