leicameter Posted December 31, 2023 Share #1 Posted December 31, 2023 Advertisement (gone after registration) I'm very interested in a M10-D, because I was a M film shooter, before I switched to Canon Digital in 2008. I bought my M4-P and my M6 about 35 Years ago. To get these cameras serviced is no problem. Will an digital M last so long? What happens, especialy to an M10-D, when the leica photos app, may will not be supportet in future? Maybe in 15 Years? I know, that my Canon cameras will be out of service by Canon in future, but they area at a third of the Leicas price and I don't need a app to use them. Sorry for my bad english, but I prefer the better culture of discussion in the international forum. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted December 31, 2023 Posted December 31, 2023 Hi leicameter, Take a look here Is the M10-D future save?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Hans-Dieter Gülicher Posted December 31, 2023 Share #2 Posted December 31, 2023 Überlege lieber, Dir eine M 10-R zu kaufen. Sie ist für mich ein würdiger Nachfolger meiner M3 aus 1955 und der anderen Analogen. Trotz meiner S3 bevorzuge ich sie inzwischen, vor allem mit dem neuen APO-Summicron 35 mm (siehe meine eingestellten Fotos). Ich glaube auch nicht, dass Leica in 15 Jahren mit der M 10-R Service-Probleme haben wird. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
kraxel69 Posted December 31, 2023 Share #3 Posted December 31, 2023 Is the photos app relevant for using an M10-D? Why I'm asking. I have an M-D 262 myself that can be used entirely without an app. That's ultimately the appeal of this camera. Best regards Axel 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tim Posted December 31, 2023 Share #4 Posted December 31, 2023 Never have used a M10D but if the Leica Photos App is essential the risk is certainly higher than with any other M10. If you don’t want to see the display on the back of the M10 you may want to use a half case to hide it … just my 2cents Happy new year! Cheers Tim 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomB_tx Posted December 31, 2023 Share #5 Posted December 31, 2023 As a film M user for almost 60 years I also use Digital Ms as if they were film. very seldom using the LCD. However, as I have several fine old lenses that are not 6-bit coded (and can't be due to the flange variations), I do use the menu to select the lens type. If I liked to do post-processing more I could skip that and adjust the DNG file for vignetting and color shifts, but having made my living on computers for decades I prefer just to capture good SOOC jpg images. The M9 jpgs weren't as good, but I find the M10 fine for my use. But if you only use coded lenses I think you could use the M10 D without using the app. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
leicameter Posted December 31, 2023 Author Share #6 Posted December 31, 2023 vor 15 Minuten schrieb TomB_tx: But if you only use coded lenses I think you could use the M10 D without using the app. Great hint. My M lenses aren't coded Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
evikne Posted December 31, 2023 Share #7 Posted December 31, 2023 Advertisement (gone after registration) There are rumors of an M11-D in the near future, perhaps it will be more future-proof in terms of uncoded lenses and other things. I'm eagerly waiting myself. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndreasG Posted December 31, 2023 Share #8 Posted December 31, 2023 (edited) I am a M10-D user for almost 5 years, I used the Leica app once or maybe twice to change the standard settings of the camera, then never again. Most of my lenses, old Leica ones and new lenses from Zeiss ZM are without coding, the pros and cons of coding have been discussed repeatedly in this forum, for me missing coding is a non issue. That a camera with a lot of electronics eventually will die is no secret, the question is when, after 10 years, or after 30 years. See, e.g., the light meter issues with M6 (which however still can be used without built in metering or the M9 sensor trouble. I bought the camera because it is without display, is not overloaded with controls and therefore comes close to a classic film camera. If you feel the same, buy it - I would buy again. Edited December 31, 2023 by AndreasG 8 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpitt Posted December 31, 2023 Share #9 Posted December 31, 2023 2 hours ago, Hans-Dieter Gülicher said: Überlege lieber, Dir eine M 10-R zu kaufen. Sie ist für mich ein würdiger Nachfolger meiner M3 aus 1955 und der anderen Analogen. Trotz meiner S3 bevorzuge ich sie inzwischen, vor allem mit dem neuen APO-Summicron 35 mm (siehe meine eingestellten Fotos). Ich glaube auch nicht, dass Leica in 15 Jahren mit der M 10-R Service-Probleme haben wird. Digital certainly presents higher risk for long term servicability than mechanical. I can see 2 obvious examples. I think it was in 2011 that the first coffee stain issues for the M8 came up. Only 5 years after launch, some M8s still in the shops. The LCD screen (Sony made) was not available anymore. I hope Leica was insured properly, because the replacement and upgrade program must have cost a lot. Then around 2013 the first corrosion sensor issues with the M9 came. (Kodak's responsibility ) Again, only 4-5 years after launch. That also has been solved gracefully by Leica at great effort and cost. Leica made a commitment at that time to support digital M's for 10 years after production. But could not even make that true. So do not expect your broken M10 R to be repaired 15 years after production. I hear that Leica still offers upgrades at discount to M11 for corroded M9's. That is the best you can hope for when any third party supply is involved. 1 hour ago, tim said: Never have used a M10D but if the Leica Photos App is essential the risk is certainly higher than with any other M10. If you don’t want to see the display on the back of the M10 you may want to use a half case to hide it … just my 2cents Happy new year! Cheers Tim +1 A camera that is standalone sounds more robust. Smartphones evolve at a very different pace, 1 year is a generation. 5 years is an eternity. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Overgaard Posted December 31, 2023 Share #10 Posted December 31, 2023 The Leica M10-D is very charming, and the M10 camera model series is really well-working. Look at the Leica M8, a 17 year old digital Leica camera model, still going strong and selling for around $3,000 online today (more than 50% of new price). 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted January 1 Share #11 Posted January 1 9 hours ago, dpitt said: Digital certainly presents higher risk for long term servicability than mechanical. I can see 2 obvious examples. I think it was in 2011 that the first coffee stain issues for the M8 came up. Only 5 years after launch, some M8s still in the shops. The LCD screen (Sony made) was not available anymore. I hope Leica was insured properly, because the replacement and upgrade program must have cost a lot. Then around 2013 the first corrosion sensor issues with the M9 came. (Kodak's responsibility ) Again, only 4-5 years after launch. That also has been solved gracefully by Leica at great effort and cost. Leica made a commitment at that time to support digital M's for 10 years after production. But could not even make that true. So do not expect your broken M10 R to be repaired 15 years after production. I hear that Leica still offers upgrades at discount to M11 for corroded M9's. That is the best you can hope for when any third party supply is involved. +1 A camera that is standalone sounds more robust. Smartphones evolve at a very different pace, 1 year is a generation. 5 years is an eternity. Strangely enough, “untreated” coffee stains disappeared spontaneously. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted January 1 Share #12 Posted January 1 9 hours ago, Overgaard said: The Leica M10-D is very charming, and the M10 camera model series is really well-working. Look at the Leica M8, a 17 year old digital Leica camera model, still going strong and selling for around $3,000 online today (more than 50% of new price). But not completely serviceable any more. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpitt Posted January 1 Share #13 Posted January 1 3 hours ago, jaapv said: Strangely enough, “untreated” coffee stains disappeared spontaneously. Strangely enough Leica treated this mostly cosmetic issue with the utmost respect. They scored a lot of points for me when they offered me a nice upgrade for my M8 to a brand new M9. Users with M8 in warranty even got a free M9! There was nothing wrong with my M8 apart from a slight issues with the LCD screen which was pretty much useless for judging IQ of the pictures anyway. I was surprised but very pleased with their solution. It makes me sad to read about horror stories where users with real issues that break the functionality of their M are not treated with the respect it deserves. Looks like when the third party supplier makes mistakes, they use different standards compared to when it is Leica's in house responsibility. Or at least it looks inconsistent to me, like a case to case approach in stead of a uniform policy. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Ash Posted January 1 Share #14 Posted January 1 (edited) I step into the Leica M-System with the M8.2, Summicron 28 and the Summilux 50. Regardless of upgrading to the M10 in 2017 and buying an bunch of other lenses and a M7, I would still be happy with my initial setup. It still works fine. In this respect I am pretty sure an M10D could make you happy for quite some time. Edited January 1 by Steve Ash 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pierre68 Posted January 1 Share #15 Posted January 1 I have been on the lookout for a used M10-D but Ould not find even just one on the used market... Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Overgaard Posted January 2 Share #16 Posted January 2 (edited) 10 hours ago, Pierre68 said: I have been on the lookout for a used M10-D but Ould not find even just one on the used market... There was one here. A bit expensive ... well, actually they have three of them. I would check Hong Kong and Japan as well https://www.mpb.com/en-us/product/leica-m10-d Edited January 2 by Overgaard 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
leicameter Posted January 2 Author Share #17 Posted January 2 Is it possible to read out the shutter count of the M10-D via the leica photos app? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdlaing Posted January 2 Share #18 Posted January 2 5 hours ago, leicameter said: Is it possible to read out the shutter count of the M10-D via the leica photos app? For what purpose? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
leicameter Posted January 2 Author Share #19 Posted January 2 vor 2 Stunden schrieb jdlaing: For what purpose? If I want to buy second hand, for me it's a differenz, if the camera has 2k or 200k. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdlaing Posted January 2 Share #20 Posted January 2 1 hour ago, leicameter said: If I want to buy second hand, for me it's a differenz, if the camera has 2k or 200k. There is really no way to check the count as a consumer. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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