Post honeymoon M 11 opinions. Have re-evaluations come into play?

[galleryg]

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Hello all. I am not very active on forums usually, although I have enjoyed and learned much from following this one. I feel a big thank you is in order before I continue.  THANK  YOU!

Having just recently acquired my M11 (black) I am not in a real position to give an in-depth evaluation of what has been for me a truly wonderful camera in use so far. I am really interested in the opinions of some of the seasoned M enthusiasts/Pros of the M11 now that they have had a few months living with it. For me, my purchase was primarily driven by features (battery life, UI, Grip update, weight reduction etc.) and updated processor, not by the increased sensor resolution. Those items mentioned alone have made my choice to upgrade feel like it was the right decision. Owning a SL2 and a Q2M as my other cameras, taking possession and starting to use the new M11 made me feel right at home.  I found a huge benefit in switching between cameras now did not require that I switch gears mentally to work in the M ecosystem. Any insights as to discovered quirks or experiences with M11 files in LR/PS would be graciously appreciated

Edited May 25, 2022 by galleryg

[Gelatino]

After the honeymoon starts a loooooong period of life as a couple.😍  ...😩....🙄...🤔...😘...😇.........♿           😂

Edited May 25, 2022 by Gelatino

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[lct]

Only issue is the lack of IBIS at 1/f and slower shutter speeds for me but better make your own experience as this depends upon hands steadiness mainly. 

[itsrishabh]

1 hour ago, lct said:

Only issue is the lack of IBIS at 1/f and slower shutter speeds for me but better make your own experience as this depends upon hands steadiness mainly. 

Agreed with this - everything is amazing and I’ve been able to pull off 1/2f + 1/4f but 1/f is surprisingly hard without high shutter speeds and/or ISO.

I do prefer the M setup I have now versus the A7Rii I was using prior. The A7 series taught me how to shoot images, the Leica M series is teaching me how to tell stories.

[lct]

14 minutes ago, itsrishabh said:

I do prefer the M setup I have now versus the A7Rii I was using prior.

Different beasts. For slow shutter speeds my A7r2 mod with IBIS is unbeatable. As often (always?) at Leica the M11 is a superb but lacking camera.

[hdmesa]

4 hours ago, lct said:

Different beasts. For slow shutter speeds my A7r2 mod with IBIS is unbeatable. As often (always?) at Leica the M11 is a superb but lacking camera.

Every other camera is “lacking” a true optical rangefinder 🙃

[lct]

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9 minutes ago, hdmesa said:

Every other camera is “lacking” a true optical rangefinder 🙃

An RF with IBIS would remain an RF i guess but the OP wanted to know if the M11 has some quirks so i can hardly refrain from telling him that the M11 has indeed a major quirk for a 60mp camera i.e. the lack of IBIS that prevents me from taking photos at 1/f and slower shutter speeds the same way as i did with all my other RF cameras from the M3 to the M240. Not to say that i dislike the M11, i feel it a superb camera otherwise, but it lacks on slower shutter speeds contrary to the Leitz and Leica tradition so i see no reason fo hiding the truth, or at lest my truth, on this point .

[hdmesa]

3 minutes ago, lct said:

An RF with IBIS would remain an RF i guess but the OP wanted to know if the M11 has some quirks so i can hardly refrain from telling him that the M11 has indeed a major quirk for a 60mp camera i.e. the lack of IBIS that prevents me from taking photos at 1/f and slower shutter speeds the same way as i did with all my other RF cameras from the M3 to the M240. Not to say that i dislike the M11, i feel it a superb camera otherwise, but it lacks on slower shutter speeds contrary to the Leitz and Leica tradition so i see no reason fo hiding the truth, or at lest my truth, on this point .

Absolutely. At lower shutter speeds handheld, my SL2-S photos at 24mp with IBIS resolve more detail than the M11 at 60mp.

[galleryg]

1 hour ago, lct said:

An RF with IBIS would remain an RF i guess but the OP wanted to know if the M11 has some quirks so i can hardly refrain from telling him that the M11 has indeed a major quirk for a 60mp camera i.e. the lack of IBIS that prevents me from taking photos at 1/f and slower shutter speeds the same way as i did with all my other RF cameras from the M3 to the M240. Not to say that i dislike the M11, i feel it a superb camera otherwise, but it lacks on slower shutter speeds contrary to the Leitz and Leica tradition so i see no reason fo hiding the truth, or at lest my truth, on this point .

Frankly I had expected more insight than people bemoaning the lack of IBIS. In normal daylight it is not needed and in dim light there are options to deal with the situation. The M11 after all is not a magic robotic box. Obviously you must employ photographic skills to deal with such situations. You can do all that you say is not possible, I know this because even  as a relative newcomer I already have. All you have to do is not shoot at the L DNG setting for the circumstance that you present. The M11 even at S DNG is capable of 1/f captures that produce images that rival or exceed those of the M3 or M240 with just some basic photographer skills

[hdmesa]

12 minutes ago, galleryg said:

Frankly I had expected more insight than people bemoaning the lack of IBIS. In normal daylight it is not needed and in dim light there are options to deal with the situation. The M11 after all is not a magic robotic box. Obviously you must employ photographic skills to deal with such situations. You can do all that you say is not possible, I know this because even  as a relative newcomer I already have. All you have to do is not shoot at the L DNG setting for the circumstance that you present. The M11 even at S DNG is capable of 1/f captures that produce images that rival or exceed those of the M3 or M240 with just some basic photographer skills

It certainly is a magic robotic box compared to a film M. Bring on the magic, lol.

[lct]

19 minutes ago, galleryg said:

Frankly I had expected more insight than people bemoaning the lack of IBIS. In normal daylight it is not needed and in dim light there are options to deal with the situation. The M11 after all is not a magic robotic box. Obviously you must employ photographic skills to deal with such situations. You can do all that you say is not possible, I know this because even  as a relative newcomer I already have. All you have to do is not shoot at the L DNG setting for the circumstance that you present. The M11 even at S DNG is capable of 1/f captures that produce images that rival or exceed those of the M3 or M240 with just some basic photographer skills

I beg your pardon? I did not ask for anything here. You wanted others' advices. You got mine. Do what you want with it. And please don't teach me how to use an M camera i began half a century ago.

[hdmesa]

10 minutes ago, lct said:

I beg your pardon? I did not ask for anything here. You wanted others' advices. You got mine. Do what you want with it. And please don't teach me how to use an M camera i began half a century ago.

They are probably a banned user with a new account anyway. No like/laugh/thank reactions to any of the posts in their own thread is sometimes a sign.

[galleryg]

6 minutes ago, lct said:

I beg your pardon? I did not ask for anything here. You wanted others' advices. You got mine. Do what you want with it. And please don't teach me how to use an M camera i began half a century ago.

Pardon me. Teaching you was not my intention, just pointing out facts. It seems I have come across the wrong way. I was hoping that some users well versed in the M ecosystem might provide insight to the M11's  idiosyncrasies comparatively and how they might have been dealt with. Considering that, perhaps they then might offer an updated opinion or insight based on more exposure to the day to day workings with it.

[lct]

1 minute ago, galleryg said:

I was hoping that some users well versed in the M ecosystem might provide insight to the M11's  idiosyncrasies comparatively and how they might have been dealt with.

OK so do you want to know how i deal with the camera shake issue?  If not it is not a problem but i don't want to hurt you.

[galleryg]

4 minutes ago, lct said:

OK so do you want to know how i deal with the camera shake issue?  If not it is not a problem but i don't want to hurt you.

That would be welcome. Thanks

[lct]

OK so you own other cameras with IBIS if i understand well so you may wish to use your M11 a different way. For 1/2f and faster shutter speeds you will just need a normal concentration if you have some experience with M cameras already. At 1/f and below things become more difficult. There is no real problem if you don't pixel peep but if you're used to doing 100% crops you could be disappointed. My better tip is use a tripod if you can. Otherwise click-click-click give better results that one click alone curiously enough, there is generally a shot sharper than others. I did it at 1/20s handheld here but it is hit and miss generally, better shoot at 1/2f or 1/3f if you can, other colleagues here prefer 1/4f. (M11, Summicron 50/2 v4, f/2, 1/20s, 6400 iso, FF & 100% crop).

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

Edited May 26, 2022 by lct

[LennyTheLion]

13 hours ago, Gelatino said:

After the honeymoon starts a loooooong period of life as a couple.😍  ...😩....🙄...🤔...😘...😇.........♿           😂

And then DIVORCE !

[jaapv]

Please, gentlemen, keep it civil. There are more serious problems in this world. 

[jaapv]

It appears to me that the practical fact that high-resolution cameras are more prone to motion blur than lesser examples, for the simple reason that a hi-res camera will resolve a small amount of blur that a lower resolution camera will not, making the former appear less sharp than the latter, has not yet penetrated into part of this thread.

As long as Leica does not call in a swarm of electrons and a few miniature gnomes to address this problem through IBIS and/or OIS, the only recourse the afflicted M user will have is to improve her/his shooting technique - now where did I hear that before about Leica M cameras?

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[caloosajo]

I’m smitten with the M11, but arguably easy to please. This is my 4th digital M and I continue to use a Leica MP 0.72 in parallel. I was veryyy skeptical of the M11 upon its release (cough-cough-no baseplate), but have found that the features it shares with the Q2 do not detract from the essentials of the M.

As to the belly-aching re: motion blur at 60mp, I have long since accepted that high megapixel cameras (M10 Monochrom being the archetype) simply operate on a different exposure triangle than what I was accustomed to. So what if the minimum shutter speed becomes 1/125th or 1/250th? The headroom of ISO 10,000 (or admittedly 32,000 for M10M) is more than enough—for me—to deliver in-focus images. Or I lean into the blur and expand my mind creatively. Similar approach to when I’m chasing my toddler with Delta 100 loaded. Lightning may very well strike. The essence of why I love the M.