I SOLD my Leica M11 …… & Why

[a.noctilux]

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Strange (?) situation ...happy ending.

To the OP,  you gained experiences, without loosing money.

Thanks for sharing your insight of early adopter.

[shirubadanieru]

Same, already sold my M11; had it for a month and while a great camera my rationale is very similar to yours. Definitely do not feel it’s worth the money Leica is asking for it. I remember buying the M-E for half the price of the M11 new…and now Leica digital prices are kinda getting ridiculous that it makes it hard to justify owning a new body...

At the end of the day, I’m happy shooting film or the M9 / M9M ; still the best digital cameras Leica has produced. Rather invest in lenses rather than expensive bodies.

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[kivis]

Shucks, I'm still enjoying my M-P 240. Will own it until it dies. Probably will be up to M14 by then. I'll get there eventually. 🤪

[FranciscoChung]

2 hours ago, shirubadanieru said:

Same, already sold my M11; had it for a month and while a great camera my rationale is very similar to yours. Definitely do not feel it’s worth the money Leica is asking for it. I remember buying the M-E for half the price of the M11 new…and now Leica digital prices are kinda getting ridiculous that it makes it hard to justify owning a new body...

At the end of the day, I’m happy shooting film or the M9 / M9M ; still the best digital cameras Leica has produced. Rather invest in lenses rather than expensive bodies.

Yes, the price is out of control at this point, especially when new products are not even dependable like our older Leicas.

Personally, I think I have more faith in my M9-P to produce more consistsant photos than M11. White balance & Meter wise. 

[Ko.Fe.]

3 hours ago, shirubadanieru said:

Same, already sold my M11; had it for a month and while a great camera my rationale is very similar to yours. Definitely do not feel it’s worth the money Leica is asking for it. I remember buying the M-E for half the price of the M11 new…and now Leica digital prices are kinda getting ridiculous that it makes it hard to justify owning a new body...

At the end of the day, I’m happy shooting film or the M9 / M9M ; still the best digital cameras Leica has produced. Rather invest in lenses rather than expensive bodies.

My M-E 220 was on sale for 3K USD new (from official dealer) in 2016. M11 after 5 1/2 years is 9K USD. 300% gauging rate. 

 

[Ko.Fe.]

14 hours ago, adan said:

I suspect you need to dial up your "sarcasm detector."

But this is what majority of camera owners are using it for. Family, flowers and "I have been where" landscapes. 

To been posted at tiny size on Insta.

It is not about pro gear as much anymore, but mostly about good experience at leisure time. 

[Adam Bonn]

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couldn't afford an M11 even if I wanted...

Hmmmm but do I want one?

I find for me (OMWV) new M features are usually, don't care, suppose that would be cool and damn I so want that (for example when I got the M10 I wondered about the M10R instead. Touch screen and 40mp = don't care / quiet shutter = suppose that would be cool / real ISO100 = damn I so want that), then in the decision process I discount everything except the damn I so want that parts and see if i wanna part with the cash (which for me generally means selling something I already have, usually my incumbent M)

For the M11 I'd like the new ISO range very much. I'd like the weight saving too*, the bigger battery is suppose that would be cool, and the MP uplift.. well don't care, I would probably shoot it at 18mp TBH

I'm quite happy with my M10, way more than I was with the M240 (and probably not for rational reasons!) and I've not had it that long really (less than a year) and M10s are going down in price a little, and M11s aren't cheap.

So no, not interested right now...

...but of course one day, in a few years - I will have new (to me) M GAS, and the M11 will have been superseded by the M12 (and the M13 will be rumoured) and it'll be affordable to me... and I'll probably get one (and make sure the FW is up to date and trawl these pages for the best tips and settings - thanks early adopters)

*I've always fancied a silver one... but buying secondhand means that price V condition and warranty/return has been king and the chips have always landed on black... now that there's a definitive benefit to having a black one (it's lighter), rather than just slight personal preference, what do ya wanna bet I end up with a silver one because the deal on that is too good to pass up !!!!! (ah ask me in about 2025!)

[Adam Bonn]

40 minutes ago, Ko.Fe. said:

My M-E 220 was on sale for 3K USD new (from official dealer) in 2016. M11 after 5 1/2 years is 9K USD. 300% gauging rate. 

 

To be fair the M-E was the cheap option at launch in 2012 or 13, getting a close out deal on one 3 or 4 years later then calculating the inflated value to today's 'latest greatest' model is a little harsh...

Wasn't the M9 like $8k at launch? (Sorry not my currency and sales tax and stuff works differently here in euro land.. basically here it's included in the sticker price, that way you're supposed to "forget" it's like twenty f**king percent)

[a.noctilux]

I had a look at my old "Cirque" catalogs,

in the 2010's Leica M9 was 5,500 Euros including taxes (TVA  in France) ... Nikon D3x (24.5 Mpix) 6,990€

in the 2008's Leica M8 was 4,790 Euros and film MP was 3,390 Euros ...Nikon D3 (12 Mpix) 4,700€

Edited March 21, 2022 by a.noctilux

[cboy]

So the M12 asking price will be? 🤔 Will leica be shooting itsef in the foot by pricing out more its customer base to the second hand market?

I wonder if theyll reintroduce tiered M bodies like they did before.  M11 flagship and M11 S 24mp?

 

 

[LocalHero1953]

3 hours ago, FranciscoChung said:

Yes, the price is out of control at this point, especially when new products are not even dependable like our older Leicas.

Personally, I think I have more faith in my M9-P to produce more consistsant photos than M11. White balance & Meter wise. 

Remember that the items that survive will necessarily be the reliable ones. The unreliable ones (all those corroded sensors) died long ago.

[Adam Bonn]

Quote

Pricing for the Leica M9 is on the order of US$7,000, and the camera started shipping in September 2009, in black and steel grey. The Leica M9-P variant reviewed here was announced in June 2011, and is available in a classic silver chrome or black paint finish, for about US$8,000

https://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/M9/M9A.HTM
 

M11 is what? $9000? So 2k increase in 12.5 years.. about thirteen bucks a month 😅

M11 is $8500 here in Portugal (about $9365)

[FranciscoChung]

18 minutes ago, Adam Bonn said:

https://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/M9/M9A.HTM
 

M11 is what? $9000? So 2k increase in 12.5 years.. about thirteen bucks a month 😅

M11 is $8500 here in Portugal (about $9365)

M11 is about 11,000 USD (inc tax)where I live. Crazy to think that people still waitlist 4 months to get it.

[Adam Bonn]

17 minutes ago, FranciscoChung said:

M11 is about 11,000 USD (inc tax)where I live. Crazy to think that people still waitlist 4 months to get it.

That’s about what my grandma paid to buy a house many, many, many years ago 😅

[Cattoo]

I still have my M10.  Given that most of the M11 upgrades fall into the "nice to have" category for me, I find it hard to justify the purchase.  The M10 remains a great camera.  

 

 

[Photoworks]

$9,793.31 for the camera

 $780 EVF

$ 460 Grip

$214 Battery

$40 screen protector

Total $11247.31 incl tax.  WOW

I just sold my m10-R after a year with a loss of about $700.  That is about a $60/month rental for a M10-R. 

[opera207]

Considering the inflation, M11 price is not ridiculous compared to M10r. M11 is better than m10 series, and there is no Sony m or Canon m cameras. So if you want to buy the best M camera, that's M11 even it has many cons.

It's not a confortable situation for consumers.

Edited March 22, 2022 by opera207

[hillavoider]

i just got my black M11 and its seriously good. Its even lighter then my film MP which blew me away. I've charged the battery once and used it for days.

Big difference is I haven't come from an M10, all the issues people have with this camera seem to be "but i've already got an M10 with 3 batteries.....i don't need the extra blah blah...."

I've come from an SL2 and my last M camera was a M9. 

Edited March 22, 2022 by hillavoider

[adan]

The price of admission for any new M body right now (before tax- USA) is - $8995.

At a famous large NYC store:

M10-R - $8995
M10-M - $8995
M11 - $8995

You can look it up.

Five years ago, my "intro" M10 was $6595 (something of a (pleasant) shock, since my first M9 in 2009 had been $6995).

I believe that while inflation, covid, supply-chains all are influences, the unmentioned elephant in the room is that Leica can no longer count on an M-body sale resulting in $3500-$35000 of Leica lens purchases. There are just too many other options for "pretty darn good" M-mount lenses out there now.

Used lenses, as always, but also increasingly compentent C/V lenses (and I plead guilty to using both) - and the Zeiss ZMs, and now the challenge from China (TTArtisans and 7Artisans and some niche others (Light Lens Lab)).

Therefore, Leica has decided that the M cameras have to carry their own weight, because the profit on the camera sale may be the only profit Leica ever sees. It can no longer be a "loss leader" of sorts.

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[IkarusJohn]

21 minutes ago, hillavoider said:

i just got my black M11 and its seriously good. Its even lighter then my film MP which blew me away. I've charged the battery once and used it for days.

Big difference is I haven't come from an M10, all the issues people have with this camera seem to be "but i've already got an M10 with 3 batteries.....i don't need the extra blah blah...."

I've come from an SL2 and my last M camera was a M9. 

Perfect choice, I’d say.