Magenta border produced with my M10

[Umfundisi]

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When attaching a Voigtländer Super Wide-Heliar 4,5/15mm (Type II) to my M10 I find that I get an ugly magenta border on the right of my frames. I cannot replicate this problem on my Nikon Z7 - See sample images below.

Is this a known M10 problem associated with the use of wideangle lenses? Or am I dealing with a damaged sensor - which I doubt, because images made with a current Elmarit-M 2,8/28mm are completely faultless.

Any ideas kicking around?

Beim Bestücken einer M10 mit dem Voigtländer Super Wide-Heliar 4,5/15mm (Typ II) taucht am rechten Bildrand ein hässlicher magentafarbener Streifen auf, den ich bei Vergleichen mit meiner Z7 nicht feststellen kann - siehe Bildvergleich.

Ist dies ein bekanntes M10-Problem bei Verwendung von sehr kurzen Brennweiten? Oder ein Defekt im Sensor - was ich mir kaum vorstellen kann, da zB mit dem aktuellen Elmarit-M 2,8/28mm alles komplett fehlerfrei aussieht ...

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Edited May 21, 2023 by Umfundisi
Wrong forum language

[BastianK]

This is typical for the M10 and a problem with its sensor design.
Many wide angle lenses (especially those designed for film) show this issue.

I described here a few methods how you can fix it in post:
https://phillipreeve.net/blog/how-to-correcting-color-cast-in-lightroom/

If you don't want to do that some newer (and much bigger) lenses don't show that issue,
e,g, the Voigtländer VM 15mm 4.5 MK III or the Laowa 15mm 2.0.

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[Umfundisi]

Bastian, thanks for pitching in with some clarification and a fix to the problem. I will try this out asap.

Best wishes, Umfundisi

[pop]

This is a problem which has plagued digital M Leicas from the beginning. The M lenses are very close to the sensor. The light strikes the sensor in the corners at a very flat angle, but the sensor with the colour filter array expects the light to  arrive from the front.

Leica kind of solved that problem by compensating for the colour shift in-camera. Since this has done differently for each lens, the camera needs to know what lens is mounted. The 6-bit code in the lens mount is used for that. It tells the camera the type of the lens.

As your lens is not made by Leica, it has no 6 bit code. You can tell your camera what kind of lens you mounted by manually entering the type in the camera's menu. Choose a Leica lens from that menu which is as similar as possible to your Voigtländer lens. You can try different settings (preferably with the same subject) or you can try and find which settings other people use for this lens.

This article, for instance, recommends setting the camera to Elmarit-M1:2.8/21 (11134).

[250swb]

I believe the 15mm Heliar II mount is one of the lenses that has a shallow rebate machined into the face which is designed to be used for coding the lens. You need a code that works, which you can ascertain by experimenting, and make a coding template, use matt black hobby paint (Tamiya, etc.) and a fine brush. Only the black positions need to be filled in the rebate.

[rich_]

I used to have this same issue with that lens and the m240 when it was released. Shot mostly in b&w. The V3 didn’t have this problem but by then my itch had been scratched! 

 

[Umfundisi]

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Thanks for your Input, everybody.

I have tried using the built-in Profile for the Elmarit-M 21mm but have found that this does indeed remove most of the olour cast, but then messes with distortion removal etc. I think I'll give this idea a miss because I would rather be in control myself of any alterations made to my DNGs. 

Bastian's suggestions seem to offer me the best chance of coming to grips with the problem. Using Lightroom's flat-field correction only for the removal of colour cast and then applying LR's lens profiles with a bit of caution gives me results that I think I can live with.

Pity though that I should have to bother with corrections in post when using the M10 in the first place when my Z7 delivers colour-cast free images out of the box. Does anyone know if these problems persist in the M11?

[Kiran]

59 minutes ago, Umfundisi said:

Thanks for your Input, everybody.

I have tried using the built-in Profile for the Elmarit-M 21mm but have found that this does indeed remove most of the olour cast, but then messes with distortion removal etc. I think I'll give this idea a miss because I would rather be in control myself of any alterations made to my DNGs. 

Bastian's suggestions seem to offer me the best chance of coming to grips with the problem. Using Lightroom's flat-field correction only for the removal of colour cast and then applying LR's lens profiles with a bit of caution gives me results that I think I can live with.

Pity though that I should have to bother with corrections in post when using the M10 in the first place when my Z7 delivers colour-cast free images out of the box. Does anyone know if these problems persist in the M11?

If you are able to use Capture One, it has the ability to create an LCC correction for exactly the symptoms you have described.
I have created settings for each aperture on my lens and it completely removes all colour casts and vignetting perfectly. 

[35photo]

Are you using a UV filter on the lens? If so remove it and try the image again see if your still getting it? Lens profile you are using? 

[Umfundisi]

As far as I can see the removal of any filters makes no difference to the result. The camera settings are set to NO PROFILE, simply because there is no custrom profile available for this lens. As I mentioned above, using the 21mm preset removes some of the colour cast but also makes changes to the distortion of the image. I will not use it.

Edited May 25, 2023 by Umfundisi
Spelling correction

[BastianK]

Am 22.5.2023 um 23:13 schrieb Umfundisi:

Does anyone know if these problems persist in the M11?

In terms of color cast the M11 performs on a level similar to your Nikon camera.

Stay away from the M10r though, it is worse than what you have.