Leica M11 image quality (?)

[fbonde]

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On 1/14/2022 at 3:50 AM, Oswalt said:

It's quite possible. C1 definitely had issues/delays fixing quirks with M10R profiles. I unfortunately don't use Adobe at all anymore as the results almost always end up being poorer in comparison to C1. LR upon export looks as if there's Vaseline smeared over the final result in comparison to C1. I have tried endlessly to try and fix it, but have since given up and moved my workflow over to C1. 
 

Anyways, I'm looking forward to discussions and seeing results from other members in the oncoming weeks. 

C1 22 has really not been the best for me. For instance, Files from my M10 mono; when I try to merge  HDR files or the new panorama feature, the dng's it generates, can't be rad by C1 afterwards. Very strange. I think it's because the lack the ICC profile (no color) its on the C1 forum as well. I have been in contact with the support and they promised that this will be fixed within the next update. 

Things takes time with C1. 

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[Hanno]

I am confused by the comments on C1. They released a profile for the M11 on Wednesday or Thursday (I don’t remember which day I downloaded it).

[jffielde]

Those are nice, Artin.  The most compelling I've seen.  Thanks for sharing them.

[Torontoamateur]

I do not understand how Leica can implicitly say the M11 is so much better than the Prior Leicas and in that way make them obsolete  I paid BIG money for my M240 when new and now to hear that is it not good enough??  This means Leica will say the same bout the M11 in a few years. So why bother getting a camera Leica will make obsolete ? I have that already. I went throught that with the M10 and M10R  now again with the M11. Thank You Leica for saying I bought the wrong camera.

[erudolph]

5 minutes ago, Torontoamateur said:

I do not understand how Leica can implicitly say the M11 is so much better than the Prior Leicas and in that way make them obsolete  I paid BIG money for my M240 when new and now to hear that is it not good enough??  This means Leica will say the same bout the M11 in a few years. So why bother getting a camera Leica will make obsolete ? I have that already. I went throught that with the M10 and M10R  now again with the M11. Thank You Leica for saying I bought the wrong camera.

Isn’t progress one of the norms?  Film stocks, lenses, etc.  Progress doesn’t negate the charms of previous generations of accomplishment, but it can be noteworthy, no?

[Herr Barnyard]

does anyone else's m11 have a cup holder next to the usbc port? Many good things about m11, this one of them 

[jrp]

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How does the M11 do with more difficult wide angle lenses in the edges / corners?

[fbonde]

On 1/14/2022 at 10:23 AM, Adam Bonn said:

Just skim read this now… well i thought it said lr = better colours / c1 = better dr

Not sure they mentioned if they had the bespoke c1 profile for it (my December 2021 v22 c1 doesn’t)

(I think no..)

my hunch/gut feeling here is that the different mpix modes with different dr might mean different exposure choices needed based on resolution… (bit like m10 = preserve highlights at all costs / m10r not so much)

i’m inherently and consistently wary of looks like m9 / looks like kodachrome type statements… 

when I get some peaceful minutes (might not be until after the wknd now) I’ll rinse the internet of every m11 dng I can find and add my own tuppence haypenny to the white noise!

Yup, C1 22 as of today dosent have a profile for the M11. 

 

 

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

[Adam Bonn]

@fbonde

I replied to the other post that you quoted me on.

https://support.captureone.com/hc/en-us/articles/4416405284497-Capture-One-22-15-0-1-release-notes-

maybe mac only? Dunno... reach out to them 

[Hanno]

1 hour ago, fbonde said:

Yup, C1 22 as of today dosent have a profile for the M11. 

 

 

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

You are using an old build of Capture One 22. In the digital section of the forum I posted a link to the release note of the new build 15.0.1. Here it is…

https://support.captureone.com/hc/en-us/articles/4416405284497-Capture-One-22-15-0-1-release-notes-

it works for both Windows and Mac. The new version is even listed as fixing some Windows bugs.

Edited January 17, 2022 by Hanno

[Fedro]

ok, can we stop talking about 35 mm as medium format territory? it really is the most trite marketing talk

35 is never going to be MF, and the other way around and in any case quality is subjective?

[Fedro]

16 hours ago, Artin said:

It would be nice if a manufacturer actually brought out a nice real medium format Texas Leica 

like a true 6x7. Medium format rangefinder I would be all over that  non of these autofocus bazooka lens bullshit we have now but a manual focus Digital camera like a Mamiya 7. Would be sooooooo nice 

you lost me a little bit there - would definitely buy a 6x7 like the mamiya or plaubel

[snooper]

In advance I’m really sorry to ask the question: am I the only one on this planet not impressed at all by what can be seen of the M11 IQ? There is no polemics at all in this genuine question. I appreciate we’re missing the tools to get the best out of it in PP, but still. Look at the Q, Q2 or SL, SL2 image threads, and the average quality of the jpg output you’ll find there, my eye at least can see a huge difference… So what will it take to reach the same IQ?

[Fedro]

15 minutes ago, snooper said:

In advance I’m really sorry to ask the question: am I the only one on this planet not impressed at all by what can be seen of the M11 IQ? There is no polemics at all in this genuine question. I appreciate we’re missing the tools to get the best out of it in PP, but still. Look at the Q, Q2 or SL, SL2 image threads, and the average quality of the jpg output you’ll find there, my eye at least can see a huge difference… So what will it take to reach the same IQ?

maybe some of it is also getting used to a new tool - I think the pictures that Jono posted show really good IQ

I am no technical expert but from my side I see really good treatment of colours for example, especially indoors which for me was always a bit of a weakness

[SrMi]

Chamber Lloyds is a well-known photography blogger with a subscription site. I do not subscribe to it. He is well known for complaining about everything and anything, but he is also competent and critical. However, he has not found anything to complain about M11's image quality. On the contrary, he called it the best M camera ever. Very rare praise from him.

[charlesphoto99]

1 hour ago, snooper said:

In advance I’m really sorry to ask the question: am I the only one on this planet not impressed at all by what can be seen of the M11 IQ? There is no polemics at all in this genuine question. I appreciate we’re missing the tools to get the best out of it in PP, but still. Look at the Q, Q2 or SL, SL2 image threads, and the average quality of the jpg output you’ll find there, my eye at least can see a huge difference… So what will it take to reach the same IQ?

The image quality is fine, but overkill for most. Boring if not processed, which many members here don't do (and exact same thing for previous gens). It's kind of like hi-end hifi - at a certain point things can become too smoothed out, and lose that toe tapping quality at the expense of less 'noise.' Thing is, having disposable income doesn't equal talent (though I think we all know that, but also nothing wrong with having it and spending as one likes). It used to be pro cameras trickled down to the amateurs - now it's the other way around. Pros can only afford what's absolutely needed and/or tend to stick to something for longer times in order to keep a unified look. When the amateurs get bored and move on to the next iteration and dump their perfectly overkill $9K cameras is when us pros get to pick them up.

So please everyone, I insist the image quality of the M10M is really subpar to that of the M11 b&w conversion! Now flood the markets with those outdated obsolete bodies and help drive the prices down! My M10-R BP needs a companion...

Looking forward to seeing what the M12 can do. In the meantime I think a MacBook Pro Max 10/24 64GB 1TB machine has my name on it (and much harder to get than an M11!)

[SrMi]

12 minutes ago, charlesphoto99 said:

The image quality is fine, but overkill for most. Boring if not processed, which many members here don't do (and exact same thing for previous gens). It's kind of like hi-end hifi - at a certain point things can become too smoothed out, and lose that toe tapping quality at the expense of less 'noise.' Thing is, having disposable income doesn't equal talent (though I think we all know that, but also nothing wrong with having it and spending as one likes). It used to be pro cameras trickled down to the amateurs - now it's the other way around. Pros can only afford what's absolutely needed and/or tend to stick to something for longer times in order to keep a unified look. When the amateurs get bored and move on to the next iteration and dump their perfectly overkill $9K cameras is when us pros get to pick them up.

So please everyone, I insist the image quality of the M10M is really subpar to that of the M11 b&w conversion! Now flood the markets with those outdated obsolete bodies and help drive the prices down! My M10-R BP needs a companion...

Looking forward to seeing what the M12 can do. In the meantime I think a MacBook Pro Max 10/24 64GB 1TB machine has my name on it (and much harder to get than an M11!)

Every DNG file is 'boring' if not processed by design. Nothing has changed, and nothing will change in that regard. For owners who do not like to process raw files, there is always the Auto button in Lightroom (algorithm tuned based on Jeff Schewe's processing).

[snooper]

9 minutes ago, Artin said:

The image quality is the best Leica has ever produced and we are still in the first week of getting to know the camera 

It’s a pleasure to see you enjoy it. This is exactly what matters at the end of the day. As far as I am concerned, I’ll wait for a few more weeks. Been an early adopter since M8 for each and every M iteration, including 3 Mono, but not this time.

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[zone5]

I have been following M11 image thread and also checking all reputable reviewers site to see the M11 images vs M10, SL, SL2 images when they reviewed those when those came out.

Maybe I am only one but I am seeing not better image form M11. more detail and may be more sharp but very flat and color looks very different (I would not say better or worse) than other Leica Camera.

It looks like images have been taken by other brand camera. I can not prove this but this is how I see so far.

For me, the most bothering point is that images looks like taken by other brand without Leica look to me.

Please don't attack me with this word "Leica Look" but we all know what I meant here.

It is quite disappointing and make me concerned about my future Leica Camera with Sony sensor ........without other option.

[charlesphoto99]

30 minutes ago, zone5 said:

 

For me, the most bothering point is that images looks like taken by other brand without Leica look to me.

Please don't attack me with this word "Leica Look" but we all know what I meant here.

It is quite disappointing and make me concerned about my future Leica Camera with Sony sensor ........without other option.

Thanks, I've been thinking this same thing but wasn't sure if it was just me and afraid to voce it. It does, at this point from what I've seen, have a more smoothed out Sony/Nikon look to it, to me. I think Leica 'voiced' their sensors in the past to a certain Leica look, but as so many clamor for 'perfection' this is what we end up with, which is fine, and I'm glad that I have what I have and plenty of choice out there (esp now on the used market). A very competent tool, I'm sure as it's Leica, but to me it's a '240' like transitional model to the M12 (I doubt there will be a P version this time around). Though not sure if buying from new or first time why one wouldn't choose the 11 over the 10R - image files are meant to personalized as it is and the price difference very small. But if I had a 10 or 10R I would wait for the 12.  

Edited January 18, 2022 by charlesphoto99