28 Summilux vs. 28 Summicron Asph V2

[Steven]

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Bought the Ultron last Friday after our chat. Shot 22 rolls of Portra, developed them at home, and scanned them tonight.

I need to edit the files to see how I feel, but my first impression after viewing the images is that the lens is spectacular. It's everything I didn't find in the Summicron. My Summilux, Elmarit, and Summaron all have a strong signature. The Summicron felt too dull to me, but this Ultron is quite the opposite. Great look at F2, and as you said, it's apoesque when closed down. A bit too contrasty for me, but nothing I should not be able to fix in post. Besides that, it has an insane amount of micro contrast and 3D pop. Reminds me of the Q2.

I didn't hate the cone shape in the end. I think the lens feels premium and it feels much smaller than my ex Summicron V1. No need for hood, it resists flare like crazy too. I think it will stay. What a bargain of a lens. 

[Al Brown]

Had the 28 Ultron II and sold it. Waaaaaay too boring despite the proper 3D pop and flawless render. I have recommended it many times to many members here but for me, it lacks the quintessential pixie dust.
I have to check out all three 28 Summarons & clones.

Photo: M10-P Reporter + 28 Ultron II coded as the 28 cron wide open in Paris.

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Edited May 4, 2023 by Al Brown

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[Steven]

 Should have mentioned (or reminded) that I only test lenses on film nowadays. Havent owned a digital camera in over a year. 

[mmradman]

20 minutes ago, Steven said:

Bought the Ultron last Friday after our chat. Shot 22 rolls of Portra, developed them at home, and scanned them tonight.

I need to edit the files to see how I feel, but my first impression after viewing the images is that the lens is spectacular. It's everything I didn't find in the Summicron. My Summilux, Elmarit, and Summaron all have a strong signature. The Summicron felt too dull to me, but this Ultron is quite the opposite. Great look at F2, and as you said, it's apoesque when closed down. A bit too contrasty for me, but nothing I should not be able to fix in post. Besides that, it has an insane amount of micro contrast and 3D pop. Reminds me of the Q2.

I didn't hate the cone shape in the end. I think the lens feels premium and it feels much smaller than my ex Summicron V1. No need for hood, it resists flare like crazy too. I think it will stay. What a bargain of a lens. 

Coming from you Steven it is high praise, may consider it to supplement my 28mm Summilux as lightweight option. Oh, and welcome back.

[insomnia]

Well, the Summilux is another deal - but I'd never ever opt for the Summicron knowing the CV Ultron II, better at everything despite vignette. 

[hdmesa]

39 minutes ago, insomnia said:

Well, the Summilux is another deal - but I'd never ever opt for the Summicron knowing the CV Ultron II, better at everything despite vignette. 

What goes hand-in-hand with the Ultron's vignetting is the bokeh at f/2 has a tendency to become less blurred toward the edges of the frame when the subject is at mid-distances. The Cron is smooth to the edges at the same distances and does not have the "swirl" of the Ultron. Some may consider the swirl and bokeh unevenness to be "character", others may not. The vignetting may also be considered character with an artistic purpose. Vignetting added in post never looks as good as the lenses optical vignetting, IMO. Overall, the Ultron has a more active bokeh wide open and higher microcontrast stopped down, while the Chron is more calming wide open and stopped down both.

Neither of these lenses are optically better overall, they are just different. Value is another topic entirely, and we know the CV wins that contest easily.

It won't be long before Voigtlander makes a 28 1.4 with a 0.5m close focus that rivals the 28 Lux.

Edited May 4, 2023 by hdmesa

[hdmesa]

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1 hour ago, Steven said:

Bought the Ultron last Friday after our chat. Shot 22 rolls of Portra, developed them at home, and scanned them tonight.

I need to edit the files to see how I feel, but my first impression after viewing the images is that the lens is spectacular. It's everything I didn't find in the Summicron. My Summilux, Elmarit, and Summaron all have a strong signature. The Summicron felt too dull to me, but this Ultron is quite the opposite. Great look at F2, and as you said, it's apoesque when closed down. A bit too contrasty for me, but nothing I should not be able to fix in post. Besides that, it has an insane amount of micro contrast and 3D pop. Reminds me of the Q2.

I didn't hate the cone shape in the end. I think the lens feels premium and it feels much smaller than my ex Summicron V1. No need for hood, it resists flare like crazy too. I think it will stay. What a bargain of a lens. 

I'll be interested to hear your further thoughts on the Ultron for film after full evaluation. I doubt anyone else in the world has shot that many rolls of film with this lens yet.

I'm going to be experimenting with diffusion filters on the 28 Cron to see if/how it changes the character. I'm trying the Glimmerglass 1 at the moment. So far, it's very different from the Black ProMist and Cinebloom filters. It looks much more subtle and filmic to me. Could be exactly what this lens needs.

[Steven]

2 hours ago, mmradman said:

Coming from you Steven it is high praise, may consider it to supplement my 28mm Summilux as lightweight option. Oh, and welcome back.

Thank you sir, and thank you sir. If I remember correctly, it was a bw photo of yours that started my passionate love affair with the Summaron. Nice to see you. 

[Steven]

2 hours ago, insomnia said:

Well, the Summilux is another deal - but I'd never ever opt for the Summicron knowing the CV Ultron II, better at everything despite vignette. 

Nothing can take the Summilux's throne. It's number one. Pity it's so big. I only use it for war zones now. 

Edited May 4, 2023 by Steven

[Steven]

1 hour ago, hdmesa said:

I'll be interested to hear your further thoughts on the Ultron for film after full evaluation. I doubt anyone else in the world has shot that many rolls of film with this lens yet.

I'm going to be experimenting with diffusion filters on the 28 Cron to see if/how it changes the character. I'm trying the Glimmerglass 1 at the moment. So far, it's very different from the Black ProMist and Cinebloom filters. It looks much more subtle and filmic to me. Could be exactly what this lens needs.

I'm at around 100 rolls per months lately. Since I started developing and scanning everything at home, I stopped being hard to get with the shutter button. 

I think a diffusion filter might indeed work well, even on film. Will keep you posted when I shoot more. 

[28framelines]

1 minute ago, Steven said:

Nothing can take the Summilux's throne. It's number one. Pity it's so big. I only use it for war zones now. 

Stephen, a question I have for you is how do you compose your portraits with a 28 so you don’t get crazy amounts of distortion? You’ve taken so many wonderful portraits at this focal length I feel, so I’m curious as to what you’ve done to take some of the unlikeable characteristics with documentary portraits at this focal length

[Steven]

Andre "Dédé" Raggio. The oldest fisherman in Saint Tropez. There are only four left now; apparently young locals prefer to drive yatchs in the day than fishermen boat at night. 

28 Ultron II, F11, Portra 800 exposed at 200. 

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Edited May 4, 2023 by Steven

[Steven]

Same as above, better (zone) focus. 

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[Steven]

3 minutes ago, 28framelines said:

Stephen, a question I have for you is how do you compose your portraits with a 28 so you don’t get crazy amounts of distortion? You’ve taken so many wonderful portraits at this focal length I feel, so I’m curious as to what you’ve done to take some of the unlikeable characteristics with documentary portraits at this focal length

Thank you. My trick to avoid distortion is to not look for it. I'm not a very technical guy. I just go for feeling. If I like the photo I don't look for distortions or purple I don't know what... 

[Steven]

There might be distortion in the photos I just posted, I don't know, I don't really care. It's just a good memory of a moment spent with Dédé Raggio. I felt pretty privileged. 

[250swb]

2 hours ago, insomnia said:

Well, the Summilux is another deal - but I'd never ever opt for the Summicron knowing the CV Ultron II, better at everything despite vignette. 

It would still be nice to see a sharp photo from the Ultron II as a basis for deciding which is better. So far all I'm seeing is mush, not that I don't believe in Voigtlander lenses, but I do believe there is something else going on if the examples posted so far are supposed to be great examples.

Edited May 4, 2023 by 250swb

[Huss]

I too am also a film shooter (even though I own a digi M).  I have the 28 Cron v2 and the new Ultron.  Apart from vignetting at f2 on the Ultron, I cannot tell a difference.  The Ultron is THE bargain in M mount lenses.

However... it's ugly.  I don't get it. Why?  The CV 40 1.2, 50 1.2, 35 1.2 vIII etc all look great physically.  Even the font on the Ultron is ugly!  The Summicron Asph 28 v2 just looks and feels superb.  But I'm not going to get rid of the Ultron because the pics it makes are so good, and it was so cheap in comparison.  I bought mine used, which made it even cheaper!

If Cosina just styled this lens better, there would be no reason to get the Summicron.

[Huss]

28 Ultron v2 on M10-r @ f2

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Edited May 4, 2023 by Huss

[Huss]

Above from when I first got the lens and had to test it out that night.

 

 

Edited May 4, 2023 by Huss

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[28framelines]

40 minutes ago, Huss said:

I too am also a film shooter (even though I own a digi M).  I have the 28 Cron v2 and the new Ultron.  Apart from vignetting at f2 on the Ultron, I cannot tell a difference.  The Ultron is THE bargain in M mount lenses.

However... it's ugly.  I don't get it. Why?  The CV 40 1.2, 50 1.2, 35 1.2 vIII etc all look great physically.  Even the font on the Ultron is ugly!  The Summicron Asph 28 v2 just looks and feels superb.  But I'm not going to get rid of the Ultron because the pics it makes are so good, and it was so cheap in comparison.  I bought mine used, which made it even cheaper!

If Cosina just styled this lens better, there would be no reason to get the Summicron.

I agree with all of this except I wish they added a 0.7m close focus option for it instead of 0.5m for us film shooters. I wonder if it’s possible to have the focusing mechanism in the lens be adapted to only go to 0.7m instead