Goodbye, M11!

[Photoworks]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

2 hours ago, RF’sDelight said:

What annoys me the most at the moment is that I accidentally change the exposure compensation via the thumbwheel just by using/holding/raising the camera. Does this happen to anyone else? 

you could set the turning to ISO that works when the ISO is on M, and have pressing to Exposure comp.

[hdmesa]

^ Adding a thumb grip also helps prevent ham-finger syndrome.

[setuporg]

Funny how this thread diverged into D features:). I don’t need to buy anything, I have all the other generations.  The original D is Edition 60, and it pairs well with the M246 for a fat battery and a weird movie capability that is handy with kids.  The M10M/R is a reliable lair of  hands.  The M9-P colors are awesome.  I loved many features of the M11 family but it became a bit much.  Back to basics!  Packed a Zeiss Ikon ZM for my trip as well…

[fenykepesz]

vor 9 Minuten schrieb setuporg:

Packed a Zeiss Ikon ZM for my trip as well…

just grab, i suggest, your pics earlier from your camera this time...

Edited November 24, 2024 by fenykepesz

[hdmesa]

13 minutes ago, setuporg said:

Funny how this thread diverged into D features:)...

Because it sounded like the catalyst for your decision?

13 minutes ago, setuporg said:

...I don’t need to buy anything, I have all the other generations...

Probably makes it much easier to give up on the M11 gen.

 

[SrMi]

Here is a reminder of M11's advantages.

- Much improved live view and EVF

- Improved PDR (1 stop at base ISO)

- Triple-resolution modes.

- Multi-field metering with rangefinder.

- Lower base ISO (shooting wide in bright light).

- Electronic shutter (sharper images with longer lenses, less noise, even higher shutter speed when shooting in bright light).

- Much better battery life.

- Long exposure (up to 60 min) works really well.

- Lighter camera body (black).

- In-camera body charging.

- More buttons, similar setup as SL2

- Quick battery and SD card access.

- Theoretically, there is better flare resistance as the chamber has more room.

M10s are still great cameras, especially if used mostly as rangefinders.

[hdmesa]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

19 minutes ago, SrMi said:

- Multi-field metering with rangefinder.

– Live metering from the sensor in all metering modes

[hdmesa]

11 hours ago, setuporg said:

...I've kept my trusted pair of M10-R/M... [etc. / older cameras]

(I'm only quoting you to make my point to others, not to sway you personally.)

I think it's important to remember that Leica digital M and "trusted" often takes time. Just posting these screenshots of search results specific to this forum for perspective.

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

 

[IkarusJohn]

3 hours ago, evikne said:

It shouldn't be necessary to have a thumbwheel on a D at all. I don't think it fits in there.

And what exactly do we need a thumbwheel for? To choose things? I thought the D experience was about not having to have so many choices.

That was my first reaction, along with the front button.  But then I found that, with the EVF, if you press the fn button, the fical point scrolls across the screen - clunky, but effective.  If I could remember what the front button does, I’d use it.  No issue with changing the EV compensation, as it’s on the rear wheel.  I know this is much maligned, but I rather like it. It does mean I turn the camera on and leave it on (I prefer the power swith on the collar around the shutter release).  Battery power has never been a problem for me, as I don’t take enough images on an outing to threaten a full charge.

I pretty much like everything about the M10-D, and there’s nothing in the M11 series I need (though the internal SSD, USB-C and loss of the baseplate are attractive developments).

I remain happy with my M9M, M10-D and M-A (though I would like the film advance lever tolock the shutter, like over 40 years of film Nikons).  I see no point fretting over what my cameras don’t do; rather than working out how they work for me …

[lct]

As the saying goes, it's the best that go 😉 Been a pleasure to discuss with you anyway.

[Mahesh]

3 hours ago, SrMi said:

Here is a reminder of M11's advantages.

- Much improved live view and EVF

- Improved PDR (1 stop at base ISO)

- Triple-resolution modes.

- Multi-field metering with rangefinder.

- Lower base ISO (shooting wide in bright light).

- Electronic shutter (sharper images with longer lenses, less noise, even higher shutter speed when shooting in bright light).

- Much better battery life.

- Long exposure (up to 60 min) works really well.

- Lighter camera body (black).

- In-camera body charging.

- More buttons, similar setup as SL2

- Quick battery and SD card access.

- Theoretically, there is better flare resistance as the chamber has more room.

M10s are still great cameras, especially if used mostly as rangefinders.

- pictures that you have taken 

[DadDadDaddyo]

Interesting thread. Whatever decision each of us comes to over time, it's important that it meets our needs; that should be all the validation required. 

This week I've finally parted with my M10M. The reason? It has been sitting unused since I got hold of my M11M. I had retained it for so long, many months, mostly out of a heartfelt sense of just how good it was, that it somehow was better to hang onto it for any potential future need for it. A backup body? A spare? An alternative? But reality... Reality was that I simply never reached for it again, not with access to the M11M.

If I had no M11M, if there maybe had never been an M11M released, I'm absolutely certain the M10M could have met and exceeded my needs forever. It was that good for me. 

But again, for this particular guy, the M11M is better. 

I *almost decided to part with my M11, since for color work I've been using the Fujifilm Medium Format system more lately. But then...

...after some reflective periods, with and without the bodies in question in my hands, I came to the conclusion that, for me, and for most of my work, the "Mirrorless Body with Electronic Viewfinder All The Time" approach was placing a subtle but unmistakable curtain, a veil, a layer of abstraction, not just between me and my subjects, but between my seeing and the my reaching for the images I was trying to produce. 

You don't look *through an electronic viewfinder. You look *at it, either with two eyes on the rear screen or with one eye peering through a loupe at the viewfinder image. 

I *think some of the attraction folks feel toward the rear-screenless versions of the M-series may reflect this. There is an immediacy to the optical viewfinder with bright-line frame lines that's been noticed, discussed, forgotten about, rediscovered, noticed, and discussed, again and again.

The rear screen, for me, is there as a contingency, something to call upon when needed. It's not an inherent part of the picture making process (again, for me), except in those cases in which it becomes the analog to the ground glass or the rear-projection reflex finder of days gone by. 

Here's the thing. I had kind of forgotten, then kind of remembered, then double-checked: Auto-Review can not only be set to various durations (mine is usually set to 2 seconds), it can also be turned Off...

Huh...

I guess I don't see the functional advantage to the screenless M-series bodies (for me), except possibly as statements (and I don't need my camera body to be one). If one is overusing Auto-Review, or one doesn't want it as part of the picture making process all the time, one can turn it off. 

Many paths to serenity...

[IkarusJohn]

10 hours ago, DadDadDaddyo said:

You don't look *through an electronic viewfinder. You look *at it, either with two eyes on the rear screen or with one eye peering through a loupe at the viewfinder image. 

Interesting.

[LocalHero1953]

I have a mind and eye that isn't disturbed by the difference between EVF and OVF. They persuade me that when I look at an EVF I am really looking through a VF at the world - however it is made. And with the full image view of the SL series, I will occasionally use my left eye to see what's going on outside the frame while still looking through the EVF with my right eye. 

[Cobram]

I used to own M9 -- > great camera. Traded in for M10 --> also a great camera.

M240 and M11 are not tempting to me due to specific color signature (yes I know... old debate... different views...no proofs... 😅)

Still I think I will pass M11 and wait till M12 to see if it is any improvement comparing to M10R. The latter is my next target if M12 will not bring something substantial on the tabel.

[Tseg]

I guess to the extent that I have an M11-D that doesn't freeze nor have memory/data issues nor doesn't have color issues and due to my photography enthusiasm, value the intent of a digital camera without a LCD screen, I should be satisfied, if not enthusiastic.  Well, in fact, that is the case, so far.  At this point, I have never been into "film" nor film development, nor scanning, but I also have an aversion to watching people walking around with their faces in their iPhone screens.  To me, it is anti-social.  I like to snap and smile, vs. snap and chimp.  The D series is ideal for me, and having an M11-D that functions properly brings much joy to my photography hobby.  There is a ruggedness about the D that is enduring.  I have a 12 year old Sony RX1 that has been across the world with me with a chipped LCD screen.  Unlike patinaed brass, broken glass is not attractive, nor soothing when rubbing one's finger over it.

I feel bad about the OP's journey with the M11-D but am glad he has an acceptable back-up plan.  If I had a stash of M cameras I collected over the years, I may feel differently, but at this point, for my first M camera, I can't say I wish I had a different D or even a different M model than the M11-D.

I hope I didn't hex myself. 😎

Edited November 25, 2024 by Tseg

[satijntje]

I also went back to the M10 platform 

[tom0511]

For each his own choice.

I am quite happy moving to M11 and M11M, and wouldnt want to go back. M10R was great for me, M11 even better for my needs.

[Smogg]

1 hour ago, Tseg said:

I guess to the extent that I have an M11-D that doesn't freeze nor have memory/data issues nor doesn't have color issues and due to my photography enthusiasm, value the intent of a digital camera without a LCD screen, I should be satisfied, if not enthusiastic.  Well, in fact, that is the case, so far.  At this point, I have never been into "film" nor film development, nor scanning, but I also have an aversion to watching people walking around with their faces in their iPhone screens.  To me, it is anti-social.  I like to snap and smile, vs. snap and chimp.  The D series is ideal for me, and having an M11-D that functions properly brings much joy to my photography hobby.  There is a ruggedness about the D that is enduring.  I have a 12 year old Sony RX1 that has been across the world with me with a chipped LCD screen.  Unlike patinaed brass, broken glass is not attractive, nor soothing when rubbing one's finger over it.

I feel bad about the OP's journey with the M11-D but am glad he has an acceptable back-up plan.  If I had a stash of M cameras I collected over the years, I may feel differently, but at this point, for my first M camera, I can't say I wish I had a different D or even a different M model than the M11-D.

I hope I didn't hex myself. 😎

What do you do when the person you just photographed on the street asks you to delete the photo?😀

[Advertisement]

Hallo,

Look here: Interesting Leica gear

[jaapv]

You delete it whilst he is looking.