LocalHero1953 Posted November 13, 2017 Share #481 Posted November 13, 2017 Advertisement (gone after registration) Never understood how to operate those things w/o having improbable fingers around the nose. Some shooters are not chimpers and will never be. There will always be cameras for those "old" guys hopefully. The touch screen on the TL2, combined with icons, makes for a much quicker and more intuitive interface for settings menus than the M series, but I agree they are no good for controlling a camera while shooting - a joystick or navigation dial are much better. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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rosuna Posted November 13, 2017 Share #482 Posted November 13, 2017 The touch screen on the TL2, combined with icons, makes for a much quicker and more intuitive interface for settings menus than the M series, but I agree they are no good for controlling a camera while shooting - a joystick or navigation dial are much better. For controlling a camera while shooting the best solution is physical controls. That is why the ISO wheel is a good idea (it could be better implemented though). The two wheels of the TL are a very good (and necessary) solution. Nothing wrong with buttons and wheels for the manipulation of photographic parameters in a camera. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
mmarkuz Posted November 14, 2017 Share #483 Posted November 14, 2017 ...only thing I would miss from a UI perspective is the focus-joystick - it works great on the Q and SL 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaemono Posted November 14, 2017 Share #484 Posted November 14, 2017 (edited) I won’t draw final conclusions until I actually examine this in store and shoot some frames onto my own card for examination on my computer. But my hopes include: * IBIS, * SL-grade EVF, * SL’s autofocus speed, * weather resistance, * ruggedized mount for use with long lenses like 90-280mm IOW, I’m looking for a “mini SL”, professional-grade, APS camera capable of some wildlife and fast-action photography. However, my guess is that Leica’s XL design goal was for an interchangeable-lens X, great for family and travel photography, adaptable to M, SL, and R lenses, and built with traditional Leica materials, fit, and finish. They probably want to sell to a broad cross-section of Leica users, and expand TL lens sales. But I’m a fan of their SL professional family, and hope they soon push those capabilities into APS-C for added reach, and for the weight/size savings. And autofocus SPEED and ACCURACY are extremely important to me. More rumors SL EVF and lightening fast AF with the 18mm pancake they will introduce. Don‘t know how well the SL zooms will perform with it. On the rest, wait for the 22nd. As someone else said, their primary idea may be that it should make for a nice little discrete street camera. Edited November 14, 2017 by Chaemono 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted November 14, 2017 Share #485 Posted November 14, 2017 I'm afraid that Leica has include a Panasonic G9 in this new camera Well, apart from that being 4/3rds, it wouldn't be bad, seeing that it has an 80 MP Hi-Res mode. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest VVJ Posted November 14, 2017 Share #486 Posted November 14, 2017 (edited) More rumors SL EVF Interesting. By pairing up the EVFs it almost feels like they are targeting SL users with the new camera and M users with the existing TL... Edited November 14, 2017 by JorisV Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leicaiste Posted November 15, 2017 Share #487 Posted November 15, 2017 (edited) Advertisement (gone after registration) More rumors [emoji4] SL EVF and lightening fast AF with the 18mm pancake they will introduce. Don‘t know how well the SL zooms will perform with it. On the rest, wait for the 22nd. As someone else said, their primary idea may be that it should make for a nice little discrete street camera.If it has the SL EVF I am ready to forgive about the design but not the lack of IBIS. [emoji6] Edited November 15, 2017 by Leicaiste 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest VVJ Posted November 15, 2017 Share #488 Posted November 15, 2017 ...only thing I would miss from a UI perspective is the focus-joystick - it works great on the Q and SL Me too. That being said, only the SL has a joystick. The Q has a four-way controller. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tritentrue Posted November 15, 2017 Share #489 Posted November 15, 2017 (edited) What I got through the grapevine: Name will probably be "CL." 1/8000 mechanical shutter. Same EVF as the Typ 020, but without GPS. Leaked photos are the actual camera. Appears to be a tandem (my word choice) product rather than an upgrade. Price slightly more than that of current TL2 + external EVF. No mention of IBIS or PDAF. Edited November 15, 2017 by tritentrue 5 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ecaton Posted November 15, 2017 Share #490 Posted November 15, 2017 What's no to like. If it pairs as well with M-lenses as the Ricoh GXR-M-mount does I will be a buyer. This compact body with high res EVF and capable sensor coupled with the smaller and lighter m-glass will be a treat for traveling light. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaemono Posted November 15, 2017 Share #491 Posted November 15, 2017 What I got through the grapevine: Name will probably be "CL." 1/8000 mechanical shutter. Same EVF as the Typ 020, but without GPS. Leaked photos are the actual camera. Appears to be a tandem (my word choice) product rather than an upgrade. Price slightly more than that of current TL2 + external EVF. No mention of IBIS or PDAF. Probably spot on. The only point I would bet against is the EVF for good reasons. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
helged Posted November 15, 2017 Share #492 Posted November 15, 2017 ... Appears to be a tandem (my word choice) product rather than an upgrade. ... Just to enlighten the view through grapevined glasses...: Does 'tandem' indicate that the CL is essentially similar to the TL2 except for the build-in EVF? Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted November 15, 2017 Share #493 Posted November 15, 2017 What I got through the grapevine: Name will probably be "CL." 1/8000 mechanical shutter. Same EVF as the Typ 020, but without GPS. Leaked photos are the actual camera. Appears to be a tandem (my word choice) product rather than an upgrade. Price slightly more than that of current TL2 + external EVF. No mention of IBIS or PDAF. In that case it is not going to sell. No USP and too expensive. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tritentrue Posted November 15, 2017 Share #494 Posted November 15, 2017 Just to enlighten the view through grapevined glasses...: Does 'tandem' indicate that the CL is essentially similar to the TL2 except for the build-in EVF? That was my impression, though the "grapevine" raised the possibility that there could be other features to which the "grapevine" was not privy. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
lanetomlane Posted November 15, 2017 Share #495 Posted November 15, 2017 In that case it is not going to sell. No USP and too expensive. I don't know Jaap. From what I've read there're probably going to sell one to me. Sounds ideal as a lightweight travel camera. I have the T and the three zones which are superb. I like the T but sometimes find it frustratingly slow and so this could be a potential upgrade of the body. Cheers, Tom Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
earleygallery Posted November 15, 2017 Share #496 Posted November 15, 2017 I really hope the rumours are wrong. I've said before, Leica could make a superb APS-C system camera. This (the mock up we've seen) isn't it. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
scott kirkpatrick Posted November 15, 2017 Share #497 Posted November 15, 2017 (edited) Leaked photos are the actual camera. Appears to be a tandem (my word choice) product rather than an upgrade. It looks like a parallel product, using the same or similar innards, same lenses, but supporting a very different shooting style, and thus probably a different set of customers than the TL2. "Tandem," like two on a bike, suggests one follows the other. It's total speculation on my part, but if Leica has sold a lot of Q's, this is a more sustainable approach to the same bunch of customers. Edited November 15, 2017 by scott kirkpatrick Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
tritentrue Posted November 15, 2017 Share #498 Posted November 15, 2017 It looks like a parallel product, using the same or similar innards, same lenses, but supporting a very different shooting style, and thus probably a different set of customers than the TL2. "Tandem," like two on a bike, suggests one follows the other. It's total speculation on my part, but if Leica has sold a lot of Q's, this is a more sustainable approach to the same bunch of customers. That one was introduced to the market in July and the other, presumably, in November would seem to fit your definition of "tandem." Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaapv Posted November 15, 2017 Share #499 Posted November 15, 2017 I don't know Jaap. From what I've read there're probably going to sell one to me. Sounds ideal as a lightweight travel camera. I have the T and the three zones which are superb. I like the T but sometimes find it frustratingly slow and so this could be a potential upgrade of the body. Cheers, Tom If this is the final camera, it seems to be a rather confused concept. Sure, some customers will find it useful, there will be nothing wrong with the quality, But: As a backup to the SL? The TL2 is as good, especially with the EVF detached, and cheaper. As a companion to the TL2? Too expensive and esthetically aimed at a different user group. No added photographic value. As a Fuji competitor? At this price point and lack of tricks and features? As a second string to the M using an adapter? Too large, too expensive. EVF not good enough in comparison with the M camera's OVF. As a replacement of the X-Vario? Not too many X-Varios out there to be replaced, With a zoom lens added a very expensive camera. So it will have to sell on its own merits - I do not hold out much expectations. What attraction does it have over the competition, apart from the red dot? Still, let's hope the market proves me utterly wrong. Actually, I would not be surprised if the event were about another product, yet to be revealed. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dkCambridgeshire Posted November 15, 2017 Share #500 Posted November 15, 2017 As the release date draws near, the usual condemnations of a new Leica product are gathering momentum … to be expected … especially from those who have seldom used … or never owned … a modern Leica digital camera. Keep up the so predictable negativity lads dunk Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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