Vintage style: Voigtländer Nokton 1.5/50 ii VM Bicolor

[jaapv]

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Quite by chance ( well, not quite)  I bought one of these lenses. I was very pleasantly surprised. Not only does it look made for my MM1, mechanical quality is outstanding.

 

 

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Sorry, iPhone shot....

 

[jaapv]

Trying it, there is nothing to be said against the optical quality:

 

 

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[jaapv]

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[jaapv]

A grey day..

 

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[jaapv]

My conclusion: more than 95% of the Summilux 50 asph, light, compact and looks fantastic. And a large amount of money saved. A definite keeper.

[hepcat]

When I was still shooting my M8 and M9P, 2/3 of my glass was Voigtlander.  It's a great value for excellent build quality and really superb performance.

[Chris Nebard]

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Flávio Bosi (47-Degree website) tests 10 fast 50mm lenses in one of the most comprehensive comparisons I’ve read. The 50mm f1.5 vmii is his personal choice. He rates the 50mm f1.2 Nokton very highly as well. It seems it’s no longer the case that Voigtländers are only great lenses “for the money”.  Recent versions are great lenses, full stop; and, in choosing one, you are no longer going for something that’s almost as good at a much cheaper price.
 

Value for money is obvious, but optical equality is a genuine reason to go for them. As an SL2-s user (who still loves to use smaller primes) I feel spoiled by the options available from Sigma (autofocus) and Voigtländer (manual focus via the excellent M-L adapter).

I love Leica lenses - I still own a couple - but it’s increasingly difficult for me to justify buying them when the amazing SL2-s is so flexible in accommodating small, light, third party lenses that are born to be used on them - and which provide outstanding results. I’ve no doubt at all that this 50mm f1.5 vmii is no exception. 

 

Edited December 2, 2022 by Chris Nebard

[jaapv]

In fact, I think that I prefer the rendering of the Nokton to the Summilux 50 asph I used to own. I think it can give more of a 3D look, see the shot of fence above.  Disclaimer: I used it on the MM1 only and the weather has still to clear. I'll see what is does on my colour cameras later.

[Huss]

It took me a moment to figure out the bicolor is the nickel finish version! I have that lens in single coat version.  I added a lenstab focus ring which I prefer over the serrated ring.

A very nice lens!

 

 

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[hmzimelka]

Its a very nice lens but mine is for sale for the following very subjective and arguably trivial reasons...

1) Vignetting at f/1.5. Too much for me.
2) Pincushion Distortion. My summicron has none and I don't like pincushion distortion. 
3) Feels wider than I like from a 50mm. Noticeable wider than my Summicron 50mm V, but a bit narrower than my Planar.
4) Mid zone dip, while small, is there. I prefer an even sharpness falloff from the centre to edge rather than sharp, soft and then sharp at the edges again. This has more to do with the subject matter I shoot.
5) Chromatic aberration at the point of focus is not as well corrected as the Summicron 50mm V. Has more purple fringing than I like.
6) 43mm filter thread. Like the Planar, it's annoying.
7) Aperture tab wings are not practical and slightly fiddly. 

What I like; 
1) Definitely sharper across the frame on the M11 than any of the 3 Summilux 50mm lenses I've tried so far, especially in the mid zone. Exception to the centre at wide open where the Summilux is still a little better for sharpness and CA control.
2) Price to performance value is excellent.
4) The background rendering can be buttery and very attractive, especially for B&W. 
5) Little focus shift apposed to the Planar 50mm and the Summicron 50mm V.
6) While light, it's built well.

 

I'm not sure why I'm keeping my Planar 50mm... I probably would use it less than the Nokton 50/1.5 ASPH and certainly not built as well.
I may decide to recall my decision and get my Nokton back from South Africa, but for now my Summicron 50mm V checks all my boxes for a 50mm lens. 

[Cobram]

16 hours ago, jaapv said:

Trying it, there is nothing to be said against the optical quality:

 

 

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Thorens and vinyl... great!

[jaapv]

5 hours ago, hmzimelka said:

Its a very nice lens but mine is for sale for the following very subjective and arguably trivial reasons...

1) Vignetting at f/1.5. Too much for me.
2) Pincushion Distortion. My summicron has none and I don't like pincushion distortion. 
3) Feels wider than I like from a 50mm. Noticeable wider than my Summicron 50mm V, but a bit narrower than my Planar.
4) Mid zone dip, while small, is there. I prefer an even sharpness falloff from the centre to edge rather than sharp, soft and then sharp at the edges again. This has more to do with the subject matter I shoot.
5) Chromatic aberration at the point of focus is not as well corrected as the Summicron 50mm V. Has more purple fringing than I like.
6) 43mm filter thread. Like the Planar, it's annoying.
7) Aperture tab wings are not practical and slightly fiddly. 

What I like; 
1) Definitely sharper across the frame on the M11 than any of the 3 Summilux 50mm lenses I've tried so far, especially in the mid zone. Exception to the centre at wide open where the Summilux is still a little better for sharpness and CA control.
2) Price to performance value is excellent.
4) The background rendering can be buttery and very attractive, especially for B&W. 
5) Little focus shift apposed to the Planar 50mm and the Summicron 50mm V.
6) While light, it's built well.

 

I'm not sure why I'm keeping my Planar 50mm... I probably would use it less than the Nokton 50/1.5 ASPH and certainly not built as well.
I may decide to recall my decision and get my Nokton back from South Africa, but for now my Summicron 50mm V checks all my boxes for a 50mm lens. 

Interesting. I don’t disagree with your negative points but I am of the school that doesn’t look at lens performance per se but has a more holistic view. A photograph is 50% taking it and 50% finishing it.
All these points but the “wavy” sharpness disappear with two minutes of postprocessing and even the midzone dip will be all but invisible with AI sharpening programs. What remains is the inherent quality of the lens and its character. 
Not that these examples were heavily processed. Just the normal MM1 tonal corrections and Topaz Photo AI to take the digital look out. That is standard for me. A Summilux image would need the same finish. 

[rramesh]

19 hours ago, jaapv said:

My conclusion: more than 95% of the Summilux 50 asph, light, compact and looks fantastic. And a large amount of money saved. A definite keeper.

Typical of most of the newer Voigtlanders these days - 28 f/2, 35 f/2, 50 f/1 and with good impressions of the new 35 f/1.5. And 1/4-1/5 the price of an equivalent Leica and with 95% the performance. Leica seems to be becoming more and more a lens for collectors. 

Edited December 3, 2022 by rramesh

[hmzimelka]

1 hour ago, jaapv said:

Interesting. I don’t disagree with your negative points but I am of the school that doesn’t look at lens performance per se but has a more holistic view. A photograph is 50% taking it and 50% finishing it.
All these points but the “wavy” sharpness disappear with two minutes of postprocessing and even the midzone dip will be all but invisible with AI sharpening programs. What remains is the inherent quality of the lens and its character. 
Not that these examples were heavily processed. Just the normal MM1 tonal corrections and Topaz Photo AI to take the digital look out. That is standard for me. A Summilux image would need the same finish. 

Just for context; Wavy sharpness transitions are annoying (to me), especially if one has to shoot at wider apertures on planar subjects that are further away. Nature and landscapes subjects tend to be like this often.

A gentle fall off of contrast and detail from the centre is easier to work with so to speak.  I also tend to like strong straight lines in images given the chance, so distortion is something I'm aware of. I tend to be a horizon in the centre guy, or somewhere at the extremes. Lens corrections are things I tend to stay away from, which probably stems from Lightroom's earlier days when lens corrections often made things worse than better, given that these were based off one lens sample and applied universally... and we know samples can vary.

But these comments above are all about my preferences whose subjects are landscapes and nature shots the vast majority of the time. I can't take a portrait nor street photography to save my life, but I imagine my priorities would be very different if I did... I probably also fall well outside the circle of a typical M shooter. So I'm definitely the odd one out, which I don't mid admitting to 😂 

The Summicron 50mm M V is one of the few Leica lenses I really, really, really like. Even if it lags behind some other lenses, some of its attributes are of high value to me, enough to justify the Leica premium. Maybe I should have made my sentence bold that states, "arguably trivial reasons" 😁 Nitpicking at its finest. It's also why I love the "crappy" plastic AF-D Nikkor 50mm f/1.8.

The Nokton 50/1.5 is a very good lens that I only appreciated more once I tried those Summilux 50 APSH lenses. And this Nickel and black version is a good looking lens too.

 

[jaapv]

I would not call your comments trivial; we all choose lenses to our style.  I would argue, though, that the negatives you mention are not really important to most of us, especially if they can easily be corrected. For instance purple fringing is especially common on fast and high edge-contrast lenses and often occurs with the very best ones. A complicated phenomenon too… The (apo!) Summilux asph suffers quite a bit too. Fortunately the phenomenon is easily removed by the defringe slider. I must confess that I do not  use an M for landscape that often  I prefer a camera that offers simple focus stacking, like the Panasonics. Solves your irregular sharpness problem too 😉

[Huss]

9 hours ago, rramesh said:

Typical of most of the newer Voigtlanders these days - 28 f/2, 35 f/2, 50 f/1 and with good impressions of the new 35 f/1.5. And 1/4-1/5 the price of an equivalent Leica and with 95% the performance. Leica seems to be becoming more and more a lens for collectors. 

I would disagree that Leica lenses are more for collectors.  It seems in this day and age it is easy to make lenses that are 90-95% of what Leica can do due to CAD/CAM, but it is that last 5-10% that is so hard. That is the case of diminishing returns - every little bit extra at that point is so much more expensive.

Whether that is worth it is up to you. I use Leica and non Leica lenses, and I like both.  But you can see where the money comes into play. The Leica 50 Apo is super expensive but tiny. Voigtlander’s 50 apo equivalent is much cheaper, but much larger.  The Leica 35 FLE is expensive and small.  The Zeiss Distagon 35 1.4 is superb optically but ridiculously big.  And the list goes on.

Edited December 3, 2022 by Huss

[jaapv]

But the Nokton is lighter and smaller than the Summilux asph at - I cautiously said 95% but dare I mean 98% ? -  of the quality.

[rramesh]

4 hours ago, Huss said:

I would disagree that Leica lenses are more for collectors.  It seems in this day and age it is easy to make lenses that are 90-95% of what Leica can do due to CAD/CAM, but it is that last 5-10% that is so hard. That is the case of diminishing returns - every little bit extra at that point is so much more expensive.

Whether that is worth it is up to you. I use Leica and non Leica lenses, and I like both.  But you can see where the money comes into play. The Leica 50 Apo is super expensive but tiny. Voigtlander’s 50 apo equivalent is much cheaper, but much larger.  The Leica 35 FLE is expensive and small.  The Zeiss Distagon 35 1.4 is superb optically but ridiculously big.  And the list goes on.

 

And now we have the Voigtlander 35 f/1.5. Same size as the Summicron 35, performance equivalent to the Distagon, price 1/5 of the FLE, smaller than the FLE and in some regards just as good, and black paint over brass to boot.

Edited December 4, 2022 by rramesh

[jaapv]

I agree, they seem to be on a roll. The lens quality is more than excellent - nothing new there, Sean Reid praised the Heliar 75 as as good as Leica many years ago, but they appear to have their QC, which used to be a bit hit and miss in the past, under control. 

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[Huss]

4 hours ago, rramesh said:

 

And now we have the Voigtlander 35 f/1.5. Same size as the Summicron 35, performance equivalent to the Distagon, price 1/5 of the FLE, smaller than the FLE and in some regards just as good, and black paint over brass to boot.

Yes, No, Yes, Yes, No, Yes.