Crack!

[jaapv]

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There is an image in the M9 FAQ thread

[NB23]

What is "covering glass"? Is it the viewfinder window?

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[zlatkob]

I believe it is a thin layer of glass over the sensor that captures the image.

[Bo_Lorentzen]

Lars,

 

Sorry to hear of your problem with the sensor, strangely I don't know for sure what is most frustrating, having the problem happen, or when you get the camera back, not knowing exactly what caused it... somehow a lot of us are going to be looking at the sensor every so often.

 

.

[Alnitak]

I am curious to know if people that have experienced a cracked sensor, can comment on the conditions when the crack occurred, and if it can be due to excessive heating from sunlight through the lens.

 

Best regards

 

Trond

 

When mine cracked, it was spring. There had been no temperature swings of any kind; in fact, the temperature indoors and outdoors was quite similar. In addition, it happened in the middle of the night, while my camera sat in my bag on the desk, so the sun did not come into play.

 

I agree its a stress issue, and it could be thermal stress, or stress during assembly of the PCB board, etc. The bottom line is that Leica isn't saying anything, but they are acknowledging the issue and very rapidly repairing or replacing cameras that have the issue.

 

Lars, sorry to hear it happened to you, but I trust that Leica will rapidly repair/replace your camera.

 

Jeff

[Ed_K]

Wish Leica can share with us some of their findings, now many users will feel kind of like holding a "time bomb" not knowing when their M9 will be the next victim

[lars_bergquist]

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Thanks all of you for your responses in this short time.

 

The M9 is from an early batch (delivery in October last year). More than a month has passed since I last had to clean the sensor (Eclipse E2). I have a long series of exposures from the last week, without the problem. During the weekend, I shot a slow series of exposures to test the focus of my Elmarit-M 90mm. I checked these by chimping, but in the center of the image only. The last of these exposures were still on the card when I took the camera out on Tuesday. I did not notice the blemish (in the top left corner of the images all right!) until I downloaded the frames to my computer. A quick look with a penlight told me the bad news.

 

Thermal stress? I have never yet used the camera on 'continuous'. The test exposures were made very deliberately. And indoors! So no sun on the camera; still, I hope that a M9 can be taken out even if the sky is not overcast ... Summer temperatures have been high in the Stockholm area, but they had not risen above 24--26 degrees C when the cracking occurred. This is why I used the word 'spontaneously' in my initial posting.

 

I discovered this in the evening this past Tuesday (yesterday), I am writing this at 06,20 in the morning, and I will hand in the camera to my friendly dealer before lunchtime. Out comes my M4-P, but this is severely handicapped by the difficulty of getting the scanning done to an acceptable standard, without a customer footing the (astronomical) bill. I had simply laid off this film thing.

 

If the gnomes of Solms are indeed keen to fix this, I may still have the camera back sometime in September, but I am already having symtoms of abstinence (sweating, shaking hands, Angst ...)

 

Again, thanks -- you are indeed a cracking crew.

 

The old man who's not on crack

Edited July 14, 2010 by lars_bergquist
New idea

[lars_bergquist]

And, by the way, the crack shows very well on this frame. Note the bright reflection from the fractured glass surfaces.

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[Fotomiguel]

Hallo Lars!

This happened to me after my first week using my M9. That was november. I know how you feel. I was lucky that my dealer replaced my camera. I'm sorry for you.

It's hard to think that this can happen again and Leica don't let as know the causes of the problem.

I've never heard that this happen twice to a already repaired camera. So at least your camera will be fine for the future and covered by guarantee. But may be in the future is this going to happen to cameras without guarantee?

Kind regards

Miguel

[mtomalty]

Lars wrote,

 

"Again, thanks -- you are indeed a cracking crew.

 

The old man who's not on crack"

 

 

 

Perhaps, the fitting question should be, " The M9. Is it all it's cracked up to be ? "

 

 

Mark

Mark Tomalty Photography Montreal Canada Travel Landscape Stock FineArt

[Marty]

Not really convinced that the camera/sensor batch has anything to do with it until some recent batch owners have also had a chance to run in their cameras. Scary is the thought of a latent problem in all cameras that won't appear in the majority until after the warranty expires.

[Guest imported_torben]

Dear Lars,

 

This is really bad news, my greatest sympaties!

 

I work with integrated circuit design and production.

 

Usually, when a silicon chip is larger than 15-20 mm on the side, several different packaging problems, related to temperature stress can occur.

 

The sensor on the M9 is, as we know, 24 by 36 mm.

 

This is a very large silicon chip!

 

On top of all, a glass layer (the IR filter) is bonded to the front of the sensor chip, making this a four layer sandwich of different materials: The package material probably some kind of ceramic, the package lead frame (metal), the silicon chip, and finally the cover-glass.

 

This four layer structure is very sensitive to thermal stress.

 

The problem seems to me to be thermally induced since all examples so far shows the crack in one of the corners, where the temperature stress will be the greatest.

 

One big problem with rangefinder cameras is that sun light can easily enter into the lens if the user is not careful to always keep the lens cap on when not shooting.

 

History is full of sad stories with shutter curtains with burned holes in them!

 

Leica has partly alleviated this problem by the white/gray metering pattern directly behind the focal point of the lens, which will bring down the temperature considerably.

 

I am quite sure that if the sun is let to shine through the lens for some extended time, heat build up can be so high that the senor cover-glass will crack, even if there is no hole burned in the shutter curtain.

 

I always keep the lens cap on my M9 while waking around in bright sunlight, only removing the cap when shooting.

 

I am curious to know if people that have experienced a cracked sensor, can comment on the conditions when the crack occurred, and if it can be due to excessive heating from sunlight through the lens.

 

Best regards

 

Trond

 

bla, bla...............(NECESSITY OF A LENS CAP ON A 7000 USD CAMERA!!!)

[Guest trond]

Dear Torben,

 

I invite you to take your M9, put on a 90 Cron, leave it in the sun without the lens cap for approx 30 seconds, then post the result on the forum

 

Best regards

 

Trond

 

PS: The repair cost will not be covered by the warranty

Edited July 14, 2010 by trond

[lars_bergquist]

Whatever caused my crack, it was not the sun or any other external heat source. I suspect this is because of tensions in the glass itself, produced either during the manufacture of the glass, its assembly on the sensor, or the assembly of the sensor unit in the camera.

 

But it would have been reassuring if Leica had seen fit to say something -- if only "we have noted the problem and we are investigating it."

 

The old man

[jaapv]

Well, Lars, commiserations, btw, that is exactly what Leica did in a post by Stefan Daniel. And I'm sure both Kodak and Leica are not happy with it. The bulk of the investigation into the cause must be by Kodak, I guess.

Edited July 14, 2010 by jaapv

[jaapv]

bla, bla...............(NECESSITY OF A LENS CAP ON A 7000 USD CAMERA!!!)

Old wisdom: better to keep your mouth shut and have people think you a fool than to open it and remove all doubt...

[erl]

My lens caps usually go on the lenses, regardless of the cost of the camera. I use them to protect the glass, on occasions.

[Guest trond]

The bulk of the investigation into the cause must be by Kodak, I guess.

 

Dear Jaapv,

 

You are right here, and I am quite sure that the root cause of the early failures are well known at Kodak and Leica.

 

Standard procedure in these cases of early failure of components (the Kodak sensor in this case), are for the supplier (Kodak) to halt production and do a full failure analysis until the cause of failure is found.

 

This kind of failure analysis can be performed in a matter of a few weeks at a reputable independent lab.

 

This was most certainly done after the first or second report of cracked sensors.

 

The matter for sure already remedied and corrected in production at Kodak and/or Leica, or it's subcontractors.

 

There may still be cameras out there with with sensors from the failing batch of sensors.

 

Depending on what kind of production tracking is implemented in the production of the sensor, sensor circuit boards at Leicas sub-supplier, or the camera assembly.

 

It may, or may not be possible, for Leica to track down the potentially affected sensor boards.

 

It would be interesting to know the serial numbers of affected cameras, to see if there is any kind of pattern in the failures.

 

Best regards

 

Trond

[jaapv]

Trond, that makes me think. There was clearly a shortage of sensors in the recent past. Halting production would explain it.

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[mtomalty]

The bulk of the investigation into the cause must be by Kodak, I guess.

 

I would think so, as well, but at the same time Kodak produces sensors for quite a number of digital

cameras and medium format backs crossing many formats, some larger in surface area than that

in the M9, and I cannot recall ever reading about any cracked sensors (or glass covers) from

another product.

 

Mark

Mark Tomalty Photography Montreal Canada Travel Landscape Stock FineArt