Reasons NOT to buy the Q3???

[nonoirie]

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Here's my experiences with the Q3 after owning it from 7/3 and after 12,674 shots.  I also own, Canon R5, Fujifilm X Pro 2, GR3 and GR3x.  

 

1. blurry and unsharp EVF during / after focusing.  During FW 1.1, I did notice it.  After FW 1.2, it doesn't bother me.  
2. extremely long shutter lag / blackout.  Blackout is noticeable but it does not bother me.  
3. Long delay after switching on the camera  / long startup time.  Response time is probably the slowest out of the all the camera I own.  
4. crops can't be enlarged in the EVF, you only see the frames which makes it extremely difficult to compose e.g. 70mm images.  I don't utilize digital zoom so I cannot answer this.  I crop in post.  
5. dust penetration on sensor:  I have no issue with dust so far.  
6. AF is mediocre and often unreliable.  "Eye/Face/Body Detection" AF mode can jump around when there is multiple subject in frame.  I switch to field view in these instances.  
7. EVF starts to struggle / gets laggy in higher Iso  as soon as the ambient light starts to dim.  Never experienced this.  
8. Quality of the paint: gets quickly scratched.  No issues so far.  
9. quite disappointing battery life (even with 170,00 Euro (!) battery from Leica) - I know problem of most cameras with EFV and mirrorless.  Better than X pro 2, GR3 or GR3x.  Probably on-par with R5 so I'm satisfied with it.  

There is no such as a perfect camera, I am blessed to enjoy the few cameras that I own.  I thought I list some of the good things about Q3;

1.   Fantastic 28mm lens.  It is the sharpest 28mm that I own.  

2.  Raw files are joy to work with.  There are a lot of data in the shadows.  Colors are neutral and love the transparency to it.  Due to the 60mp size, you can be aggressive with post cropping.  

3.  Physically, well built camera.  It also has satisfying click when adjusting the aperture on the lens which I enjoy.  

4.  Does well in high ISO situations.  

5.  Not many people mention this but I do appreciate the we can change the DNG/RAW file size, not many mirrorless camera has this option.  

6.  I'm starting to enjoy the tilt screen.  

7.  USB-C charging capability.  

[Olaf_ZG]

To me, a valid reason not to buy it, is that one prefers the versatility of a M or SL instead.

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[AussieQ]

18 hours ago, -MR- said:

Fine, you have told everyone why not buy one. Don't buy it. You seem to want to whine about not having one or you are looking for validation in some way. Glad I don't sell cameras as I would not like you as a customer.

 

 

 

18 hours ago, -MR- said:

I actually wanted to buy the Leica Q3, after some research I have discarded this for now.
Reasons are many, many negative reports from users, also in the forums here.

Some quotes I often read, sometims in professional reviews:

1. blurry and unsharp EVF during / after focusing.
2. extremely long shutter lag / blackout
3. Long delay after switching on the camera  / long startup time
4. crops can't be enlarged in the EVF, you only see the frames which makes it extremely difficult to compose e.g. 70mm images.
5. dust penetration on sensor
6. AF is mediocre and often unreliable
7. EVF starts to struggle / gets laggy in higher Iso  as soon as the ambient light starts to dim
8. Quality of the paint: gets quickly scratched
9. quite disappointing battery life (even with 170,00 Euro (!) battery from Leica) - I know problem of most camreas with EFV and mirrorless

 I still think the Q3 is a great camera, but all these problems scare me to spend 6000 Euro. Especially points 1 - 3 are serious for me.

Leica itself wrote in an advertising "Accept nothing than perfection" :-))

What do you think? Suppose you had to find reasons not to buy the Q3, what would you say? What are your criticisms (besides the price)?

It's not about badmouthing the camera, but listing its flaws and quirks.  

Thank you!

ps

Dear Leica-developers: Give us a  firmware update to solve many of the issues above.
 

 

[Daniel C.1975]

There are always plenty of reasons against buying any new camera. Too less, too late too expensive  or whatever you wish. 

For the statistics, I had the Q and used it quite a while. Sold it to concentrate more on my M and then the SL-Line. Always missed the Q, it is one darn perfect set-up. 

Finally bought the Q2 late in its product cycle and immediately fell in love again. It is/was by far my most used camera since that time. 

Played with the Q3 on day three after announcement (by myself, not just reading comments / complaints of others) just out of curiosity and was immediately hooked up as it addressed some of the points I liked  - so I put myself on the waiting list immediately afterwards - got it by mid September. The Q2 is sold, and yes, of course I lost some money in the process.

It is a bit wonky in few areas due to its firmware, but I have not faced any major glitches and not a single freeze so far. Funnily, I had my first freeze with the Q2 while comparing it with the Q3 😀. 

While the image quality of the Q2 is great and more than sufficient in most situation, it lacked in some situations compared to the SL2s. This gap has been closed with the Q3, which definitely went a few steps up in some areas, but especially in low light or extreme contrast situations where you need to underexpose by a lot to keep the highlights and pulling up the deeps in PP, by a lot - this is where there is a night and day difference between the Q2 and Q3. 

With the higher resolution and higher flexibility in PP, the cropping mode is also much more usable and was on the Q2 and is on th

EVF and Display is better. The AF has the potential to be much better, but is currently just in Face-AF better, otherwise roughly the same as the Q2 in most standard situations.

I prefer the button layout and experience the flippy screen very often as very useful. 

 

I could continue on and on. Summed up - for it was a great purchase, even in view of just moving up from the Q2. 

I also totally understand that some prefer the fixed display on the Q2 or its aesthetics, or say the plusses on the Q3 are not enough to spend the extra money - in fact, this is a very reasonable thought, but I never said that I am reasonable with my hobbies

 

Only thing to comment on: Fu** all reads and youtube videos when it comes to build your own holistic opinion. Don't get me wrong, it's nice to get some information, but everyone should try, test and evaluate by himself when it comes to an investment of this size - not only valid for expensive camera gears but also other aspects of life. Why are nowadays people just watch some videos or read some reviews and comments, and then believe they are the experts or know everything?

Honestly, you might miss some great opportunities or experiences.

Or to say it in different words: I want to taste food by myself to experience it and evaluate if I like it or not - I surly don't want others to tell me how it tastes and to tell me if I should try it or avoid it. 

 

I just don't get it. 

[brickftl]

the Q series isn't for eve;ryone.

But for those who "get" the Q, none of your stated concerns (many of which are exaggerated) overcome the joy of using this camera. Clearly you aren't one who "gets" the Q series and what it's all about, so yes with no sarcasm in my response, just steer clear of the Q3.

Many of us who "get" the Q series probably like me started out with the original Q, then moved up to the Q2, and now have the Q3. One FACT that can't be disputed is that each new iteration is significantly better than its predecessor. And, at least for me, the Q3 exceeds everything I wanted of it before it was announced. Simply put, the Q3 is my go to camera, and I rarely take my Sony A7V anywhere - although next month I'm taking it on a photo trip to NZ.

Again, I strongly recommend you not get the Q3.

[Ko.Fe.]

Price of camera, plus price of second battery.

OP's Fiji and two GR costs the same... all together.

 

[SrMi]

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42 minutes ago, Ko.Fe. said:

Price of camera, plus price of second battery.

That is true for every modern Leica.

[Dezeinstein]

If the OP used one for a day, they would most likely change their minds and not put so much weight on online complaints.

My biggest complaint about the Q3: I want to buy one, and am on many waiting lists, but as time passes by I am losing my enthusiasm, and have started looking at other options.

 

[James1975]

16 minutes ago, Dezeinstein said:

and have started looking at other options.

What other options? The only viable ones are the Sigma without ibis and the A7CR (better AF, interchangeable lenses but everything else a bit shabbier). Or am I missing something. 
FWIW I was bitterly disappointed with my Q3 and sold it a month or two after launch. I just wish there were a viable alternative…

[Dezeinstein]

16 minutes ago, James1975 said:

What other options? The only viable ones are the Sigma without ibis and the A7CR (better AF, interchangeable lenses but everything else a bit shabbier). Or am I missing something. 
FWIW I was bitterly disappointed with my Q3 and sold it a month or two after launch. I just wish there were a viable alternative…

You are correct in that there is nothing else out there that compares exactly to the Q3, but there are other great cameras out there, just with different form factors, that can work for my personal photography needs and wants. Even considering a Hasselblad X2D, but obviously that is apples and oranges. And I probably won't want to drag that beast with me everywhere.

If the best camera is the one you have with you, then what does that make an unobtainable camera?

[James1975]

5 minutes ago, Dezeinstein said:

Even considering a Hasselblad X2D

A terrific camera. And with the new 28mm only maybe 300 grams heavier. But it doesn’t have any kind of AF. Which I still don’t understand. Images and aesthetics are sublime though. And the TB of internal storage is ace. 

Edited October 25, 2023 by James1975

[Dr. G]

22 hours ago, Olaf_ZG said:

To me, a valid reason not to buy it, is that one prefers the versatility of a M or SL instead.

Fair point.  For reference, I own the SL2-S with the following lenses:

35mm APO Summicron-SL

50mm APO Summicron-SL

75mm APO Summicron SL

50mm Summilux-SL

Voigtlander 15mm

Voigtlander 40mm f/1.2

Light Lens Lab 50mm Speed Panchro ii.

 

Lately I've been taking my Q3 out more than my SL2-S.  If I need a full kit, it's the Q3, SL2-S with the 15mm and the 75APO - but even then I'm mostly using the Q3..

Take from that what you will.

[SrMi]

2 hours ago, James1975 said:

A terrific camera. And with the new 28mm only maybe 300 grams heavier. But it doesn’t have any kind of AF. Which I still don’t understand. Images and aesthetics are sublime though. And the TB of internal storage is ace. 

I almost always use AF with the XCD 28p.

[James1975]

34 minutes ago, SrMi said:

I almost always use AF with the XCD 28p.

Forgive me. I meant to say continuous AF. 

[Ko.Fe.]

15 hours ago, SrMi said:

That is true for every modern Leica.

I came to photography with FED-2, which was modern it that time.

So, to me everything from 2005 and after is modern. My Leicas from 2015 and 2014 are not as expensive as Q3 and batteries are third party, not overpriced.

In the culture I originated from modern doesn't really mean new, latest one. 

[-MR-]

 

I have started this topic. As I wrote in my first post, I am sure that the Q3 is a great camera. I never wrote: "This and that is bad", I just collected the most common criticisms from forums and reviews and put them up for discussion. I don't have the camera and can't test it myself because it's out of stock everywhere and simply not for me to try. 

But possible flaws or problems, which are very often mentioned in forums and professional reviews, should not be ignored in a 6000 Euro camera. I don't mention the price because it is too expensive for me, but the fact is: this price is absolutely premium. 
It's not enough for me when people say: "It's so much fun to photograph with" or "The camera is something special" or "The camera is not for everyone" or "You have to understand the Leica-philosphy". That's pure transfiguration and glorification. 

Someone wrote: "I wouldn't touch one if I were you (to the OP). Complete waste of your time and money and far too big a risk. And I would avoid trying to cross the road as well: leave it to others to take the risk." 
This is of course insulting and nonsense.

When I repeatedly citing the price has nothing to do with the fact that I may not be able to afford a Q3 (I can). It has to do with putting performance and value in perspective. I know the Q3 is a luxury product. I understand this and the price philosophy. But then, everything has to work.

If people write: "Yes, there is a long shutter lag/blackout in the EVF but it doesn't bother me" that's OK, but you still have to state: "Yes, the camera has a longer than average blackout. And that is not good at first. Fact. Whether it bothers you or not is another question. The flaw is there. Fact."
If the EVF becomes blurry under certain conditions, you can also write, "That doesn't bother me." But still, the flaw is there. Fact. 

Its like: "Oh, no, our Porsche can only do 40km/h. But it doesnt bother me, its a Porsche, Porsche is so special, its so much fun to drive 40km/h ... and look how nice the engine sounds." 

In the end, even a Leica  is just a technical product that you have to evaluate (I emphasize the price again).


 

[M11 for me]

vor 13 Minuten schrieb -MR-:

Its like: "Oh, no, our Porsche can only do 40km/h. But it doesnt bother me, its a Porsche, Porsche is so special, its so much fun to drive 40km/h ... and look how nice the engine sounds." 

Oh, no. A Q3 does at least 250km/h. 

vor 16 Minuten schrieb -MR-:

I may not be able to afford a Q3 (I can)

But note that the money has gone then with the Q3. 

[Sparkassenkunde]

I don’t get it - what exactly is your problem? Wait until you have the chance to try the camera and see if the issues are real issues for you! I am out taking pictures, because this is what cameras are made for! And please stop insulting people who even love to make pictures with cameras full of flaws! Photography is more about capturing emotions than putting on lists of technical aspects. 

[-MR-]

@sparkassenkunde

I dont insult anyone. 

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica Q

[Qwertynm]

vor 16 Minuten schrieb -MR-:

you have to evaluate

Yes, exactly the crux of the matter. It’s not available for renting and many shops probably don’t have one to test out in store so you have to rely on online reviews, which are all biased. 
 

you get too hung up on the price and your expectations aren’t realistic. The Canon R5 had issues with locking up. We are now at firmware 1.9 and most gripes people had with the camera are kmproved (althought not all). The R5 was a 4k$ camera without lens. The Canon 1DXII had issues with oil on the sensor needing a clean, a 6k$+ camera without lens. The Hasselblad X2D is an 8k+ camera and has slow autofocus. You‘re looking for the Eierlegende Wollmilchsau and it comes across as if you want the Q3 to be that camera, which it is not. Whether you can live with its quirks or not you have to test out for yourself. 
 

the Q3 is a technical product that is not perfect in all aspects and not all these aspects bother everyone the same. If I were you, and you seem so unsure about the camera, I‘d wait and test one out yourself and decide then. There is no need to rush. Relax and drink some tea.