cookedart Posted March 17 Share #21 Posted March 17 (edited) Advertisement (gone after registration) 8 hours ago, AussieQ said: Agree 100%, just take your photo and crop it in post. In camera crop to panoramic is just stupid and lazy. How is it any more stupid and lazy than the built in crop for 35,50,75,90? You can crop to those focal lengths in post as well, but it is obviously better to have a frame line or guide in-camera so you can shoot with the proper aspect ratio/framing straight away. Those who use the Xpan regularly know what I mean - you could have always cropped 6x6 or 35mm film to the xpan ratio, or can stitch multiple frames to get a panoramic frame, but it is entirely different to compose for the aspect ratio to begin with. Again, having the option for this but having it disabled by default seems like it would serve everyone but not take away anything. I would be OK with it either being an actual selectable aspect ratio, or to have it simply by an optional guide (like the rule of thirds markings). Edited March 17 by cookedart 1 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted March 17 Posted March 17 Hi cookedart, Take a look here Played a few days with it and the 60MPX sensor begs for a panoramic crop !!!. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
AussieQ Posted March 18 Share #22 Posted March 18 (edited) 15 hours ago, cookedart said: How is it any more stupid and lazy than the built in crop for 35,50,75,90? You can crop to those focal lengths in post as well, but it is obviously better to have a frame line or guide in-camera so you can shoot with the proper aspect ratio/framing straight away. Those who use the Xpan regularly know what I mean - you could have always cropped 6x6 or 35mm film to the xpan ratio, or can stitch multiple frames to get a panoramic frame, but it is entirely different to compose for the aspect ratio to begin with. Again, having the option for this but having it disabled by default seems like it would serve everyone but not take away anything. I would be OK with it either being an actual selectable aspect ratio, or to have it simply by an optional guide (like the rule of thirds markings). OMG Man, just take your photo and crop it. Everyone wants the easy way out today, whining about " oh Leica, I want a panorama crop so I can make a panorama because I obviously have no idea how to visualise or compose it when taking the photo"............. 30 plus years as a commercial shooter and never worried about having a panorama or any crop mode in any camera....probably cause i know how to take a photo and.....compose it. Edited March 18 by AussieQ 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NigelG Posted March 18 Share #23 Posted March 18 (edited) Good job that Josef Koudelka is such a crap photographer and obviously couldn't handle cropping in post (preferring a so "stupid + lazy" solution) that Leica customised a bespoke S2 for him with panoramic format framing so that he could replace his Fuji TX-1 / X-Pan then compose his no doubt not-as-good-as-yours images...🤔 Edited March 18 by NigelG 3 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NigelG Posted March 18 Share #24 Posted March 18 (edited) FYI the ASC 100 Edition M10-P allows for custom frame sizes to be entered and viewed on the included Visoflex 020 so having either fixed ratios "baked-in" as menu options or to allow a custom frame size setting for viewing in an attached EVF has already been done even on the M system... Edited March 18 by NigelG Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Qwertynm Posted March 18 Share #25 Posted March 18 vor 5 Stunden schrieb AussieQ: OMG Man, (...) who hurt you? jeez 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pelu2010 Posted March 18 Share #26 Posted March 18 On 5/31/2023 at 8:26 AM, jaapv said: Where does it stop? An 4x3 MFT ratio? A 1x1 Hasselblad ratio? A 16x9 ratio? A programmable ratio? There is a point at which the camera stops holding your hand. 1:1 ist there. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pelu2010 Posted March 18 Share #27 Posted March 18 Advertisement (gone after registration) Cheap Xpan Crop/nonCrop for Q3 and Q4 Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/377672-played-a-few-days-with-it-and-the-60mpx-sensor-begs-for-a-panoramic-crop/?do=findComment&comment=5112097'>More sharing options...
Olaf_ZG Posted March 18 Share #28 Posted March 18 22 minutes ago, Pelu2010 said: Cheap Xpan Crop/nonCrop for Q3 and Q4 Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Q4 is the expected q40/50? 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pelu2010 Posted March 18 Share #29 Posted March 18 40 minutes ago, Olaf_ZG said: Q4 is the expected q40/50? This cheapo method works with any Leica in any universe. But if Leica gives us 2:1 or 3:1, I would use it, I promise Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olaf_ZG Posted March 18 Share #30 Posted March 18 18 minutes ago, Pelu2010 said: This cheapo method works with any Leica in any universe. But if Leica gives us 2:1 or 3:1, I would use it, I promise The problem is, I only have black tape to cover the logos.., not as good and useful as yours is… Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pelu2010 Posted March 18 Share #31 Posted March 18 9 minutes ago, Olaf_ZG said: The problem is, I only have black tape to cover the logos.., not as good and useful as yours is… Ask me, I can send you a roll .... 🙂 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
liggy Posted March 18 Share #32 Posted March 18 On 6/14/2023 at 3:16 AM, pixelmixture said: of course it's a fair request ... i'm struggling to find a digital replacement for my beloved and still used xpan ... and the 60mpx and the electronic viewfinder are the main ingredient needed to achieve that ... The GFX 100S is excellent for shooting in that ratio and with 102 mp you have plenty of resolution to work with. Used they are a bargain these days. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cookedart Posted March 19 Share #33 Posted March 19 15 hours ago, AussieQ said: OMG Man, just take your photo and crop it. Everyone wants the easy way out today, whining about " oh Leica, I want a panorama crop so I can make a panorama because I obviously have no idea how to visualise or compose it when taking the photo"............. 30 plus years as a commercial shooter and never worried about having a panorama or any crop mode in any camera....probably cause i know how to take a photo and.....compose it. I'm sorry, but I still reiterate that it is not 'stupid' or 'lazy' to want a digital camera to give you an accurate reference for your framing. Again, Leica already includes this in the Q3 - to give you 35/50/75/90 crop framelines to help the user visualize these focal lengths. The Hasselblad XPan, the Fuji G617s, the Widelux, the Fuji G100 series, and the Panasonic L Mount series all give you options for panoramic framing, and in digital's case, can sometimes even offer options like 2:1 and 2.35:1, in addition to 65:24. Other cameras like the ASC M mentioned, or some Sony models also provide the option for custom frame guides. I'm not sure if you've noticed, but a 65:24 ratio is a VERY extreme crop, so 'visualizing' it is the issue here - having accurate framing on a crop like this is challenging if you are just 'guessing', and having a guide as an option seems entirely reasonable. Also, if you are shooting anamorphic, or for previsualizing framing for cinematic purposes, wider than 16:9 is also incredibly practical if your camera will give you an accurate representation. You can argue the validity of panoramic or wide aspect ratio in photography altogether. But do try to understand that photographers who do work in certain, less usual formats would like to have a reliable, repeatable method to frame their photographs at time of capture. Think about if you are making a series of work, of carefully composed artwork - leaving it to crop after the fact may be too 'loose' of a workflow if the photographer's intent is panoramic from the start. Just because it is not useful to you, does not mean it is stupid, or lazy. Your experience as a commercial shooter does not reflect what others may need for their shooting. And most importantly, including more options that people find useful does not take away in any way from your experience - providing additional aspect ratios to the Q3 would not impede your use of the camera at all, so I'm not sure, if it doesn't affect you, why you would care. 1 4 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cookedart Posted March 19 Share #34 Posted March 19 (edited) In the interest of contributing something actually useful, I tried giving myself some extra aids to help with 65:24 framing, without actually obscuring use of the LCD. Option A: put four pieces of grey gaffer's tape at the corners. When set to 50mm crop @3:2 ratio, this helps me at least be able to check the corners of my composition. Unfortunately since the 50mm frame lines are quite narrow, there's still quite a gap between the end of the frame line and where by tape starts. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Function:4/10, Looks: 4/10. Option B: I realized the expert shield screen protectors I use come with a spare protector. I measured and trimmed it so that it would align with the frame lines. It's actually maybe too subtle, but it works especially in daylight. And because it's subtle, it's doesn't interfere with viewing the LCD at all. The only downsides I can see is that you will feel the edge when swiping the LCD screen (i.e. when selecting an AF point), and it's so subtle that you may not be able to see it in lower light conditions. I am stacking two protectors on top of each other here. If you wanted to make it even less subtle, you could use a clear protector for the first layer, and a matte protector for the mask at top and bottom. Function: 8/10, Looks: 8/10 Edited March 19 by cookedart 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Function:4/10, Looks: 4/10. Option B: I realized the expert shield screen protectors I use come with a spare protector. I measured and trimmed it so that it would align with the frame lines. It's actually maybe too subtle, but it works especially in daylight. And because it's subtle, it's doesn't interfere with viewing the LCD at all. The only downsides I can see is that you will feel the edge when swiping the LCD screen (i.e. when selecting an AF point), and it's so subtle that you may not be able to see it in lower light conditions. I am stacking two protectors on top of each other here. If you wanted to make it even less subtle, you could use a clear protector for the first layer, and a matte protector for the mask at top and bottom. Function: 8/10, Looks: 8/10 ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/377672-played-a-few-days-with-it-and-the-60mpx-sensor-begs-for-a-panoramic-crop/?do=findComment&comment=5113733'>More sharing options...
ChrisQ3 Posted March 19 Share #35 Posted March 19 FUJIFILM just added the 5x4 aspect ratio to their latest camera (X100 VI) - would be great if Leica could add this too! Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisQ3 Posted March 19 Share #36 Posted March 19 On 5/30/2023 at 5:43 PM, pixelmixture said: hi, this little camera is amazing but i'm still struggling to replace my beloved xpan with a digital solution. It could be it... with the Q3 and M11 sensor a panoramic crop would be a killer feature ... hope leica is listening . I agree, something like 65:24 would be so useful…. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted March 19 Share #37 Posted March 19 I still think that Leica added the framelines to make the camera more M-like, not for any photographic purpose. Surely the composition of a photo should originate from the brain of the photographer and not from some camera holding one’s hand. Added to which the crop is better judged on a large computer screen than on the mini EVF. 1 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cookedart Posted March 19 Share #38 Posted March 19 6 minutes ago, jaapv said: I still think that Leica added the framelines to make the camera more M-like, not for any photographic purpose. Surely the composition of a photo should originate from the brain of the photographer and not from some camera holding one’s hand. Added to which the crop is better judged on a large computer screen than on the mini EVF. I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree. I would rather carefully compose my composition correct in camera, and be able to make small adjustments in post if needed. I am for sure accustomed to a 35mm lens on a 3:2 aspect ratio, and generally have a feel for the composition before I raise a viewfinder to my eye. However, for more extreme aspect ratios like 65:24, I think having clear guides is very helpful. With respect to the framelines, I think the more extreme crops like 50/75/90 are much better represented visually than imagined in your head. It does depend on your mentality, as I am more of a 'get it correct in camera' type person, rather than a 'fix it in post'. Neither approach is innately better than the other as both have pros and cons. But I do think there is validity in adding more helpful guides and aspect ratios to help whatever needs a photographer may need. 1 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted March 19 Share #39 Posted March 19 But what is the artistic value of specifically mimicking a focal length? Be glad that the Q expanded your creativity. Those focal length crops were forced by the limitations of film and interchangeable lenses. The Q3 removes such restrictions. Now you can crop to suit your subject. In fact, it allows one to avoid cut off heads and feet, boring repetitive central compositions, unwanted intrusive components, etc. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
SrMi Posted March 19 Share #40 Posted March 19 3 hours ago, jaapv said: I still think that Leica added the framelines to make the camera more M-like, not for any photographic purpose. Surely the composition of a photo should originate from the brain of the photographer and not from some camera holding one’s hand. Added to which the crop is better judged on a large computer screen than on the mini EVF. There is a reason for the director's viewfinder and for camera framelines offered by many manufacturers. It really helps with composition. Also, framing guidelines must be stored in DNG and applied in the post-processor so that one can see what was intended. That means that only those with Adobe software can use Leica's framelines. 1 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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