S007 Body Design Outdated?

[Jan1985]

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I came across some discussion about the body Design of the S. There seem to be a lot people who find that the body of the S is an oldfashioned Design like a Dinosaur. Its the dslr Design. And Now the S3 seems to Come along with the Same basic construction. 

What do you think?

[Jeff S]

Well, the SL design team considered a mini S form factor before opting for more ‘brutal’ design, using Dr. Kaufmann’s term. Now he says the SL2 will be more ‘elegant’,so perhaps more rounded edge like the S. We’ll see.

I personally like the S shape, albeit large like most DSLRs, especially considering the larger sensor and mirror box, as well as the correspondingly big lenses.

Jeff

Edited June 2, 2019 by Jeff S

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[dave.gt]

What... is everyone wanting a look-alike Nikony/Sonikon? Or a , ahem!... a big brick like the Fuji 100?

I hope not!

Like Jeff said, I love the design and if you ever saw the design explained in a video, the reason it is shaped like it is will become clear. I wish I could find that video.., it has been ages ago it seems.

The S rocks!😎

 

Edited June 2, 2019 by dave.gt

[earleygallery]

The S is a large SLR design, not unlike a digital Pentax 6X7. It's all about mirrorless now so yes, the S is based on 'dinosaur' technology.

[dave.gt]

Haha... The great S images are then... "dinosaur" images?😀

Aesthetically, IMO the S looks far better than the Nikon and Fuji offerings by far. Only the X1D sits at the pinnacle because it draws from its design history... the V System. 

No one else has that starting point,  arguably. I really dislike the bland design of the SL. No idea where that starting point came from as it hardly resembles the Leicflex SL/SL2.

At least the S has the form and similar design features of the R8 and R9. 😀

But, beauty is in the eye of the beholder!

 

 

[ZHNL]

It is not its body outdated but after all these years there is no technology update make itself dated. 

I am OK with it as is now most likely because I am manual focus and exposure guy when I am using S but I am not sure market think the same. 

[dave.gt]

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Yes, the market is what it is/will be!

 

[xiaubauu2009]

don't think it's the body shape or style that is outdated... it's the ingredient inside that is outdated... they all can be update to a modern camera system.

A few example where It think it will be relevant:

1. OVF with digital overlay, if they still want to keep to OVF system which in my honest opinion they should really keep it as it will be a one of a kind product in this segment nowadays.

2. Use a translucent mirror box ala Sony A99 that will ensure focus confirmation on sensor and eliminate the one biggest handicap of a traditional SLR design. Having superb glass but sub-par focus module due to mirror box discrepancy will be a thing of the pass

3. Faster everything... but that means the AF drive of the lens need to change to a linear motor drive... don't think this will happen.

4. IBIS.... if that's even possible. Fujifilm end game camera has a humongous IBIS unit that I don't think leica S body can even house it....

5. Better shutter dampening, like the M10p...

6. all the other bob standard update generic to most modern contemporary camera...

then I think S SLR design is not just up to date, but unique and special....

Edited June 3, 2019 by xiaubauu2009

[erlingmm]

I think  it is the sexiest (camera) body out there, and that It is ergonomically perfect. Seriously.

[Photon42]

I always adored the design language of the S body and their lenses. For me it is one of the best looking cameras out there. If Leica would have started two years back with developing a MF camera, they probably would have gone mirrorless. A new mirrorless lens mount for Leica's MF is not going to happen, I think. Too much of an investment with too little return expectations. The best I can think is that there will be a mirrorless with the same register (flange to sensor distance?) at one day. Similar body size, slightly lighter, superb EVF + all the assist functions. Certain innovations just come with this technology.

Like with any innovation, things easily get blown out of proportion. I'd take the S over the Fuji any day of the week, and this is because it increases the pleasure of taking a photograph. The X1D came close, but then I did not like their electronics and AF lens options. For me photography is recreation. Why doing it with something you don't like looking at or touching.

In terms of operations, I like the body design very much. The finder is very informative. The one thing which always bugs be is the exposure compensation setting. Pressing a button and rotating the back dial, while the top dial has not any control assigned (in A mode) is a lost opportunity for me.

[Milan_S]

I love the design and feel of the S body, but like other people said it's not the design which is outdated but the internals:

- The S3 should have EVF in my opinion (basically an SL on steroids)

- more reliable and faster AF with focus points like the SL - Focus the S 100mm on an eye and it will always give problems

- Keep the lenses as they are but make them a bit faster

The AF is the weakest link in the S system not the resolution (although they will update this to 64MP, which is more than enough). The huge center AF point is to big for focus finetuning on the eye. If often need to take more than one shot just to have the focus somewhere on the eye. 

 

[helged]

17 minutes ago, Milan_S said:

I love the design and feel of the S body, but like other people said it's not the design which is outdated but the internals:

- The S3 should have EVF in my opinion (basically an SL on steroids)

- more reliable and faster AF with focus points like the SL - Focus the S 100mm on an eye and it will always give problems

- Keep the lenses as they are but make them a bit faster

The AF is the weakest link in the S system not the resolution (although they will update this to 64MP, which is more than enough). The huge center AF point is to big for focus finetuning on the eye. If often need to take more than one shot just to have the focus somewhere on the eye. 

 

Focus tuning could be acieved with an external EVF a la M240/M10. Not a pretty/minimalistic add-on, but I would be more than happy to have  FULL control of the focus rather than hoping for the best.... S3+the possibility to fine tune the focus without having to check the back screen would be a go for me. 

Edited June 3, 2019 by helged

[erlingmm]

11 hours ago, Jan1985 said:

I came across some discussion about the body Design of the S. There seem to be a lot people who find that the body of the S is an oldfashioned Design like a Dinosaur. Its the dslr Design. And Now the S3 seems to Come along with the Same basic construction. 

What do you think?

1) Be careful with concluding "a lot of people" from (any) forum discussions. It is probably about 3.

2) Most of them don't own/have never tried what they criticize

3) They just think that Leica/any manufacturer should do something different

4) They would never buy the product anyway, even if it was changed according to their wishes

5)...and there are so many conflicting wishes, that they can probably not be unified into one single product anyway, unless you are in the Swiss knife business

6)...and then they would criticize the product for being a Swiss knife

7) I have owned all 3 S models over a period of 8 years, and am extremely happy with it, the body is very well thought through and designed (see post above). I think that keeping the same basic design for 10 years speaks for its quality.

😎 BTW, I think the Fuji bodies are monsters (but I have never tried one 😉

Edited June 3, 2019 by erlingmm

[ynp]

52 minutes ago, helged said:

Focus tuning could be acieved with an external EVF a la M240/M10. Not a pretty/minimalistic add-on, but I would be more than happy to have  FULL control of the focus rather than hoping for the best.... 

+1

Just add a EVF weatherproof terminal and a tiltable EVF like the Fuji does and the S will suddenly be a modern camera again. 

Edited June 3, 2019 by ynp

[Jan1985]

vor 16 Minuten schrieb erlingmm:

1) Be careful with concluding "a lot of people" from (any) forum discussions. It is probably about 3.

2) Most of them don't own/have never tried what they criticize

3) They just think that Leica/any manufacturer should do something different

4) They would never buy the product anyway, even if it was changed according to their wishes

5)...and there are so many conflicting wishes, that they can probably not be unified into one single product anyway, unless you are in the Swiss knife business

6)...and then they would criticize the product for being a Swiss knife

7) I have owned all 3 S models over a period of 8 years, and am extremely happy with it, the body is very well thought through and designed (see post above). I think that keeping the same basic design for 10 years speaks for its quality.

😎 BTW, I think the Fuji bodies are monsters (but I have never tried one 😉

You are right in all points that you've mentioned. At the End of the Day I really like the S007. It feels great in my hands. The only problem is that the rubber or coating of the battery blend is loose and it seems is not very well manufactured on this part of the body...

[Photon42]

6 minutes ago, Jan1985 said:

You are right in all points that you've mentioned. At the End of the Day I really like the S007. It feels great in my hands. The only problem is that the rubber or coating of the battery blend is loose and it seems is not very well manufactured on this part of the body...

Someone who normally knows better than me told me once, that the (some) rubber coating on lenses and camera bodies actually widens when it comes in contact with (excessive?) sun tan lotion and similar products. It seems to ingest some of the "stuff" and it looks like the process is irreversible. I have absolutely no idea whether that applies in your case and I would bet there are differences in rubber coatings between products, some being more prone to this effect than others. 

[John McMaster]

Ha, my S(007) has that problem in the far north of Scotland 😉

john

[peterv]

Ha, my S2-P has a completely disintegrated rubber eyepiece in the dark NW of the Netherlands 🙂

 

Seriously, I think the design of the S system is wonderful and as far as I'm concerned, it does not need a makeover. Everything is right where it's supposed to be and I really like the OVF. Besides, if people want the smaller form factor and all the other benefits offered by a mirrorless camera, including an electronic viewfinder, I guess soon there will be the new SL with a sensor close to 50 MP. A camera that will let us use our S lenses, too.

[John McMaster]

My S2-P has a half disintegrated rubber eyepiece...

Very happy with shape and handling and lack of unnecessary (IMO) buttons.

john

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[Photon42]

4 hours ago, John McMaster said:

Ha, my S(007) has that problem in the far north of Scotland 😉

john

The absence of sun does not warrant for non-usage of sun tan lotion 😂