jaapv Posted March 19 Share #41 Posted March 19 Advertisement (gone after registration) All fine with me as long as they can be switched off. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted March 19 Posted March 19 Hi jaapv, Take a look here Played a few days with it and the 60MPX sensor begs for a panoramic crop !!!. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Simone_DF Posted March 19 Share #42 Posted March 19 4 hours ago, jaapv said: I still think that Leica added the framelines to make the camera more M-like, not for any photographic purpose. Surely the composition of a photo should originate from the brain of the photographer and not from some camera holding one’s hand. Added to which the crop is better judged on a large computer screen than on the mini EVF. Available on the SL2 right now: 3:2, 7:5, 4:3, 1:1, 3:1, 16:9 aspect ratios. So no. Leica added framelines on the SL for photographic purposes. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted March 19 Share #43 Posted March 19 Sure; they want to sell cameras. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cookedart Posted March 19 Share #44 Posted March 19 9 hours ago, jaapv said: But what is the artistic value of specifically mimicking a focal length? Be glad that the Q expanded your creativity. Those focal length crops were forced by the limitations of film and interchangeable lenses. The Q3 removes such restrictions. Now you can crop to suit your subject. In fact, it allows one to avoid cut off heads and feet, boring repetitive central compositions, unwanted intrusive components, etc. I'm sorry, but it seems like you have answered your own question? 9 hours ago, jaapv said: Surely the composition of a photo should originate from the brain of the photographer and not from some camera holding one’s hand I've been thinking about this comment as a general workflow, and I feel like I must just work entirely differently than what you suggest. For me, I see what I want to photograph, then I raise my camera to shoot. At that moment, there is a necessary feedback loop that the camera gives me - it shows me what it can capture, and I have to reconcile that with what I intended to capture in my mind. Without having a precise guideline for what the camera is able to do, I have to guess. If the photograph was created in your brain, I could stay at home and just draw it. And if the view from the camera was not important, then High Res, Large, Fast Refresh viewfinders would not be valuable - and in fact cameras could ship without a viewfinder entirely and people could just blind shoot and get perfect compositions every time. But clearly, viewfinders matter, as often people comment on how much a good viewfinder makes them feel connected to the camera, whether it be a Leica Rangefinder or a particularly good EVF. And the reason for this is that the camera gives you good, precise feedback. One thing I should also state is, of course everyone shooting Panoramic frames on a Q3 is cropping in post. You quite literally have to. So bringing it up is not really helpful or novel. As a thought exercise, imagine that every camera manufacturer in the world decided that the standard format was a circle, to maximize the capture area on the sensor. But at the same time, they did not offer any in-camera crop to 3:2 or 4:3. Of course, everyone could crop to their standard ratio on a computer or mobile device, but its obvious that it would create some unnecessary friction for users to compose and create the final image as intended. It seems obvious to me, so I can't see why this is hard for people to imagine, even if they have no desire to shoot a 65:24 frame. 2 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
AZach Posted April 16 Share #45 Posted April 16 To try the Q3 Perspective Control, shot from same spot to 3 different directions the below photos. Then just cropped to XPan 65x24 in LrC (any custom format can also be saved). Works well for me and did not miss any in-camera crop or frame-lines. But can respect other methods as explained above as well. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/377672-played-a-few-days-with-it-and-the-60mpx-sensor-begs-for-a-panoramic-crop/?do=findComment&comment=5190837'>More sharing options...
David Wien Posted April 16 Share #46 Posted April 16 On 3/19/2024 at 6:11 PM, cookedart said: As a thought exercise, imagine that every camera manufacturer in the world decided that the standard format was a circle, to maximize the capture area on the sensor. Super idea! Why do we always have to have rectangular photos, paticularly when not shooting on filmstock? David 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wolfloid Posted April 18 Share #47 Posted April 18 Advertisement (gone after registration) I see no reason why Leica cannot add crops to either the EVF or the LCD, which one can turn on or off, add or subtract. I would like the 56x24 X-Pan crop so that I can feel for the image I want to make. Those who want to shout about how they can do it in their head seem to be completely missing the point of having aids to pre-visualisation, which nearly all the best film directors use. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
getoutofgotham Posted April 19 Share #48 Posted April 19 Surprised by the pushback on this request. It’s not from a place of laziness that the OP arrives but of the benefit of families when shooting. This is no different than 35mm frame lines or any frame lines at all. It’s baffling to see so many responses attributing the request to anything else. Also the effort to implement this in firmware is trivial. I could have written the C code to do this while this thread was unfurling. The reason they won’t do it is brand hubris and pretense. I own many Leicas and appreciate much of what they do. I also come from owning the Fuji branded mark 2 variant of the XPan (which Fuji actually made for Hassy). And if I want a replacement for this I have the GFX 50R and the new aspect ratio guidelines in my A7CR. Leica should do this because this would improve the experience and also lead to more cinematic framing for shooting video. 16:9 is not cinematic. Respecrfully. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SnapshotGR Posted April 20 Share #49 Posted April 20 I agree. I doesn’t take much searching for people discussing digital Xpan. It is desirable and therefore a selling point. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simone_DF Posted April 20 Share #50 Posted April 20 17 hours ago, getoutofgotham said: Surprised by the pushback on this request. It’s not from a place of laziness that the OP arrives but of the benefit of families when shooting. This is no different than 35mm frame lines or any frame lines at all. It’s baffling to see so many responses attributing the request to anything else. Why are you surprised? For some ultra hardcore Leica users, if what you request is not on their wishlist, you shouldn’t have it either, because of the following: - you’re doing it wrong - “when I was a pro in 1850 we shot daguerreotypes and it was good enough” - you are clearly doing it wrong, twice - you are not Leica enough, go buy another brand - I know better than you what YOU need for your photography, and if you don’t agree, guess what? You’re doing it wrong 2 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SrMi Posted April 20 Share #51 Posted April 20 24 minutes ago, Simone_DF said: Why are you surprised? For some ultra hardcore Leica users, if what you request is not on their wishlist, you shouldn’t have it either, because of the following: - you’re doing it wrong - “when I was a pro in 1850 we shot daguerreotypes and it was good enough” - you are clearly doing it wrong, twice - you are not Leica enough, go buy another brand - I know better than you what YOU need for your photography, and if you don’t agree, guess what? You’re doing it wrong I think the objections are mainly against adding something people feel is unnecessary. If Leica would add every suggestion, it would turn its cameras into Sonys and Fujis. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simone_DF Posted April 20 Share #52 Posted April 20 6 minutes ago, SrMi said: I think the objections are mainly against adding something people feel is unnecessary. If Leica would add every suggestion, it would turn its cameras into Sonys and Fujis. 1. Unnecessary for the usual bunch of people listed above, since quite a few have been requesting it 2. Leica has already a selection of different crops, adding one more in the same panel won't change anything, especially to people that don't change crop modes or frame lines and won't even see it Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted April 20 Share #53 Posted April 20 On 4/18/2024 at 7:38 PM, wolfloid said: I see no reason why Leica cannot add crops to either the EVF or the LCD, which one can turn on or off, add or subtract. I would like the 56x24 X-Pan crop so that I can feel for the image I want to make. Those who want to shout about how they can do it in their head seem to be completely missing the point of having aids to pre-visualisation, which nearly all the best film directors use. I know what visualisation is, but pre-visualisation sounds like clairvoyance to me. 😝 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SrMi Posted April 20 Share #54 Posted April 20 1 minute ago, Simone_DF said: 1. Unnecessary for the usual bunch of people listed above, since quite a few have been requesting it 2. Leica has already a selection of different crops, adding one more in the same panel won't change anything, especially to people that don't change crop modes or frame lines and won't even see it While some may find it unnecessary, there is no need to disparage those who disagree. By the way, I am among those who have been requesting it, as I use it on X2D and would like to have it on SL3. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SrMi Posted April 20 Share #55 Posted April 20 2 minutes ago, jaapv said: I know what visualisation is, but pre-visualisation sounds like clairvoyance to me. 😝 From the Wiki page: Ansel Adams wrote about visualization in photography, defining it as "the ability to anticipate a finished image before making the exposure.”[2] The term previsualization has been attributed to Minor White, who divided visualization into previsualization, what occurs while studying the subject, and postvisualization, how the visualized image is rendered at printing. White said visualization was a "psychological concept" he learned from Adams and Edward Weston.[3] 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SrMi Posted April 20 Share #56 Posted April 20 On 4/18/2024 at 10:38 AM, wolfloid said: I see no reason why Leica cannot add crops to either the EVF or the LCD, which one can turn on or off, add or subtract. I would like the 56x24 X-Pan crop so that I can feel for the image I want to make. Note that most cameras do not offer an X-pan crop, i.e., it is more common not to offer it than to offer it. That said, Leica is not like most cameras 😄. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted April 20 Share #57 Posted April 20 Well, more like a para-psychological concept if you ask me. 😝 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Simone_DF Posted April 20 Share #58 Posted April 20 43 minutes ago, SrMi said: While some may find it unnecessary, there is no need to disparage those who disagree. By the way, I am among those who have been requesting it, as I use it on X2D and would like to have it on SL3. I don't disparage anyone, but the points above are the average answers when you go through many topics on the forum Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
getoutofgotham Posted April 20 Share #59 Posted April 20 While I understand, the general thought behind, not adding endless amounts of feature request, this particular feature request has history in photography and is very relevant to cinematography which pertains more and more to mirror cameras in hybrid, utilization of cameras, especially when you start to see cameras like the SL and the Q with strong video features. Furthermore, adding the ability to either define your own crop ratio or adding a classic one like this doesn’t really even come close to the avalanche of endless features that you might find in a Fuji menu system or a Sony one, but having said that even Sony menu systems lately really are not that bad, in my opinion, and I think adhering to these kinds of concerns limits the use of expensive comparison set of products and is not justifiable. my main point to note is that a lot of the rejection of this idea fell down on you can do this in post which utterly misses the point this is not something that you would wait to do and post because it changes how you see and if Leica is already known for having glass viewfinders on its rangefinder cameras. This concept is right in line with that and it makes no sense to me to respond with that. This isn’t about editing. This isn’t about processing. This is about seeing the scene just like a Director has a loupe. Anyway, wait for me to post a thread recommending that these cameras also do in camera de squeezing of anamorphic lenses at ultra wide aspect ratios because on the same basis, I believe they should offer that feature as well. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ianforber Posted April 20 Share #60 Posted April 20 Leica should add it into a visioflex, thereby encouraging more sales of them. Maybe even a x-pan special edition visioflex! 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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