hektor Posted June 5, 2021 Share #15441 Posted June 5, 2021 (edited) Advertisement (gone after registration) On 6/4/2021 at 8:34 AM, wlaidlaw said: The majority of race cars of most nationalities are right hand drive, because most race circuits are clockwise with a predominance of right hand bends. Dear Wilson, There is a lack of logic in the argument that "most race circuits are clockwise with a predominance of right hand bends". To be a circuit there must be an equal number of left and right handers otherwise one would go around in decreasing circles until disappearing up one own's rectum. Your thoughts? Edited June 5, 2021 by hektor Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted June 5, 2021 Posted June 5, 2021 Hi hektor, Take a look here Name this car..... I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
wlaidlaw Posted June 5, 2021 Share #15442 Posted June 5, 2021 Hektor, Your geometry is at fault. A right hand circuit will inevitably have 360º more of right hand bends than left hand and vice versa. A very simple example of an anti-clockwise circuit which illustrates this is Indianapolis, which has 4 left hand bends and no right hand bends at all. The total change in direction across all 4 corners is 360º. The total directional changes in a clockwise circuit is given by the following equation: Total directional changes in right hand bends minus the total directional changes in left hand bends = + 360º Wilson 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hektor Posted June 5, 2021 Share #15443 Posted June 5, 2021 Thank-you Wilson, I will investigate. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rona!d Posted June 5, 2021 Share #15444 Posted June 5, 2021 Couldn´t have explained better Wilson! Especially the equation is the perfect explanation. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hektor Posted June 5, 2021 Share #15445 Posted June 5, 2021 (edited) Dear Wilson, your logic is as Rona!d said a perfect arithmetic explanation. However I have reviewed the circuits I know well and they all have both left-hand and right-hand turns, although not in equal number. Consider Monaco? Yours, Hektor Edited June 5, 2021 by hektor Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wlaidlaw Posted June 6, 2021 Share #15446 Posted June 6, 2021 Yes Hektor a clockwise circuit such as Monaco, which I know very well, will have right and left hand bends but on a clockwise circuit the sum of all the angles of turn of all bends to the left has to be 360º less than the sum of angles to the right. Because there are far more clockwise circuits than anti-clockwise (why?) that gives a small advantage to right hand drive cars for sight lines and weight distribution. However the Germans tend to make quite a few of their race cars left hand drive (both our Porsche 904/6, originally a 904/8 and 910 were left hand drive, whereas for example our Ferrari 312PB and Maserati 250S, 300S and T61 Birdcage were all more traditionally RHD). I asked Ferdinand Piech at a Porsche Classic factory meeting, why Porsche did this and his answer was that, as the majority of his drivers had learnt to drive on left hand drive cars, there was an element of familiarity with left hand drive and he felt that this conferred a very minor advantage, which outweighed sight lines and weight distribution. He agreed that this was just his feeling and he had no numerical evidence for this and my suspicion is that he is wrong. Wilson 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuny Posted June 6, 2021 Share #15447 Posted June 6, 2021 Advertisement (gone after registration) All - Don't forget that Wilson has passed his turn to post a new car photo to whomever wants to do so. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
a.j.z Posted June 6, 2021 Share #15448 Posted June 6, 2021 vor 8 Stunden schrieb stuny: All - Don't forget that Wilson has passed his turn to post a new car photo to whomever wants to do so. Ok, should not be too difficult Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/119687-name-this-car/?do=findComment&comment=4214950'>More sharing options...
thomasstellwag Posted June 6, 2021 Share #15449 Posted June 6, 2021 Citroen SM Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
a.j.z Posted June 6, 2021 Share #15450 Posted June 6, 2021 vor 11 Minuten schrieb thomasstellwag: Citroen SM Excellent - apparently the crop still was too generous 😉 Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! 2 Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/119687-name-this-car/?do=findComment&comment=4215029'>More sharing options...
hektor Posted June 6, 2021 Share #15451 Posted June 6, 2021 Ossiach, Austria 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
a.j.z Posted June 7, 2021 Share #15452 Posted June 7, 2021 vor 7 Stunden schrieb hektor: Ossiach, Austria Right answer, wrong thread 😉 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
thomasstellwag Posted June 7, 2021 Share #15453 Posted June 7, 2021 ok - its my turn again - first I want to show the engine of the last car - am a Citroen fan, but would not really like to work on this engine Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! 1 Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/119687-name-this-car/?do=findComment&comment=4215356'>More sharing options...
thomasstellwag Posted June 7, 2021 Share #15454 Posted June 7, 2021 now the new challenge, I stay with blue cars, this time not from Italy Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! 1 Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/119687-name-this-car/?do=findComment&comment=4215357'>More sharing options...
Rona!d Posted June 7, 2021 Share #15455 Posted June 7, 2021 vor 20 Minuten schrieb thomasstellwag: ok - its my turn again - first I want to show the engine of the last car - am a Citroen fan, but would not really like to work on this engine Back in it´s time it may have frightened workshops to service or repair an SM but once you knew what to do, most parts were accessible. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hiles Posted June 7, 2021 Share #15456 Posted June 7, 2021 32 minutes ago, thomasstellwag said: ok - its my turn again - first I want to show the engine of the last car - am a Citroen fan, but would not really like to work on this engine Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! I believe that the wonderful suspension systems is no fun to work on. Mercedes Benz (and Rolls Royce) licensed the system, and repairs for them is also a big and expensive nightmare. The 300SEL 6.3 and 600 Mercedes are probably good cars to avoid - they will have suspension problems and associated grief. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rona!d Posted June 7, 2021 Share #15457 Posted June 7, 2021 I have "no idea" which car this is ;-)))) But the additional blinkers are Hella 2BA 001 227-211 and VW Hella 2BA 001 235-71 I think both didn´t come with the car when it was new. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rona!d Posted June 7, 2021 Share #15458 Posted June 7, 2021 vor 59 Minuten schrieb Michael Hiles: I believe that the wonderful suspension systems is no fun to work on. Mercedes Benz (and Rolls Royce) licensed the system, and repairs for them is also a big and expensive nightmare. The 300SEL 6.3 and 600 Mercedes are probably good cars to avoid - they will have suspension problems and associated grief. I was talking about the engine. The hydropneumatic system was another story, maybe Citroen DS lovers were "soso fine". I recall works on a Borgward P100 which was the first german serial build car with a system they called "Airswing" (prior to Mercedes). The bellows weren´t available for a while, now the club offers repro parts. It was fun stopping the car at a red light and watching the pedestrians when the loud whiz came from the system (some made a 1m jump back). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
thomasstellwag Posted June 7, 2021 Share #15459 Posted June 7, 2021 52 minutes ago, Rona!d said: I have "no idea" which car this is ;-)))) But the additional blinkers are Hella 2BA 001 227-211 and VW Hella 2BA 001 235-71 I think both didn´t come with the car when it was new. sorry for the mislead, I was so fascinated by the geometry of my detail picture, that I didn´t think about false information 🙂 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wlaidlaw Posted June 7, 2021 Share #15460 Posted June 7, 2021 My flat mate in London was a Citroen DS enthusiast. He always seemed to have three on the go. One working, one being put back together and one being taken apart. I had to ban him from working on the spheres in the flat, due to the horrible smell of Citroen Green Mineral Hydraulic oil. My wife had a later CX, which was quite reliable apart from its carburettor, where the most microscopic particle of dirt, would stop it working. I eventually had three fuel filters in series to try and cure it. Wilson Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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