What would happen if the M9 was a flawed camera?

[Nicoleica]

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Yeah, and where is my pallet???

 

Is that why the colour pallette of the M9 is said to be different in the way that it handles reds?

[wattsy]

I have a question.

 

Some people report the M9 being too slow in bringing a magnified image on the LCD (Amateur Photographer review, for instance).

 

Yes, it's very slow - especially if you have the camera set for uncompressed DNGs. It's very annoying if you want to chimp the focus. I haven't timed it but 9 seconds is plausible.

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[stunsworth]

Is that why the colour pallette of the M9 is said to be different in the way that it handles reds?

 

Well, tomato purée is red, and I suppose if you had a discerning palate you could tell the difference between organic and standard.

[jamriman]

OK, gentlemen, it’s Monday, you had a wonderful weekend and your sense of humor is on the top.

 

So what would happen if Leica found out a serious flaw in the M9 after 09/09/09 that requires modifying the camera (electronics and/or body). Remember the IR problem when the M8 hit the market and the SDS (Do you remember, guys, the transistor “T2”?).

 

Maybe Leica is just working extremely hard trying to find a solution. This could explain the actual delivery problems.

 

Nothing new if so as we all know when the M8 first came out. We'd get a nice discount on a new lens and would have to wait a year to get it repaired.

[delander †]

Yes, it's very slow - especially if you have the camera set for uncompressed DNGs. It's very annoying if you want to chimp the focus. I haven't timed it but 9 seconds is plausible.

 

I have timed it for an uncompressed DNG. On my camera it is 4-5 seconds for the first zoom position to come into focus. For further zooming it is instantaneous.

 

Also with the M8 there is a lag after you hit the play button as the camera applies the coding/IR corrections. This is absent in the M9.

 

 

Jeff

[ulrikft]

I have a question.

 

Some people report the M9 being too slow in bringing a magnified image on the LCD (Amateur Photographer review, for instance). Even 9 seconds have been reported. The M8 was also slow when you shot DNG + JPG, in writing the images, showing them on the LCD or providing a magnified version.

 

My question is if these reports are correct.

 

The one i used had 6-9 sec zoom in time.

[UliWer]

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I have a question.

 

Some people report the M9 being too slow in bringing a magnified image on the LCD (Amateur Photographer review, for instance). Even 9 seconds have been reported. The M8 was also slow when you shot DNG + JPG, in writing the images, showing them on the LCD or providing a magnified version.

 

My question is if these reports are correct.

 

This was even criticized by Stefan Daniel in his video interview with four early testers of the M9. He seemed to be rather ennerved by it and stated it would be solved by a new firmware.

[wattsy]

Also with the M8 there is a lag after you hit the play button as the camera applies the coding/IR corrections. This is absent in the M9.

 

Perhaps, but it's still slower overall. Besides the M8 was pretty crap in this regard anyway.

[michali]

I got my M9 on 11 September and have used it every day since then. If there were any issues, I feel that we users here probably would have picked these up by now. Even though in my case at least, I'm not a pixel peeper.

 

I used the camera continuously for a week in some fairly harsh conditions during a yacht race, and so far (touch wood) no issues. It's frozen up once, but that's because of my own stupidity, I wasn't thinking and took a shot with the lens cap on, nothing a battery removal couldn't sort out.

 

IMO the M9 is an amazing tool which I love using (as I still do my M8), and have yet to find anything with it that really irritates or annoys me, even though mine is a Grey Silver model.

 

If there was anything really seriously wrong with the M9 we would have all been screaming at the top of our voices on this Forum! And I guess we wouldn't be seeing some of the threads we've been seeing here about colour co-ordination of lenses and a whole lot of other, in my mind inconsequential matters, and yes, I accept that everyone has a right to voice their opinions, no matter how inconsequential or trivial these may seem to some. Other than 1 or 2 very unlucky users who ended up with lines on their M9 sensors, there don't seem to be too many problems with the cameras out there.

 

It appears that supply has by far exceeded demand and possibly coupled with component delays from suppliers, this is causing a backlog.

 

Do you not think that Leica would have been in contact with their dealers or users if there was a serious issue that necessitated a recall?

[michali]

It appears that supply has by far exceeded demand and possibly coupled with component delays from suppliers, this is causing a backlog.

 

Shold read "It appears that demand has by far exceeded supply........".

[adli]

Joking aside, I'm still waiting to hear why the 18mm Super-Elmar gives the red left edge to the image. It's great that CornerFix can handle it but Sandy's tests show a clear asymmetry to the sensor performance.

 

I still don't understand how they squeezed the sensor and the battery into the space available and the M9 lens throat is still more crowded than in a film M (my M6). There remains the possibility they have mounted the sensor off-centre as the least-worst option in bringing the M9 to market in double-quick time.

 

Are you sure this is a problem related only to M8/M9?

 

On my M6 I have more vignetting on the left side of the picture than on the right side when using the the 18mm Super-Elmar

[carstenw]

Adli, are you serious??? Could you post an example? This is getting weirder and weirder...

[swamiji]

Are you sure this is a problem related only to M8/M9?

 

On my M6 I have more vignetting on the left side of the picture than on the right side when using the the 18mm Super-Elmar

 

I wonder... Does the WATE have the same problem?

[carstenw]

I wonder... Does the WATE have the same problem?

 

Not on the M8, in my experience. Beyond that, I cannot say.

[ArtZ]

What was the flaw with the M8, did they make a hardware adjustment and I assume it was offered for free to early adopters? Or was it just the confusion around the IR filter issue, etc?

 

novice9,

 

When the M8 hit the market, Leica wasn't aware of the IR contamination problem. When people started having pictures where blacks were magenta (and complaining about it), Leica proposed the IR/UV filter solution. It took a really long time to get them... (not just the two free ones they offered). The most difficult to get it was the 67mm for the WATE together with the adapter.

 

It was also another problem: "The Sudden Dead Syndrome" (SDS – for friends). Cameras were dying... with no apparent reason. Few months later, Leica found a transistor (called “T2” – for friends and relatives).

 

But there were also problems like green lines, darn line, dead pixels (not corrected yet) or the “mad scroll”, “venetian blind effect” and the auto WB… (corrected one year later with new firmware) and some other , “minor”, problems we all know very well.

 

 

The factory would have had feedback since a few weeks about any reliability issues, and I am sure we would have seen many postings here about a common defect. There have been no reports of any hardware problem that I have seen.

 

Frankly I think suggesting a potential hardware issue is pretty irresponsible and damaging to Leica as they try to get their business on a sound business footing. I hope unless there is something concrete to report that people do not add to the malicious speculation and rumours.

 

There’re a few rapports here: Wide angle lenses magenta cast on the left side, pink lines, weird artifacts (lines) in the middle of pictures, camera locks, impossible to set time…

 

I’d love to get a M9 with a full frame sensor, but not at any price… and if the price is sending my M9 to Customer Service to get it serviced so many times as I had to send my M8s, the answer it’s definitely no. So I’m not suggesting a potential hardware issue but… I was just wondering what would happen if there was one…

 

 

Yesterday in the german forum a user reported from his visit in the factory that the serial numbers produced at the moment were 3811xxx; when the first M9 were delivered they were 3803xxx. They are producing about 50 M9s a day.

 

This was even criticized by Stefan Daniel in his video interview with four early testers of the M9. He seemed to be rather ennerved by it and stated it would be solved by a new firmware.

 

 

Uli,

 

Leica serial numbers are not consecutive. A M8 with serial number 33xxxxx is older than a M8 with 32xxxxx. The way how Leica attributes a SN has been discussed here many times.

 

IMHO, I don’t think the problem of the M9 being too slow in bringing a magnified image on the LCD can be sort out by firmware. I think it depends more on the internal processor. Even with a fast modern computer takes a while to open a DNG file…

 

 

To be sincere, many reported the same problem/issue: there's an overcorrected border in images take with wide angle lenses. I.E. irregular vignetting.

I'm not sayin' that there's a hardware problem, I (as many) am sayin' that there's a problem. Stop.

Actually it doesn't bother me that much, but it's there, and I need that to be fixed.

They're not sayin' that there's a HARDWARE problem for sure, some are guessing what it could be, and some are sayin' that there's a hardware problem rather than software.

IMHO, complaining about that issue is more than a right for those who trusted the brand, and bought the camera. Isn't it? It's still loyal IMO.

You may intend this as constructive or not, it depends on you I guess.

 

Maurizio,

 

+1000

[UliWer]

...

..but… I was just wondering what would happen if there was one…

 

 

Uli,

 

Leica serial numbers are not consecutive. A M8 with serial number 33xxxxx is older than a M8 with 32xxxxx. The way how Leica attributes a SN has been discussed here many times.

 

IMHO, I don’t think the problem of the M9 being too slow in bringing a magnified image on the LCD can be sort out by firmware. I think it depends more on the internal processor. Even with a fast modern computer takes a while to open a DNG file…

 

 

This forum is a fascinating place! People who are just wandering know more about Leica than those who see the production and those who are responsible for it.

 

Information was a malice, abandoned long ago. Today we live in the great age of the Internet.

[UliWer]

Are you sure this is a problem related only to M8/M9?

 

On my M6 I have more vignetting on the left side of the picture than on the right side when using the the 18mm Super-Elmar

 

How vignetting of a lens is visible on the photo is very much depending of exposure. Vignetting makes the edges darker. If one edge is overexposed vignetting makes it look just right.

 

When I noticed the issue of red shift first with the 18mm Super-Elmar with the M8 I was sure that it was only on the left side. When I looked further I found out that all those pictures where I noticed it only on the left side had much brighter parts on the right side. On pictures with equal exposure I clearly saw the red shift on both sides. If you take a picture of a white card with the M6 and be sure that exposure is equal on both sides, you will notice regular vignetting on both sides.

 

Here an example of regular red shift on both sides in a situation with very regular lighting (the darker right part of the ceiling is so originally in the building):

 

http://www.l-camera-forum.com/leica-forum/leica-m9-forum/103003-cornerfix-1-3-0-0-available-2.html#post1092262

 

Here a situation where the red shift seems to be "leftist": 1. picture- sun from the right, shadow on the left; 2. picture again left and right:

 

http://www.l-camera-forum.com/leica-forum/forum-zur-leica-m8/98843-problem-mit-dem-super-elmar-18mm.html#post1040024

[UliWer]

Here an example from a - not so clean - greycard.

 

regular lamp light from above, "lens detection on with UV/IR", underexposed, lit up in C1:

 

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[Mauribix]

Ok, so here I am.

Here is attached a non-artistic sample of a summicron 28ASPH picture taken with the M9 presenting the "weird purple vignetting sindrome" (I'd like to call it "Wepuvis" ).

I had to overexpose it in PP to show you the wepuvis a little more. (plz just take a look at the left and bottom borders).

Anyway, on a large print, it was visible with "normal" PP.

 

So this shot is taken with a 28mm (coded) lens, and I feel I don't need to show you the 21mm and wider shot, do I?

So I guess that considering the problem only a SE18 issue is not that correct BTW.

 

@ArtZ... thank you my friend!

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[melissah]

Ok, so here I am.

Here is attached a non-artistic sample of a summicron 28ASPH picture taken with the M9 presenting the "weird purple vignetting sindrome" (I'd like to call it "Wepuvis" ).

I had to overexpose it in PP to show you the wepuvis a little more. (plz just take a look at the left and bottom borders).

Anyway, on a large print, it was visible with "normal" PP.

 

So this shot is taken with a 28mm (coded) lens, and I feel I don't need to show you the 21mm and wider shot, do I?

So I guess that considering the problem only a SE18 issue is not that correct BTW.

 

wow! i think on a lg print you can really see that.

im not loving that! at the same time being the sucker that i am i will buy the stop gap and prolly be really happy. im guessing ill say things like; one camera cant be everything, and i love it anyway cause its leica glass, and its so small, which is what i say about my m8.

i will say this though what ive seen of the hi-isos using LTRM3 is very encouraging. but thats a diff. thread!

BTW Mauribix, love your work.

best, melissa