New Leica SL Lenses & Roadmap!

[dkCambridgeshire]

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Well, whatever Dunk. People back in the day where probably better than people today at using their MF long lenses, but I appreciate it that AF made people's MF focusing skills sloppy. Let's say, no sports and no fast moving birds. Other than that, what is it that the SL as it is today, with native and adapted lenses, cannot do?

 

Best,

 

Vieri

 

 

 

Very doubtful if anyone can match their manual focus skills to a current pro quality fast AF tele lens. It's not a matter of today's photographers having 'sloppy' MF skills … it's about obtaining consistent results. I use manual focus tele lenses on both my SL and T cameras for bird photography but I also have (take a deep breath) a Nikon 1 V2 with a Nikon 1 70-300mm lens (190-810mm FF equiv) … a combination with one of the fastest focusing AF lenses available and which is a pleasure to use … because of its consistently excellent AF results. There are many hundreds if not thousands of wildlife / bird photographers both amateur and professional eager to use the latest AF lenses … which is one reason why camera / lens manufacturers take 'space' at e.g. the annual Rutland Bird Fair. Anytime I visit a local nature reserve (Kings Dyke Whittlesey) the main hide is usually packed with bird photographers using AF lenses … used to photograph birds in flight in addition to 'ground' shots. I'm the only 'manual focus' advocate but their 'hit rate' was far in excess of mine .. which is why I recently opted to try the Nikon V2 and 70-300mm. But i'd much prefer to use an SL AF 400mm plus extender ... if it was available.  

 

dunk 

Edited November 30, 2017 by dkCambridgeshire

[Vieri]

Very doubtful if anyone can match their manual focus skills to a current pro quality fast AF tele lens. It's not a matter of today's photographers having 'sloppy' MF skills … it's about obtaining consistent results. I use manual focus tele lenses on both my SL and T cameras for bird photography but I also have (take a deep breath) a Nikon 1 V2 with a Nikon 1 70-300mm lens (190-810mm FF equiv) … a combination with one of the fastest focusing AF lenses available and which is a pleasure to use … because of its consistently excellent AF results. 

 

dunk 

 

That's great - still, you didn't answer my question. Other than that, what is it that the SL system, between native and adapted lenses as it is today, cannot do? Best regards,

 

Vieri

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[helged]

Very doubtful if anyone can match their manual focus skills to a current pro quality fast AF tele lens. It's not a matter of today's photographers having 'sloppy' MF skills … it's about obtaining consistent results. I use manual focus tele lenses on both my SL and T cameras for bird photography but I also have (take a deep breath) a Nikon 1 V2 with a Nikon 1 70-300mm lens (190-810mm FF equiv) … a combination with one of the fastest focusing AF lenses available and which is a pleasure to use … because of its consistently excellent AF results. 

 

dunk 

 

 

Agree, 'consistently' as a key word here. Surly, the most incredible sport and wild life images have been taken over the years, with manual lenses and with film cameras with restricted ISO. No doubt and very impressive. But for those of us that shoot now and then and/or don't have time or the opportunity to exercise day after day, year after year, or that are not that talented, like me, it is hard to se how a manual system can consistently and systematically match the high-end AF+image stabilisation systems around (in my case the Nikon D5+400mm f2.8E combo). The feeling of getting a keeper with the SL+280APO-R is great. But the number of keepers are low. Again, based on my ability to shoot erratic moving subjects with manual lenses.

[dkCambridgeshire]

That's great - still, you didn't answer my question. Other than that, what is it that the SL system, between native and adapted lenses as it is today, cannot do? Best regards,

 

Vieri

 

 

Fast AF with focal lengths in excess of 280mm …   

 

dunk 

[Vieri]

Fast AF with focal lengths in excess of 280mm …   

 

dunk 

 

That, you already said - many times! - point taken. So, I guess nothing else, then. Not too bad for a system that is just about 2 years old. To quote Mark Twain perhaps all the rumours about the system's demise (or hopelessness, to translate it in photographic terms) are a bit exaggerated after all

 

Best regards,

 

Vieri

[dkCambridgeshire]

That, you already said - many times! - point taken. So, I guess nothing else, then. Not too bad for a system that is just about 2 years old. To quote Mark Twain perhaps all the rumours about the system's demise (or hopelessness, to translate it in photographic terms) are a bit exaggerated after all

 

Best regards,

 

Vieri

 

I've not said that the SL system is hopeless or in demise … it's a wonderful AF camera system within its limitations … limitations being suitability for consistent AF results in excess of 280mm … which others fail to deem important or necessary … because such AF photography / imaging is likely not on their radar … thus they do not / cannot / will not appreciate same … and keep harking back to " … when I were a lad and we all used MF … etc etc …"   MF for sports and wildlife and other long distance imaging belongs to a bygone age !!   The only reason I try and use MF long lenses with my SL is that the Novoflex EF to SL adapter does not offer sufficiently fast AF  … thus no point in buying AF Canon tele lenses.   

 

dunk

Edited November 30, 2017 by dkCambridgeshire

[Vieri]

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I've not said that the SL system is hopeless or in demise … it's a wonderful AF camera system within its limitations … limitations being suitability for consistent AF results in excess of 280mm … which others fail to deem important or necessary … because such AF photography / imaging is likely not on their radar … thus they do not / cannot / will not appreciate same … and keep harking back to " … when I were a lad and we all used MF … etc etc …"   MF for sports and wildlife and other long distance imaging belongs to a bygone age !!   The only reason I try and use MF long lenses with my SL is that the Novoflex EF to SL adapter does not offer sufficiently fast AF  … thus no point in buying AF Canon tele lenses.   

 

dunk

 

Well, you said "For starters,..." in the first post I answered of yours. Therefore, I was waiting for something else besides AF on lenses > 280mm. However, you seem to keep repeating what you already said, many times - as I said, point taken. Let's move on, shall we?

 

Best regards,

 

Vieri

[dkCambridgeshire]

Little point in arguing further but suffice to mention that if an SL 400mm lens or similar was included on the road map it would likely sell … for the same reasons that other manufactures design and sell same and in large enough quantities to justify design and production. No other pro quality FF system has its longest focal length capped at 280mm … not even the other 'new kid on the FF mirrorless block' Sony. 

 

dunk  

Edited November 30, 2017 by dkCambridgeshire

[Vieri]

Little point in arguing further ...

 

And yet you do

 

... for the same reasons that other manufactures design and sell same and in large enough quantities to justify design and production. No other pro quality FF system has its longest focal length capped at 280mm … not even the other 'new kid on the FF mirrorless block' Sony. 

 

dunk  

 

You seem to be oblivious to market considerations, R&D resources (comparing Sony to Leica?), and so on; you also seems to think that Leica has no idea of what they are doing, just because they don't do what you want them to, when you want them to. You also seem to think that they are completely unaware of their competition and of the camera market in general. As I said before, they are in the business of making and selling cameras and lenses, so I am sure when they will be ready to produce the lens you need, they will - more specifically, I am pretty sure if they will see a market for it, and enough ROI, they will make it happen. If they won't see a market for it, or enough ROI, it will not happen, no matter how much you repeat your point.

 

Best regards,

 

Vieri

[dkCambridgeshire]

And yet you do

 

 

You seem to be oblivious to market considerations, R&D resources (comparing Sony to Leica?), and so on; you also seems to think that Leica has no idea of what they are doing, just because they don't do what you want them to, when you want them to. You also seem to think that they are completely unaware of their competition and of the camera market in general. As I said before, they are in the business of making and selling cameras and lenses, so I am sure when they will be ready to produce the lens you need, they will - more specifically, I am pretty sure if they will see a market for it, and enough ROI, they will make it happen. If they won't see a market for it, or enough ROI, it will not happen, no matter how much you repeat your point.

 

Best regards,

 

Vieri

 

Your words not mine …  I wonder what % of resources and marketing expertise has resulted in the production of the new Nocti 75/1.2 and how many will sell?

 

dunk 

[Vieri]

Your words not mine …  I wonder what % of resources and marketing expertise has resulted in the production of the new Nocti 75/1.2 and how many will sell?

 

dunk 

 

Hopeless. Have a great day, best regards

 

Vieri

[dkCambridgeshire]

Hopeless. Have a great day, best regards

 

Vieri

 

You too … have fun  

 

dunk 

[su25]

Releasing a lens road map and then revising it certainly does put Leica's credibility at risk. Releasing new products (lenses and cameras), which nobody was anticipating, does not satisfy SL owners who are waiting for delivery of new SL lenses. 

If the focus has shifted after changes in ownership and probably management of Leica, it would be better to keep their customers updated.

[Jeff S]

. Why should Leica publish a revised schedule for 2018, since we are still in 2017? I am pretty sure they will deliver the announced SL lenses in 2018.

 

 

Seriously? A map is to show where one is going.... the destination.... not just where one is. It's a useful planning tool. And once a map has been proven wrong, it's helpful that the mapmaker issue a reprint.

 

Jeff

[Jeff S]

That's great - still, you didn't answer my question. Other than that, what is it that the SL system, between native and adapted lenses as it is today, cannot do? Best regards,

 

Vieri

For those seeking only weather sealed options, there are 3 lenses currently available. And for those seeking compact, weather sealed options, there are none.

 

The 3 native lenses are brilliant performers, but the emphasis has been on focal length range and optimal performance.... not a bad thing.... as opposed to smaller lenses with less individual range, or even a bit slower.

 

I'm waiting to see, before investing in the SL system (with only native weather sealed lenses).what the future holds for smaller options beyond the announced Summicrons. A roadmap would help.

 

I may be in the minority, but that's what's missing for me. The CL might have been the answer, but it lacks weather sealing and the wonderful SL interface (no joystick).

 

Jeff

[Vieri]

Seriously? A map is to show where one is going.... the destination.... not just where one is. It's a useful planning tool. And once a map has been proven wrong, it's helpful that the mapmaker issue a reprint.

 

Jeff

 

Seriously, yes. We have a roadmap telling us that the three Summicron and the Vario will be released in 2018. Since 2018 i not here yet, I assume that roadmap is still valid. Why do you need another one? Why do you assume the old one is not valid anymore, since we are still in 2017? Perhaps you know something I don't

 

Best regards,

 

Vieri

[Vieri]

For those seeking only weather sealed options, there are 3 lenses currently available. And for those seeking compact, weather sealed options, there are none.

 

The 3 native lenses are brilliant performers, but the emphasis has been on focal length range and optimal performance.... not a bad thing.... as opposed to smaller lenses with less individual range, or even a bit slower.

 

I'm waiting to see, before investing in the SL system (with only native weather sealed lenses).what the future holds for smaller options beyond the announced Summicrons. A roadmap would help.

 

I may be in the minority, but that's what's missing for me. The CL might have been the answer, but it lacks weather sealing and the wonderful SL interface (no joystick).

 

Jeff

 

Jeff,

 

agreed, only three lenses available. We know that. It has been repeated ad nauseam; but then again, I never said the system is complete, have I? More, there will ALWAYS be someone saying "for those seeking XX", and there will ALWAYS be a XX lens missing. There is one in EVERY manufacturer lineup: oh, Nikon doesn't have any f/1 lenses, neither does Sony, nor Canon, so if I shoot Canon and I need f/1 what do I do? Move to something else, or make do with what I have. My question is, what do you shoot that you can't shoot making do with what we have now?

 

Best regards,

 

Vieri

[Vieri]

On a related note:

 

https://us.leica-camera.com/Company/Press-Centre/Press-Releases/2017/Press-Release-Leica-Camera-AG-records-strong-revenue-growth-for-the-2016-2017-financial-year-and-bucks-the-downward-trend-in-the-camera-market

 

Best regards,

 

Vieri

[su25]

Seriously, yes. We have a roadmap telling us that the three Summicron and the Vario will be released in 2018. Since 2018 i not here yet, I assume that roadmap is still valid. Why do you need another one? Why do you assume the old one is not valid anymore, since we are still in 2017? Perhaps you know something I don't

 

Best regards,

 

Vieri

 

https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/264699-new-leica-sl-lenses-roadmap/?p=3114837

 

This very first post of this thread is reason enough to doubt whether there will be further delays or changes to the road map...

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica L-Mount

[Jeff S]

Read again. I'd like a roadmap for lenses beyond the Summicrons, as there are no native lenses (like smaller zooms) that would further entice me to buy into the system. There is no fully weather sealed Leica system that has a range of compact primes and zooms. The S is also big, and it also had a history of lens delays.... and no new ones discussed.

 

If a company can't keep a roadmap current for a year to 18 months out, it shouldn't bother in the first place. I think Leica was pressured into it when Fuji, Hasselblad etc published theirs at about the same time. Leica moves at its own pace; not really a roadmap kind of company. In fact, communications regarding product issues in general is not a strong suit. But that's another topic discussed ad nauseam here.

 

Jeff

Edited November 30, 2017 by Jeff S