Dropped my SBKOO Viewfinder, need replacement suggestions.

[Abram]

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I was using my 21mm yesterday photographing my family get-together and as I was switching back to my 35mm lens, my little SBKOO viewfinder fell off my camera and hit the countertop approx 6" below where I was standing at the time. This small impact was enough to ruin the viewfinder unfortunately and now everything is rattling around loose inside. Bummer. 

I'm going to need to replace it, and though I liked the simplicity (and yes aesthetics) of the older metal finders, they're just too fragile and unable to be repaired these days. Over the past decade with Leica I've had many different 21mm lenses and therefore many different 21mm finders, but I'm curious what the general consensus is these days. I've no interest in getting the EVF for my Monochrom, as I would prefer to use the external optical finder so it can also be used on my M-A. 

Over the years I've tried: Multiple SBKOOs, The big plastic 12008 (or 12012? I forget), The current 12024, and a couple times around with The metal CV 21/25. 

I know none of these are going to be incredibly precise, but I'm just looking for a bright, reasonably accurate view for quick framing. I've always been curious about the Zeiss but something something about rotational angles or what have you made it sound like you may as well be shooting with your eyes closed (an exaggeration of course). I'll probably lean towards the CV option but I'd love to hear what others are happy with.

[spydrxx]

I'm not much of a 21mm shooter, but I settled on the black plastic CV external finder and have been very pleased with its clarity and brightness.

[jaapv]

https://shop.cameraquest.com/voigtlander-viewfinders/voigtlander-15mm-to-35mm-viewfinder-zoomfinder-type-b/

[JMF]

https://www.kenrockwell.com/leica/21mm-finders.htm

no info about the Zeiss finder .

Edited June 17, 2024 by JMF

[jaapv]

In my experience the best ones are these:

 

https://fotohandeldelfshaven.nl/product/zeiss-21mm-viewfinder/

 

You can find them on ebay

 

https://www.ebay.nl/sch/i.html?_nkw=zeiss+finder&_sop=12

[Abram]

3 hours ago, jaapv said:

In my experience the best ones are these:

 

https://fotohandeldelfshaven.nl/product/zeiss-21mm-viewfinder/

 

So that would be what I'd naturally gravitate towards, but the "collective wisdom" of the internet has always claimed that because of the M bodies offset hotshoe, it is unable to frame with reasonable accuracy. Granted this has always sounded a bit nonsensical to me since the only offset finder I've tried has been the plastic bodied Leica ones from the 80s/90s. To my recollection also, only 1-2 versions of the Leica plastic finder, the 21/24/28 multi-finder and I think the giant frankenfinder are correctly offset to compensate. So.... how is the Zeiss any different from the older SBKOO or the current 12024. 

I'm surely not expecting perfect 1:1 accuracy (we wouldn't be using Ms otherwise!) but I would like whatever I use to be reasonably "good enough". The lens in question is the 21 Super-Elmar for what it's worth. 

Either way thank you all for sharing your insights

Edited June 17, 2024 by Abram

[jaapv]

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It is nonsensical. The framelines shift diagonally to compensate for this parallax. However, the framing is only accurate in the plane of focus; behind that plane the view is shifted to the right, in front to the left. This has the result that objects may be hidden or revealed.

[PCPix]

I like the little round metal Voigtlander 21/25 (with a thin plastic shim under the foot for a tight fit on M10 and M10R). If you ever get a 24mm lens, it’s close enough for that too. I also have the 15. They are robust and small - never had any problems with them.

As some have mentioned, accuracy is not really that good with any external finder - more if a ‘guideline’, but perfectly good for street/riots! If you need proper tripod alignment and framing (e.g. for architecture), just go onto live view. 

[KFo]

I've played around with a few of these.  From a practical standpoint, I think the plastic CV model is completely sufficient.  I have the Leica metal one which is my normal goto but only because I just like it, not because it works any better than the CV.  The plastic CV is brighter and clearer than the Leica, however that could be a function of age and condition too.

I only shoot 21 occasionally so I have to remind myself of the finder frame line alignment, if I think it will be critical, with a quick LV look see (M10P).  I haven't messed with any of the Frankefinders, they are just too much for me.

[a.noctilux]

Happily, the 21mm framing can be done in most cases without aux VF.

With habits or after using aux VF a while.

Framing with aux VF is not accurate ( with M) anyway.

[jdlaing]

23 hours ago, Abram said:

I was using my 21mm yesterday photographing my family get-together and as I was switching back to my 35mm lens, my little SBKOO viewfinder fell off my camera and hit the countertop approx 6" below where I was standing at the time. This small impact was enough to ruin the viewfinder unfortunately and now everything is rattling around loose inside. Bummer. 

I'm going to need to replace it, and though I liked the simplicity (and yes aesthetics) of the older metal finders, they're just too fragile and unable to be repaired these days. Over the past decade with Leica I've had many different 21mm lenses and therefore many different 21mm finders, but I'm curious what the general consensus is these days. I've no interest in getting the EVF for my Monochrom, as I would prefer to use the external optical finder so it can also be used on my M-A. 

Over the years I've tried: Multiple SBKOOs, The big plastic 12008 (or 12012? I forget), The current 12024, and a couple times around with The metal CV 21/25. 

I know none of these are going to be incredibly precise, but I'm just looking for a bright, reasonably accurate view for quick framing. I've always been curious about the Zeiss but something something about rotational angles or what have you made it sound like you may as well be shooting with your eyes closed (an exaggeration of course). I'll probably lean towards the CV option but I'd love to hear what others are happy with.

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/1675244-REG/ttartisan_a03b_acc_28mm_f_5_6_lens_for.html?ap=y&smp=y&lsft=BI%3A514&gad_source=1&gbraid=0AAAAAD7yMh27xZX6ecBOpPkEDDejOadYb

[Kwesi]

https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/used/586202/?smpm=bu_uar&gad_source=1&gclid=Cj0KCQjw4MSzBhC8ARIsAPFOuyWntJ-1BDrc8QScmmaJ-6Xo4BlrQcRt2eLiN7Orou2SwBKsGMw7OEQaAktiEALw_wcB

This is probably your best bet price and quality wise.. I would just be very vigilant about occasionally making sure the tensioner on the foot is at its optimal so it doesn't slip out of the hotshoe

[250swb]

The black plastic CV finder is the best and brightest, and far better than the black plastic Leica 21mm finder.

Edited June 18, 2024 by 250swb

[Abram]

Thanks for the suggestion friends! Also for the record, because almost none of these options have locks and every Leica I’ve ever used has a very loose hot shoe I keep a trimmed piece of paperboard from a film box and slide that underneath whatever accessory I have attached. So the finder WAS securely in place and it was I who dropped it on the counter whilst removing it. 

[farnz]

I also endorse the Zeiss 21 mm viewfinder in JaapV's post.  Some years ago after comparing the usual suspects,  including the Leica metal VF for the 21 Summilux, in my opinion and those from the Leica Akademie in attendance at the time, the Zeiss is the clearest and most brilliant VF of them all. 

I've been using one on my M8 with my 21/2.8 Kobalux for over 10 years and have never noticed the 'offset accuracy' matter of urban legend but then I'm not a finicky framer who needs to know precisely what's in the frame and what's not.

To this day I'm still astonished by the Zeiss's clarity if I haven't used it for a week or two and that's good enough for me.

Pete.

[stephen.w]

38 minutes ago, farnz said:

I also endorse the Zeiss 21 mm viewfinder in JaapV's post.  Some years ago after comparing the usual suspects,  including the Leica metal VF for the 21 Summilux, in my opinion and those from the Leica Akademie in attendance at the time, the Zeiss is the clearest and most brilliant VF of them all. 

I've been using one on my M8 with my 21/2.8 Kobalux for over 10 years and have never noticed the 'offset accuracy' matter of urban legend but then I'm not a finicky framer who needs to know precisely what's in the frame and what's not.

To this day I'm still astonished by the Zeiss's clarity if I haven't used it for a week or two and that's good enough for me.

Pete.

I'm sorry I didn't buy one of the Zeiss finders when they were still being made - they've now got quite pricey.

One advantage of the Leica external finders is framelines for the M8.

[Kwesi]

17 hours ago, stephen.w said:

I'm sorry I didn't buy one of the Zeiss finders when they were still being made - they've now got quite pricey.

One advantage of the Leica external finders is framelines for the M8.

I agree. Because of the M8 framelines you get 2 finders in one 21/28. 

[farnz]

32 minutes ago, Kwesi said:

I agree. Because of the M8 framelines you get 2 finders in one 21/28. 

I perhaps should have explained that I use the Zeiss 28/25 on my M8 with my 21/2.8 Kobalux (owing to the M8's 1.33 crop factor) but the Zeiss 21 with the Kobalux on my M3 and M10.

Pete.

[Abram]

I think based on what is being shared here I'll be hunting down a Zeiss 21mm finder. I really appreciate you all taking the time to share your experiences!

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[BWColor]

Yes, the Zeiss finder is a great way to go.  Optics are great, but also doesn’t lock into hotshoe.

Edited June 21, 2024 by BWColor