Leica Glass R System

[as.photoportfolio]

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Are Leica R mounts good lenses? Does it have good performance if applied to an M body? Why are they cheaper than the M mount? Thanks

[TomB_tx]

Leica R lenses were very good for the time they were made. and many equal to the M lenses of the same era. Leica abandoned the R camera and lens lines, sold off all their stock as well as repair parts rather than develop and market digital versions of the cameras (other than the digital back available for the R8 & R9). They felt autofocus would have been necessary and they were well behind the competition who already had the products and mass market share. An economic business decision. They did introduce the larger format digital S cameras and lenses for the higher-priced professional market - with low sales volume.

There are R to M mount adapters to fit R lenses to M bodies, but they do not activate the Rangefinder for focusing. The M10-11 can use them with the adapters and focus with live view, but the R lenses are a LOT bigger and heavier than the equivalent M lenses. 

So R lenses were orphans, and prices dropped quite low in the early years of the 21 century. Since then  prices have climbed as mirrorless cameras and adapters for the lenses came out, and they began to be used for video work. Leica finally came out with their promised "digital solution" for the R lenses with the SL cameras with R adapters. But the adapters do not allow use of the automatic diaphragms, so it's not a complete solution. (Leica would rather sell new L mount lenses for them.) I have used some of my R lenses adapted to Sony A7 with good results, but still all manual aperture and focus. (I prefer manual focus anyway, but would like automatic diaphragm operation.)

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[LeicaR10]

as.photoportfolio,  First, welcome to the forum.  You may have already received sage advice to your previous posts as there are many Leica photographers with years of experience that are willing to help you.  Second, TomB_ex is spot on in his above post.  My experience using R lenses with the M and SL systems go back since the deminse of the R system.  I can say there are many excellent R lenses out there that are capable of producing superb photographs.  Based on my experience, I can say the R lenses work quite well on M cameras, but even better on the SL cameras.  The R lenses initially lost value when Leica stopped producing the R system.  When the adapters for the M cameras and certainly with the creation of the SL system, the R lenses found new life and value steadily increased over the years.  The key for R lenses is looking mint used lenses, i.e. no haze, fungus, excessive dust, decentered, etc..  The lenses can still be serviced by various third party repair technicians such as Don Goldberg at DAG.  My final key point, having a mint R lens is often better in some respects due to they way the lenses render.  If you are interested, check out these two links that will take you to a site where you can see how different Leica R mount lenses render.  You need to look at the nominclature, for the photograph that will state the camera used with that focal length.  This site is quite useful.  The other link, takes to the camera section where you can look at photographs taken with different M cameras and various lenses.  The Leica R lenses that are ROM are the last R system lenses that have the ability to transmit some EXIF data from the lens to cameras such as the SL system  Last, the good news, you have choices. This should help.  r/ Mark

Try:  https://onfotolife.com/lenses?lens=Leica

Try:  https://onfotolife.com/cameras?type=mirrorless&camera=Leica

Edited September 10, 2023 by LeicaR10

[Hans-Dieter Gülicher]

10 years ago I have sold all my R-equipment after a total crash of my R9/DMR exepted the Vario-R 21-35 mm. Later it functioned well with my Fuji xPro1 and today with my M 10-R.

[Stuart Richardson]

The last Leica R lenses to be introduced were put out around 2002-2005, so the technology level kind of stopped there. But as said above, they were as good or better than lenses of the same generation, for the most part. There are isolated cases where the Leica R version is better, and where the M version is better. They are less expensive because the R is not still in production, and the SLR cameras never had the mystique of the M cameras for most users. In my opinion, it does not make any sense to use them on an M body, particularly if you do not have them already. If you are looking to save a bit of money, there are other M mount lenses made by Voigtlander and Zeiss/Voigtlander among others that are superb lenses and will do the job very well.

[dkCambridgeshire]

On 9/10/2023 at 12:47 AM, as.photoportfolio said:

Are Leica R mounts good lenses? Does it have good performance if applied to an M body? Why are they cheaper than the M mount? Thanks

You might consider acquiring a copy of the "LEICA POCKET BOOK 9th EDITION" which documents nearly all Leica lenses designed / manufactured from c.1925 including all the R system's optics from c.1964 and their performance characteristics. Some R lenses' optics are almost exactly the same as their M equivalents.

https://www.reddotcameras.co.uk/books/18910-leica-pocket-book-9th-edition.html

No Leica R lenses are M rangefinder coupled.

Some Leica R lenses, e.g., the 19mm, are very sought after by videographers and cine photographers – hence command premium s/h prices. 

Bear in mind that lens performance is based on more than just image sharpness.  

[hepcat]

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On 9/14/2023 at 5:14 AM, dkCambridgeshire said:

No Leica R lenses are M rangefinder coupled.

I have a really nice set of R lenses that I use on my Leicaflex and R film bodies (R5 and R6.2.)  I use them primarily on my L mount bodies, a Lumix S1 and Lumix S5 with adapters, as fully manual lenses.   They can, in fact, be adapted to M bodies, but as @dkCambridgeshire noted they cannot be rangefinder coupled.  Unless you plan on using a digital M body with live view or a digital Visoflex, R lenses don't make a lot of sense for regular use on an M body.  They're also physically much larger than their M mount versions.    All that said, they are absolutely the equal of any other lens out there, 

[JMF]

Some 50mm R lenses can be permanently adapted to M mount with RF coupling :

https://www.instagram.com/p/CMxwhg8ntui/?igshid=MzRlODBiNWFlZA==

50 R Summilux e55 on M10-P:

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Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

Or one can change the R mount to a Leitax Nikon F mount on 50mm R lenses and use a recent RF coupled Nikon F to Leica M Shoten adapter !

They are larger than their M counterparts but wide open , the R lenses offer better sharpness corner to corner ... whether that matters is another story !

Best

JM

Edited September 23, 2023 by JMF

[Camaro5]

I have a Summicron-R (Ver. I) 50/2 from 1974 that I used on my R4S Model II.  I used on my M's when I had them, and now use it on my SL2-S, and it works just fine.  Images are really very good and have a vintage kind of look.  They're very sharp and clear but don't have the biting contrast of more modern lenses.  

The Elmarit-R 24/2.8 that I just got is from 1985 and has a more modern look.  Colors are more vibrant and it has a little more contrast.  The one I got was $1200, but essentially brand new in the box.  I have seen them for as much as $2000 or more and not in this kind of condition.  

If you don't mind manual focusing and manual exposure, these are still fine lenses IF you can find a good one at a decent price and in good condition.  Mine won't replace my SL lenses, especially the 35 APO, but they do have their place if you like that kind of look.  

[davidmknoble]

The APO R lenses are pretty stellar even for today.  The APO 90 summicron, APO 100 2.8, the APO 180 2.8 and APO 280 4.0 are incredible.  Many of the other lenses are still very good, but the later APO series has very high contrast wide open.

I also think the 28mm f/2.8. V2 is strong as is the 90 Elmarit 2.8 (same as M) and the APO 70-180 f/2.8 zoom.  A great travel zoom is the 80-200 f/4.  

The second to last generation (many version 2 lenses) may not be perfect wide open, but are very strong 2 stops from wide open.

They are bigger and with an adapter can be less desirable than a compact M system and the new SL APO primes are just crazy sharp.  But all come at a cost.  I shoot R lenses quite a bit on the SL and print 13x19 with zero issue and no AI upsizing.

[RexGig0]

I have really enjoyed using an Elmarit-R 28mm lens, with a Novoflex LEM/LER adapter, on an M Type 246 Monochrome camera. I distance/scale focused, also known as “zone focusing, using the distance and DOF markings on the lens. The chief disadvantage was the quite large overall size of this combination blocking much of the viewfinder. The hood, necessary to hold the orange-colored filter in place, further blocs the viewfinder. 

As has already been mentioned, the better-regarded Leica R lenses have caught the attention of videographers and cinematographers, driving the prices upward. The R lenses that are not in such high demand can be a good way to try a new focal length relatively inexpensively, which is exactly why I acquired 28mm and 35mm Elmarit-R lenses. Now that I have Leica and Zeiss M-mount lenses in these focal lengths, I might sell my R lenses. (Or, I may keep them, for a while. They do not eat much.)

Skyllaney, in the UK, has done conversions of some R lenses, to range-finder-coupled M mount. I have only done a few mundane test shots, thus far, but I have one of these, a Leica-R 50mm Summicron, the less-sought-after older version, so, I did not pay a fortune for it. Not the sharpest tool in the shed, when wide-open, it is more of a conversation piece than anything, but may become useful for some vintage/dreamy images. 

Edited October 7, 2023 by RexGig0
Fixed punctuation/grammar errors.

[JMF]

I am a big fan of the 28 Elmarit R v2 !

Here a couple of shots taken with the SL 601:

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Best, JM.

[skueh]

On 10/7/2023 at 4:04 PM, JMF said:

I am a big fan of the 28 Elmarit R v2 !

Here a couple of shots taken with the SL 601:

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

 

 

 

Best, JM.

Another vote for the 28 Elmarit R V2. The 90 Cron Asph R and the 180/2.8 Apo-Tely-R V2 are outstanding too, not to mention the legendary 35-70/2.8 Vario-Elmar R Asph.

Edited October 12, 2023 by skueh
Typo error.

[hamey]

I kept my R lenses as I simply couldn't part with them, I was very angry when Leica discontinued the R system, I tried the M240 with my R lenses but it was hopeless, Simply a waste of time and money.

After reading so much positive comments about R lenses attached to the SL system, I relented and bought the SL2s reportage with the Leica R to L mount adapter, the Results blow me away, I am getting better results from the SL2-s then I ever got from my R  bodies, I love the SL system so much that I had to buy another SL2-s Also this time with the 24-70mm f2.8, If you have any R lenses, get yourself into the SL system with Leica's R to L adapter you won't be sorry.

It's ironic, my first Leica was the Leicaflex SL back in 1973, it was discontinued after the SL2 and the R system was introduced, now after 40 + years the R System got the chop

And the SL system has been re-introduced.

Leica R lenses are not GOOD LENSES, they are terrific lenses, need I say more.

 Ken.

Edited October 13, 2023 by hamey

[OR120]

4 hours ago, hamey said:

I kept my R lenses as I simply couldn't part with them, I was very angry when Leica discontinued the R system, I tried the M240 with my R lenses but it was hopeless, Simply a waste of time and money.

After reading so much positive comments about R lenses attached to the SL system, I relented and bought the SL2s reportage with the Leica R to L mount adapter, the Results blow me away, I am getting better results from the SL2-s then I ever got from my R  bodies, I love the SL system so much that I had to buy another SL2-s Also this time with the 24-70mm f2.8, If you have any R lenses, get yourself into the SL system with Leica's R to L adapter you won't be sorry.

It's ironic, my first Leica was the Leicaflex SL back in 1973, it was discontinued after the SL2 and the R system was introduced, now after 40 + years the R System got the chop

And the SL system has been re-introduced.

Leica R lenses are not GOOD LENSES, they are terrific lenses, need I say more.

 Ken.

My feelings exactly. Love the R glass. I too had a Leicaflex SL > SL2 to SL2 Mot. The Mot was a machine gun and sounded like one. Loved the camera body - not the motor. My SL2-S reminds me of my old Leicaflex SL2. Now using my SL2-S body with all my old lenses (Leica R, M, Zeiss and Nikon). Most happy with 80 R and 50 R (E60) Summilux lenses. 

[davidmknoble]

There is no question that some of the R lenses will resolve well even with the SL-2 and the hi-resolution sensor.  I am excited that we may get another hi-resolution SL body with a better dynamic range.  The SL2-S is a great travel camera with a second body (of any type, M film, M digital, S, another SL, R film body, etc).  Certainly a good time to keep watching for good used R glass if you have none, and keep it if you already have it!

[spydrxx]

When I sold my R bodies, I got rid of most of my R lenses, except two, which I used for a couple of more years on a Sigma body which I had replaced the mount with a Leitax mount. I was very pleased with how they performed on a digital SLR, especially one with a Foveon sensor. The colors were outstanding. But using them on any but the most recent M bodies, which have live view just doesn't make sense. The SL-2, which I don't have, seems to be an ideal solution for using these wonderful old lenses.

[rubidium]

I have an extensive collection (or should I more rightfully say investment) of R lenses, including some of the later APOs, like the magnificent APO 100 2.8 Macro and APO 280 4.0. Up until recently I coped with the various quirks and lack of support of the ill-fated DMR on an R9 body. After my DMR completely gave up I was fortunate to find a second-hand SL2 in truly mint condition for a great price. I got the R-to-L adapter and these lenses are now enjoying their second lives. Granted the camera can't control the aperture and only MF is possible, but those R lenses are giving me great photos once again.