Sensor resolution in next Leica M

[o2mpx]

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Is there still opportunity for smaller pixels to get above 60mp in the next Leica M?

Edited October 5, 2024 by o2mpx

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[THEME]

Not for me. 60MP is more than enough, even with cropping. Otherwise, there's medium-format.

ISO 100'000? I'd take it, but again: no need. Some of my best photographs are not the borderline-sterile clean ones, but the one's from the film days, pushed Ilford, with noise.

[darylgo]

There's room for greater dynamic range, I don't know where Mp will go next.  

[01af]

The first digital cameras with 24 MP arrived in 2008 (Nikon D3X and Sony A900). After that, 24 MP was the standard resolution for most new digital cameras for about one decade, with only a few outliers. I guess it's going to be the same with the current 60-MP class of sensors. Probably no increase from there for a couple of years ... maybe another decade.

[hdmesa]

13 hours ago, o2mpx said:

Is there still opportunity for smaller pixels to get above 60mp in the next Leica M?

The current pixel density is about where it needs to be to provide high resolution while reducing the chance of aliasing/moire without resorting to an AA filter on the sensor. More likely we will see stacked or partially stacked sensor for the next M.

[Jon Warwick]

I think Sony announced an approx 250mp sensor in medium format size, the IMX811-AAQR??, …..who knows if it will ever flip to the consumer side, but it would hypothetically equate in full frame to c 100mp? 

Edited October 5, 2024 by Jon Warwick

[CDodkin]

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What ever Sony's next sensor has.. Leica don't make their own, they now use Sony

[3D-Kraft.com]

I also do not expect a big step upwards in the next generation. Increasing dynamic range and decreasing read-out time seem to have priority and that's good.

[250swb]

Some people must have a lot of very large bare walls in their cathedral sized houses if they need more than 60mp prints to fill them. It is true that after 24mp there were far fewer photographers claiming they need more megapixels and perhaps there is the realisation that increased dynamic range is often beyond the range of the human eye and makes for weirdly flat images. Either way the next revolution should be about judgment and ditching what you don't genuinely need and not being discontent with what you've got. Pretty soon there won't be any conventional cameras as we know them left given all this technology you say you need eventually ends up in iPhones.

[JNK100]

On 10/5/2024 at 2:57 AM, o2mpx said:

Is there still opportunity for smaller pixels to get above 60mp in the next Leica M?

What resolution do you require and why out of interest?

Jeff

[SiggiGun]

If you don't want to make wallpapers or advertising posters, 18M or 36M are perfectly sufficient. But the question arises differently: let's assume that the “M12” (if that's what it's called) will be launched in 2027. From today's perspective, LEICA needs two years to technically tune a sensor (control, color character, etc.). So it will probably be a sensor that will be on the market in 2025. Since LEICA rarely changes everything in a camera, and since the current demand is more in the direction of EVF and image stabilization, I could imagine that the next generation will also be equipped with the current Q3, SL3 and M11 sensor.

[jankap]

But perhaps there is another direction the camera technology can go. The interest is to produce products, that suggest the customers will need them. Turn-over is the drive, the influencers should do their job.

[lct]

Most people don't want to print posters, they want to crop while keeping sharpness and for that they need high res sensors.

[setuporg]

9 hours ago, Quarterpounder said:

I thought Leica's sensors are made on some old machines in Wetzlar, salvaged from the now defunct Solms factory?

Actually, the original Leica sensors are made on so called “Barnacles,” the artisanal wafer-cutters that Herr Barnack used to whet himself with kartoffel!

[Robert Blanko]

Yo, the natural limitation in minimum pixel size is due to smallest size that you can achieve with high quality German potato printing of the semiconductor circuitry design - no EUV or XUV masks.
 

And on top of that, I do not see the point of having such small pixel sizes that make you think about the diffraction limit.

[costa43]

Two potential outcomes based on current tech imo. M12 with current sensor but optimised (marketing talk) or a little lower resolution but much faster readout speed negating the need for a mechanical shutter, freeing up space for ibis or something else. 

I don’t think they will reduce the resolution as they rely too heavily on existing users of the current flagship to upgrade and resolution is a key buying decision for many, even if they don’t need it.

Of course there is always the 3rd option not based on current tech and it’s something being designed bespoke that we do not know about.

[swatch]

Many of us don’t know we need smartphone until Steve Jobs put one on the table, therefore whatever improvement in M12 is welcome.

[lct]

Leica will do their best to cram IBIS in the same package as the M11 i guess so i would not expect anything bigger, besides more speed and more resolution for the Visoflex.

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Hallo,

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[Herr Barnack]

On 10/6/2024 at 5:36 AM, 250swb said:

 ...Either way the next revolution should be about judgment and ditching what you don't genuinely need and not being discontent with what you've got. Pretty soon there won't be any conventional cameras as we know them left given all this technology you say you need eventually ends up in iPhones.

I am holding out for a half billion mp iPhone in 8x10 inch format.

[SrMi]

On 10/5/2024 at 4:27 AM, THEME said:

Not for me. 60MP is more than enough, even with cropping. Otherwise, there's medium-format.

ISO 100'000? I'd take it, but again: no need. Some of my best photographs are not the borderline-sterile clean ones, but the one's from the film days, pushed Ilford, with noise.

You can shoot now with ISO 100k: expose with ISO 50k and set -1 EC.