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To trade or not to trade......


Ktsa5239

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I traded one of my two M10s in for the M10-R. No regrets, other than the cost.

I also have an SL2. I agree with a previous poster that the M10-R is a nice complement to the SL2.

My first Leica, the M10 that I purchased in November 2017, was sent to Leica for a factory conversion to an M10-P. It was the first one done in the USA. This is the M10 that I still have and I reluctant to sell or trade it because it's my first Leica.

Since buying the M10-R two months ago, my M10-P sits on a shelf.

Regards,
Bud James

Please check out my fine art and travel photography at www.budjames.photography or on Instagram at www.instagram.com/budjamesphoto.

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I think any upgrade in equipment depends on how you use your images.  If enjoying posting them on the web, sharing them on smartphones etc. - I believe we are well beyond the point where image quality improvements are important.  However, if you make large prints, as I do, MP and other improvements (sensor size...) are noticeable and can improve the impact of the photograph - that is another story.  My Hasselblad H6D-100C allows large prints that are noticeably better than from my other cameras - at least to me and those that they are made for. And my short time borrowing a friend's M10R showed it to be very impressive indeed and outstanding for its size..

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Guest Nowhereman

Ktsa5239 - You haven't said anything about what your photography is like, so no one can judge whether you  would benefit from the higher resolution of the M10-R. I know that I don't need one: my images don't depend on resolution — and what I get from the M10 is enough. Some people who have the M10-R say that they like its greater dynamic range and its greater ability to lift shadows. My feeling is that the M10's shadow recovery is sufficiently large and I'm skeptical about the M10-R having more dynamic range: the data on the https://www.photonstophotos.net website indicates otherwise. There are also indications that the M10-R bands at higher ISOs more than the M10. Finally, I still prefer a 24 MP camera for its smaller files and for the advantages of  not having to shoot at higher shutter speeds than with the higher-MP M10-R, in order to keep sharpness.

I'm not trying to discourage you from buying the M10-R but am only pointing to the issues that more megapixel don't necessary mean better images and the need to determine whether our photography would benefit from that. Below are a few images that I've posted elsewhere recently, which I mean to show why, for this type of photography, I don't need the new camera.
 

M10 | Summaron-M 1:5.6/28 | ISO 200 | f/5.6 | 1/60sec | Chiang Mai

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M10 | Summaron-M5 1:5.6/28 | ISO 800 | f/5.6 | 1/350 sec | Bangkok

 

M9 | Elmarit-21 ASPH | ISO 640 | f/8.0 | 1/350 sec | Paris

 

M10 | DR Summicron 50 | ISO 400 | f/5.6 | 1/60 sec | Bangkok
________________________
Frog Leaping photobook

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Big prints can be made by stitching.  say 35 mm is the required lens, put two 50m images together.

My son made a fabulous pano from several M8 stitched.  

There is another way that has been around a long time which I tried a month ago with CS6.   Expand image by 10% and resample.  Just keep doing it as required.  Make an action so you just keep hitting the button.  I doubled the size of an M8 image, sharpened, and I can not tell it from original.

Use “Blend if” if you need to boost shadows some.

These are proven techniques.  So not I will not be buying an M10R.

 

 

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I took the plunge and got the m10R 

This could be just my brain justifing the big block of cash I’ve spent but I am amazed by the new sensor in comparison to my old M10. The shadow and highlight recovery is incredible. High iso also look cleaner. I’m so happy with it! Here is my favourite shot on the first day of having this camera

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3 hours ago, Ktsa5239 said:

I took the plunge and got the m10R 

This could be just my brain justifing the big block of cash I’ve spent but I am amazed by the new sensor in comparison to my old M10. The shadow and highlight recovery is incredible. High iso also look cleaner. I’m so happy with it! Here is my favourite shot on the first day of having this camera

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Very cinematic 

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  • 7 months later...

I have GAS symptoms as well towards the M10 R (black paint is arriving). But serious reviews stating that handheld shots at 1/15s or even 1/8s are much more difficult than with the M10. I do hate tripods and with my M10 P and with the M10 M longer shutterspeed handheld are no problem at all. What do you think?

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2 hours ago, zupfgeiger said:

I have GAS symptoms as well towards the M10 R (black paint is arriving). But serious reviews stating that handheld shots at 1/15s or even 1/8s are much more difficult than with the M10. I do hate tripods and with my M10 P and with the M10 M longer shutterspeed handheld are no problem at all. What do you think?

buy it! you need it! you deserve it!

 

is it working? Well if you have the M10M you already know what the M10R can do. I enjoy it over the M10-P. I am shooting often at night at 4000iso an always amazed how good it can be.

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3 hours ago, Photoworks said:

buy it! you need it! you deserve it!

 

is it working? Well if you have the M10M you already know what the M10R can do. I enjoy it over the M10-P. I am shooting often at night at 4000iso an always amazed how good it can be.

 

Buy it, you need it, you deserve it...Your irony is unmistakable. But then right after you seriously recommend the 40mp version?  Well, what's your point? Yes, I shoot with the M10 M, and it is a low light monster, but not due to 40mp but due to the missing bayer filter, which the M10 R has installed. I think that diminishing handshot capapilities with higher mp is a serious problem in Wetzlar. That's why the question IBIS or not seems to be so crucial for the new model. I think I will keep my M10 P for a while and wait what the M11 has to offer in November.

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30 minutes ago, zupfgeiger said:

Buy it, you need it, you deserve it...Your irony is unmistakable. But then right after you seriously recommend the 40mp version?  Well, what's your point? Yes, I shoot with the M10 M, and it is a low light monster, but not due to 40mp but due to the missing bayer filter, which the M10 R has installed. I think that diminishing handshot capapilities with higher mp is a serious problem in Wetzlar. That's why the question IBIS or not seems to be so crucial for the new model. I think I will keep my M10 P for a while and wait what the M11 has to offer in November.

I am just saying that if you are using 40MP on Monochrom , camera shake is going to be the same on the M10-R.  the higher resolution is going to emphasize you technique of holding steady , not the color or b&w. the 24MP camera has the same shake, but less visible.
This has been studied and reproduced in many camera brands.

The sensor of the M10-R is amazing. the M10M sensor is probably the best B&W sensor out there.

I don't think the M11 is going to have IBIS, but only leica is going to confirm it.

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On 12/2/2020 at 4:01 AM, Ktsa5239 said:

I took the plunge and got the m10R 

This could be just my brain justifing the big block of cash I’ve spent but I am amazed by the new sensor in comparison to my old M10. The shadow and highlight recovery is incredible. High iso also look cleaner. I’m so happy with it! Here is my favourite shot on the first day of having this camera

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Yes... Despite what anyone might say + increased resolution is awesome for cropping etc. And the increase in dynamic range is 1-2 stops over an m10r.  Shadow recovery brings old m lenses to life.  The m10r is a great upgrade.  

If someone is happy with their m10r - great.  But technology moves on... That is a fact. 

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Let’s see - M10 -> M10-P -> M10-M -> M10-R -> ?  My guess is something like this M11 -> M11-P -> ? Each with its own improvement, and absolute necessity MP, dynamic range and, what … black paint?

I’m not knocking improvements.  Far from it.  When my M9 based Monochrom finally dies, I will get a replacement if I can afford it.  If feeding your hobby, or should that be habit, gives you pleasure go for it, but don’t justify it.  My camera equipment has never been a limitation to my photography, other than having too much of it!

Here’s a thought - dream and lust after the M11.  It will be better than the M10-R.  Then wait for the cosmetic and other improvements in the M11-P, and perhaps the M11-R, or even better the M11-M … rinse and repeat.

In the meantime, enjoy the fabulous camera you have.  It is fabulous, right?

Then just go and buy whatever you like 😎

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Are you ok with not having any funds and not be able to travel anywhere if you make this purchase now?
I’m exploring some parts of SE Asia and loving it much more than any new gear. My “meager” M10 is ok for now until I can get the next model when I can afford it sometime in the future.

Think about what it is you are really after 🙂

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