EVF M rumoured

[willeica]

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4 minutes ago, pgk said:

Its a logical solution for many reasons, though not perhaps the one many might find to their taste.

There is more than taste involved. Size and the 'millions' of M lenses 'in the wild' will also be factors. The L mount lenses are designed for autofocus and their size reflects that.

William 

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[LocalHero1953]

47 minutes ago, pgk said:

I wonder how people would react if the announcement (if any) turns out to be an M shaped, L mount, EVF camera?🤯

I’d be more interested in this than the more likely M-mount. 

I suspect it would be simple to make, but I can foresee practical/usability problems:

Power for AF: the M battery would probably be inadequate. Solution: ever improving battery efficiency (more power in a smaller unit). 

Heat generation: too much of it in a small body dating from 1953 and not optimised for heat dissipation. Solution: ever increasing energy efficiency of electronics. 

I’m sure there are others. They are all soluble - if you spend enough money to get the latest battery and chip tech. 

Then there are the expectations of M users. To have an L-mount, the sensor would have to be brought forward; that would mean M lenses, on an adapter, would stick out more than people are used to. It wouldn’t feel ‘right’!

Edited Friday at 10:14 AM by LocalHero1953

[pgk]

14 minutes ago, LocalHero1953 said:

I’d be more interested in this than the more likely M-mount. 

I suspect it would be simple to make, but I can foresee practical/usability problems:

Other manufacturers make small cameras without the problems that you mention. The battery would need to be small and efficient but others make such batteries. And heat dissipation is dealt with in small bodies too.

To me an EVF-M will almost certainly be too compromised and if by nothing else, by the M mount.

Leica's problem is straightforward; one of how many they will be able to sell to make a profit.

I have no interest in such a camera despite having used Ms for over 40 years. For an EVF-M to appeal to people outside of existing M users is a big ask especially if it hobbled by the M mount (hence the suggested L mount which offers vastly more options, and some have actually said that such a body would be of interest)). I for one would buy a different EVF body (probably a Nikon as they have the shortest flange to sensor distance) if I wanted to move into using such a body now. As it is my Sony bodies do a very credible if not perfect job, are extremely versatlie and produce great image files. Which leaves an EVF-M with a small marketplace IMO. But we will see what Leica come up with idc.

Edited Friday at 10:25 AM by pgk

[AZach]

57 minutes ago, pgk said:

I wonder how people would react if the announcement (if any) turns out to be an M shaped, L mount, EVF camera?🤯

So something more like a CL with full-frame sensor??

[pgk]

1 minute ago, AZach said:

So something more like a CL with full-frame sensor??

I assume so.

[Stef63]

The expectations flying around about what this mystery camera will, should, or absolutely must have, are already reaching intergalactic levels. That’s the perfect recipe for a spectacularly long thread full of disappointment starting on October 23rd — if (and only if) anything is even announced.

If Leica is cooking up an EVF-based M, chances are it’s basically an M11 where the rangefinder has quietly retired and been replaced by a built-in Visoflex, plus a bit of software magic for focus aids. That’s it.

So please, let’s park the fantasies of an M with an L-mount or a Q with an M-mount. It’s not going to happen. Ever.

Voilà — my humble speculation (and future “I told you so” post)

[lct]

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44 minutes ago, Stef63 said:

[...] If Leica is cooking up an EVF-based M, chances are it’s basically an M11 where the rangefinder has quietly retired and been replaced by a built-in Visoflex, plus a bit of software magic for focus aids [...]

+1 Plus a look a-la-Q possibly. This way the LUF can discuss for 300 pages if the EVF-M is a Q or an M camera Too bad for L mount lovers but my Sigma FPL works fine with several M lenses already. We've got PanaLeica cameras after all. Why not a SigmaLeica with a built-in EVF? Could be an entry model in the L system, the same way as the EVF-M could be an entry model in the M system, or the lack of Q system for lovers of it.

 

Edited Friday at 11:18 AM by lct

[LocalHero1953]

46 minutes ago, Stef63 said:

So please, let’s park the fantasies

Good luck with that, King Canute

[LocalHero1953]

 I agree that other brands do things that we might want and Leica does not offer, but a body is only one end of the system. If I bought a Nikon or Sony, I would need the lenses to go with it*. Since I doubt my photography would be improved (or made worse) by Nikon or Sony, and I already have the L and M lenses I want, I have no intention of buying into another system for a marginal change in functionality, usability or aesthetics.

 

* I have little interest in using M lenses on bodies they are not designed for.

Edited Friday at 11:30 AM by LocalHero1953

[pgk]

6 minutes ago, LocalHero1953 said:

Good luck with that, King Canute

But this IS a gear forum in which the belief that the next best thing will produce better photographs persists. Depite that is, the continual nods to the past and its photographers. Perhaps we should refer to threads like this as 'Canutey' threads?

[pgk]

5 minutes ago, LocalHero1953 said:

* I have little interest in using M lenses on bodies they are not designed for.

They work, quite well, even if perhaps not as well as they could. Mostly though the images shot using lenses in ways not intended can be very acceptable. When you think about it M lenses were not intended for use with an EVF camera either.

I've spent a lot of my photographic life using cameras in ways they were not intended to be used - namely underwater behind concentric domes which compromise their optics. At the end of the day the image is what matters and the flaws it contains can be overridden by content surparisingly easily. Allied to this though is viability of equipment in use. So I've recently added a Nikon dSLR and housing to shoot macro. My Sony system works really well underwater for wide-angle but is not so effective for macro which it was struggling with in dull temperate conditions.

And if you are wondering why I comment all this then it is because I see too many flaws in an EVF-M concept to make it really usable, and I write as someone who uses a lot of manual focus lenses with EVF cameras and have even built by own Arca based system to do so. They can be very effective but I don't think that such cameras lend themselves well to be better than an rf-M within its operating envelope.

Edited Friday at 11:39 AM by pgk

[LocalHero1953]

Just now, pgk said:

They work, quite well, even if perhaps not as well as they could. Mostly though the images shot using lenses in ways not intended can be very acceptable. When you think about it M lenses were not intended for use with an EVF camera either.

Agreed. I just prefer using a body and lens that can fully use each other's capabilities. I have used the Summilux-M 75 on the SL2-S, but kept wishing it had AF! I have none of those mismatched expectations on a M body (it is a film M in my case now).

[Stef63]

15 minutes ago, LocalHero1953 said:

Good luck with that, King Canute

Fair — prophets do the same: preaching the unbelievable until reality rudely refuses to cooperate. 🤔

[luigi bertolotti]

2 hours ago, pgk said:

I wonder how people would react if the announcement (if any) turns out to be an M shaped, L mount, EVF camera?🤯

Too smart to be true...😁

[algrove]

5 hours ago, anickpick said:

We live in a world that is so fast-paced that we post all our milestones on Instagram before the stone is even properly set in the ground. Let’s retire the metaphor. It served its purpose, but now it's as redundant as a paper map in a self-driving car.

That last sentence is priceless to me.

[algrove]

3 hours ago, UliWer said:

If you re-read the whole thread you will get a nice selection of possible reactions.

That would take me past 23 October so I will skip the reread of thousands of guesses.

[DadDadDaddyo]

Presuming that a new EVF-equipped body might have increased resolution, I'd like to see that new screen incorporated into the Visoflex 3.

[Smogg]

I'm curious if the development and production cost of this camera is more than $1500 or not?

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Hallo,

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[charlesphoto99]

A 'milestone' could be the 35mm f1.2/1.0 - which would be Leica's first 35mm sub 1.4, therefore a 'milestone' and one which only a few will be able, or want to, afford. 

[T25UFO]

2 hours ago, Stef63 said:

The expectations flying around about what this mystery camera will, should, or absolutely must have, are already reaching intergalactic levels.

Well, intergalactic levels within a very small subset of the population that contribute to this online forum.  

I can't be bothered to go back and check, but my guess is there are around 70 contributors to this thread, of which 20% (14) have contributed about 80% (2625) of the posts.  It would be interesting if Admin could check - I'm sure there is a simple way of collating this data.