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Leica Fotos (Pro) {merged}

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Just to add my experience from today.

I connected the new version of Leica Fotos on my iPhone 11 Pro to the Leica CL and logged into the account. There are 143 dng-files on the card, the previews downloaded painfully slowly. I could download a dng into the app without the paid subscription or activating the trial period. 

So the only important functionality added by the paid subscription is the transfer to Lightroom Mobile on the iPad.

No, thank you.

The next version of LR Mobile, coming in December, will allow the direct import of pictures from the SD-card into LR. Importing via a cardreader and the USB-C input into my iPad Pro 11‚Äė‚Äė is waaaay faster than the wifi download via the Leica Fotos app.

Thomas

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13 minutes ago, willeica said:

. Has Leica AG not heard of market research? In the era for cameras that we are now entering communications functions need to be built into the cameras themselves and be part of the overall cost of the cameras.

 

Leica doesn't need market research. They already have tethered photographers.
Much more reliable

 

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3 minutes ago, willeica said:

Seems ludicrous. I could never get FOTOS to work with my M10, but then I could never find any reason to use such apps other than for selfies which I don't do. Now they want to charge for a 'supercharged' version of something that has not worked and does not appear to serve any purpose.

My M10 also wouldn't work with FOTOS, but my M10-P and Q2 do.  I believe this type of software does have its purposes, but I'm (at least) disappointed that we've paid for a premium product, but then get this "nickel and dime" type of software support.  

I had assumed that an update to FOTOS for iPad was going to be similar to what Hasselblad has done with its current PHOCUS Mobile software (and, unless I'm mistaken, without additional charge??).  In fairness, however, given the headaches that Apple has caused iPhone owners with its current iterations of software issues, if I could be guaranteed for $50 that a product would actually work as advertised and without fail, the expense might be worthwhile.  As it stands now, given the early comments re FOTOS, I'm (still) thinking my Gnarbox 2.0 was a good (albeit more expensive) move for workflow in the field--particularly in light of the size of Q2/SL2 files. 

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Problem is not really the 50‚ā¨ per year - Leica will tell you "you have 20K‚ā¨ worth of gear so what is 50‚ā¨ to you ?"

The problem is to understand what you get or will get for that price. If it's the DNG download (slow: 35 secs on Q2 87Mb files) then it's a joke, or a fraud, you name it. If it's to launch LR that we already have a subscription for, then it's another joke. When you have Leicas YES you have LR and Adobe CC if and only if you decide to use them. The upload of the DNGs via Fotos 2.00 does not even create a specific folder in LR! A simple joke, an April's fool, a prank, whatever.

I would seriously consider giving 50 bucks to a homeless tonight for a nice hot meal and forget about Fotos as it is today. Yes Leica, we do have 50 bucks left in our pockets, but only for reasonable causes. And it's because we have that kind of money to throw into expensive cameras and lenses that we know exactly what is a rip off, and what is not.

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I wouldn't mind paying a yearly fee to Leica for some truly enhanced relationship, software, or services. So it's not the principle of the thing. It's just that there isn't $50 of value in what they are offering. $5 or $10 maybe. They are going to have to do a lot more for my $50 than this joke. Lightroom does everything I need on my iPad, including direct import of files from an SD card reader already. (Clunky, but it works.)

I am canceling my trial.

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SAS is the world we live in.  There’s not much point in owning the software anyway with the pace of new releases in the hardware side, OS changes.
 

I’d pay $.99 for almost any app that adds value.  A subscription; not so excited about that.

I remained surprised at how bad camera makers are at the app side of the business.

Regards,

Kevin

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My previous version of the app notified me that there was an update. So I tried the non-pro App with iPhone 8 and iPad and my non-pro M10.

For both devices the¬†connection to the camera‚Äės wifi is still slow. I¬†do not see any functions of the app have been changed.

Download of a DNG to the i-devices works - though rather slow of course. You can do some basic changes of the photo in the usual Apple Fotos-App, though I don‚Äėt think¬†you can convert it to jpg from there.

I didn‚Äėt use the Leica Fotos App before after doing some beta-testing and I won‚Äėt need it in the future. I do not need and certainly will not pay for the¬†pro-version.

 

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Looks like the latest Fotos app (Version 2.0) is now available on the apple platform. 

Anyone have any experience or early thoughts on it?

 

 

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Pure speculation but I believe still photography shooters aren't the intended audience for this upgrade. Having a wireless transfer solution (even one that is as slow and poorly functioning as Leica's) is table stakes in any digital body today and should remain free.  Eliminating 1 app switch and enabling split screen can't possibly be seen by Leica as worthy of a yearly subscription charge.

Now being able to shoot tethered with the SL2 in a studio environment and / or turning an iPad into the equivalent of a Ninja Atomos would be well worth the upgrade price and justify the Video portion of the offering.  What Leica needs to be grappling with is creating software that is the 1's & 0's equivalent of their hardware: Beautiful, quick, intuitive, devoid of clutter, a joy to use. They have a long way to go but if they can achieve it then I would happily pay a premium, even if it is excessive relative to the market.

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7 hours ago, T25UFO said:

Is version 2.0 available for the iPhone yet?  Mine still shows 1.3.2 and no update yet from the App Store.

Did you do a search for it in the App Store? My iPad version didn't show that an update was available until I searched for it.

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2 hours ago, WeiterWinkel said:

Just to add my experience from today.

I connected the new version of Leica Fotos on my iPhone 11 Pro to the Leica CL and logged into the account. There are 143 dng-files on the card, the previews downloaded painfully slowly. I could download a dng into the app without the paid subscription or activating the trial period. 

So the only important functionality added by the paid subscription is the transfer to Lightroom Mobile on the iPad.

No, thank you.

The next version of LR Mobile, coming in December, will allow the direct import of pictures from the SD-card into LR. Importing via a cardreader and the USB-C input into my iPad Pro 11‚Äė‚Äė is waaaay faster than the wifi download via the Leica Fotos app.

Thomas

According to the announcement on this forum, downloading dng comes only with the subscription version. Do you think you're getting dng transfers because you're in the (free) trial period?

Recently I bought the Blackmagic Video Assist, which came with (Blackmagic) Davinci Resolve for free, a package that has enormous depth and sophistication of functionality, and which, in a slightly more advanced version, is an accepted industry standard for video editing in Hollywood. Blackmagic distribute it for free because it helps them sell hardware. Leica needs to decide if they want to make money from software or hardware. Their firmware for camera interfaces is wonderful, but their freestanding software just doesn't reach a standard I would pay for.

Edited by LocalHero1953

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1 hour ago, UliWer said:

or both devices the¬†connection to the camera‚Äės wifi is still slow. I¬†do not see any functions of the app have been changed.

Indeed - the downloads are slow mainly because the camera's WiFi hardware is slow. Presumably because of battery life and space (antenna) issues, the WiFi implementations typically appear to use only a single 54Mbit/s channel. The Leica iOS code is not very well optimised for performance, but the scope for improvement is small (10-20% faster, not 10x faster).

Because of this, the WiFi apps are ok as a quick-and-dirty measure when you have no other option, but for serious work they are too slow.

Leica's iOS and firmware code quality is also dubious at best. On my most recent attempt to use the software I could not download more than a handful of images before the link dropped, sometimes leaving the UI in an inconsistent and unusable state that required the app to be force quit. It is certainly not something that I would pay money for, let alone a subscription. Changing that value equation likely will require new camera hardware as well as improved software that is reliable and which does substantially more than simply emulating a cable or card reader.

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vor 14 Minuten schrieb LocalHero1953:

According to the announcement on this forum, downloading dng comes only with the subscription version. Do you think you're getting dng transfers because you're in the (free) trial period?

Mmh, to activate the trial period you have to go to the preferences in the upper right corner of the app. Then hit ‚ÄěLeica Fotos Pro‚Äú and then you get the attached screen. I didnt‚Äėt touch the ‚ÄěKostenlos testen‚Äú button, it is still there. Nevertheless I could download dng-files from my CL, there are no jpgs on the card.

 

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34 minutes ago, WeiterWinkel said:

Mmh, to activate the trial period you have to go to the preferences in the upper right corner of the app. Then hit ‚ÄěLeica Fotos Pro‚Äú and then you get the attached screen. I didnt‚Äėt touch the ‚ÄěKostenlos testen‚Äú button, it is still there. Nevertheless I could download dng-files from my CL, there are no jpgs on the card.

 

Thanks! That's a bit of a mismatch between the announcement and the app itself.

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Cannot think of one damn good reason to approve this ridiculous idea at HQ.

The app still runs like a cheap and weird one. Before updated, I even doubted it's fake or not. However it's looking for someone's endless subscription..

Hope LEICA save their own dignity.

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A wise and clearly well thought out marketing strategy.  Given the large "entry" investment cost into the Leica camera line, charging for an app to enjoy and process exposures taken using Leica equipment is the ticket! Just think about it: You spend $7000 for a new camera. Another $20,,000 or so for summilux and noc lenses and perhaps $35 for a hat maybe $125 for a credit card case/wrench combo.  After those expenditures you are certainly begging for the opportunity to pay for an application of the sort generally provided gratis by lesser brands (Canon, Nikon).  

Leica, my overpriced Leica hat is off to you.  You are marketing geniuses!

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1 hour ago, rnl said:

Leica, my overpriced Leica hat is off to you.  You are marketing geniuses!

Marketing geniuses would understand the value expectations within the particular platform (iOS/iPad OS). It's very clear that Leica does not understand anything about that market. Being Leica does not allow you to wildly violate marketplace expectations. It allows you to charge about a 1.5x price premium; for anything more you'd better have a great story.

(And yes, I know rnl was being facetious!)

If Leica really wants $50 a year from i-device users, there is a way they can get that without making themselves look completely out of touch. That would be to bundle a suite of services that includes the enhanced app features. Something like access to a premium online support forum, discounts on Leica events and workshops, etc. Use the apps as a gateway and get people to sign up for the premium program membership, and throw in a few enhanced app features as a sweetener. That sort of thing would increase owner loyalty and identification with the brand. I would probably pay for that, even though deep down I know it's kind of steep, because I like identifying as a Leica owner and feeling part of something special. Well, at least I would have, before Leica insulted me with this stunt.

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