leica sl2 Leica SL2 AF

[lx1713]

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On a side note. The "Touch AF in EVF" is brilliant. A game changer for me, who hasn't used it before.

One other feature that I recently decided to use, the AF face detect but in a studio setting but with the SL. It was the smoothest portrait series I've ever ran.

Okay, I'm pretty old fashioned in this. If I can't trust a feature to deliver 100% I don't use it.

[SrMi]

4 hours ago, lx1713 said:

On a side note. The "Touch AF in EVF" is brilliant. A game changer for me, who hasn't used it before.

One other feature that I recently decided to use, the AF face detect but in a studio setting but with the SL. It was the smoothest portrait series I've ever ran.

Okay, I'm pretty old fashioned in this. If I can't trust a feature to deliver 100% I don't use it.

I do not like the way the "Touch AF in EVF" is implemented in SL2. I prefer it if I could use LCD as a touch-pad instead of just setting an absolute position as you would with live-view in LCD. Since it is easy to move the focus point with your nose, I prefer if only the right half of LCD can be made active.

[lx1713]

5 hours ago, SrMi said:

I do not like the way the "Touch AF in EVF" is implemented in SL2. I prefer it if I could use LCD as a touch-pad instead of just setting an absolute position as you would with live-view in LCD. Since it is easy to move the focus point with your nose, I prefer if only the right half of LCD can be made active.

Thanks. I have only used it in getting a handle on knowing the camera and not in the midst of an event so I acknowledge that's a likely possibility that I may find it irritating. My instinct is that I will love it, as much as I like the shutter-pressed review for some situations.

[SrMi]

6 minutes ago, lx1713 said:

Thanks. I have only used it in getting a handle on knowing the camera and not in the midst of an event so I acknowledge that's a likely possibility that I may find it irritating. My instinct is that I will love it, as much as I like the shutter-pressed review for some situations.

I hope I did not come as obnoxious in my reply :-).

All cameras that offer to use LCD to set focus point while using the EVF have the same option that Leica offers. It must be useful then, even if it is not for me. I would file a feature request with Leica, but SL2's joystick is so good so I would probably never use it anyway.

Thank you for mentioning this option.

[Chaemono]

Too bad that there aren't any English subtitles available for this video.  This early SL2 tester had issues with AF tracking on a pre-production model.  Trying to photograph fast action, he didn't manage to get any sharp pictures.  Leica sent someone over to advise with the AF Settings.  They set the camera to AFc, Zone or Field, Runner or Teamsports and chose a minimum shutter speed of 1/1000 sec.  The hit rate photographing ballet and the runner, again, increased considerably.  Of course, with Field and Zone one has to pan along but person/face detect didn't work in the ballet shots as there were too many people in the scene and the focus field would jump around.  Even if one cannot understand German, it may be useful just to look at the pictures.

Edit - the AF tracking issues were on a pre-production model not with final FW.

Edited December 18, 2019 by Chaemono

[lx1713]

13 hours ago, SrMi said:

I hope I did not come as obnoxious in my reply :-).

All cameras that offer to use LCD to set focus point while using the EVF have the same option that Leica offers. It must be useful then, even if it is not for me. I would file a feature request with Leica, but SL2's joystick is so good so I would probably never use it anyway.

Thank you for mentioning this option.

😊 Did a shoot with strobes today with a 2 year old toddler running around (It's work . As far as I can tell my nose didn't visibly throw my focusing off. Quite possibly, my head is inclined forward, my nose is out of the way. 600 shots. The touch AF in EVF, being unfamiliar, was only used a few times but I think it's ergonomically comfortable for me. I'm still using the joystick 99% of the time.

 I consider the AF better than my SL by quite a bit. I shot it with a 24-90 at f3.5 - 5.6 for the indoors and 50f2 for the outdoors. Lovely colors at ISO 800. As far as I can tell, most of my shots were pretty spot on. I like what they have done with the menu. Especially with the rear dashboard thingy.

Coming to this new user interface, I got used to the basic stuff surprisingly fast. I don't think I can go back to the SL for events.

Edited December 18, 2019 by lx1713

[frame-it]

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[ChasMP]

Any wedding photographers out there running an SL2? I’m considering offloading the Nikon’s (D850) and running an SL2 with a couple of the Summicron primes, and my M10 as backup. I’d love to know what people’s experience has been in terms of usability of the EVF as the light fades and most importantly AF performance under pressure. 
 

The predominant reason for the switch is I want access to the lenses. I’m a little concerned about giving up the very good AF performance on the D850.

Edited February 17, 2020 by ChasMP

[Kim Dahl]

On 2/17/2020 at 5:10 AM, ChasMP said:

Any wedding photographers out there running an SL2? I’m considering offloading the Nikon’s (D850) and running an SL2 with a couple of the Summicron primes, and my M10 as backup. I’d love to know what people’s experience has been in terms of usability of the EVF as the light fades and most importantly AF performance under pressure. 
 

The predominant reason for the switch is I want access to the lenses. I’m a little concerned about giving up the very good AF performance on the D850.

If autofocus is really important to you. Then I don't think Leica SL/CL is for you. A Leica M10 as an "extra" camera for a wedding will work just fine. I've tried that many times. Consider, for example, the Nikon Z, because you can also use it for your M optics. I have Nikon 800E and Nikon D5 and in terms of AF, Leica does not come close to Nikon etc

[rim_light]

IMHO is the AF of the SL2 better than many people think. You just have to use it differently (than e.g. a Nikon D5(00) which is still better, but there is not so much between those cameras)

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[Luca]

On 2/17/2020 at 5:10 AM, ChasMP said:

Any wedding photographers out there running an SL2? I’m considering offloading the Nikon’s (D850) and running an SL2 with a couple of the Summicron primes, and my M10 as backup. I’d love to know what people’s experience has been in terms of usability of the EVF as the light fades and most importantly AF performance under pressure. 
 

The predominant reason for the switch is I want access to the lenses. I’m a little concerned about giving up the very good AF performance on the D850.

I'm just an amateur photographer. I did wedding service for a friend of mine.

I had no issue with AF, it was December and bad weather, so light was not that great.

I shot from 7.00 am upto 23.00 with no problem (home, church, venue).

This was my personal experience. Sometimes I read bad reviews on Leica AF and I wonder if some of these people really knows how to properly use AF....

Not saying this is the best AF you can find but saying Leica SL2 is not good for weddings because of its AF its to me a total nonsense.

I used it with vario SL 24-90 and summicron SL 50mm f2.

Edited February 18, 2020 by Luca
missing info

[Kim Dahl]

For wedding photography, Leicas is ok as Luca says. I responded as I did because I thought AF was your 1st priority. And then there are better opportunities.

[sillbeers15]

On 2/19/2020 at 3:12 AM, Kim Dahl said:

If autofocus is really important to you. Then I don't think Leica SL/CL is for you. A Leica M10 as an "extra" camera for a wedding will work just fine. I've tried that many times. Consider, for example, the Nikon Z, because you can also use it for your M optics. I have Nikon 800E and Nikon D5 and in terms of AF, Leica does not come close to Nikon etc

Nonsense. The SL/SL2 AF works perfectly fine. I turn to my M system when I do not want AF. 

[NRKstudio]

On 2/16/2020 at 10:10 PM, ChasMP said:

Any wedding photographers out there running an SL2? I’m considering offloading the Nikon’s (D850) and running an SL2 with a couple of the Summicron primes, and my M10 as backup. I’d love to know what people’s experience has been in terms of usability of the EVF as the light fades and most importantly AF performance under pressure. 
 

The predominant reason for the switch is I want access to the lenses. I’m a little concerned about giving up the very good AF performance on the D850.

The AF is not really comparable to a d850 or even a z7.  Also, the lack of eyeAF definitely is a big drawback (compared to a z7 or Sony or any new Fuji).  CDAF is decent though in AFS, tracking is not bad, but face or body detect is not usable in events if you are relying on making every shot for $.  The Crons do focus better the Sigmas.  The Sigma zoom is a stunner though, as well as the 28 Art.  It’s tough though sometimes in single point, AFC, I’ll focus on the eye closer to me (SS>1/250) on a standing person at even a slight angle, and it’ll miss focus by a few inches rendering the far eye or the persons shirt in sharpest focus.  Face detect will work directly looking at someone though in AFC, but it at an angle, the focus accuracy and precision is unreliable.  When it hits though it shines with a Cron 50 or 75.  

Edited February 21, 2020 by NRKstudio

[sillbeers15]

25 minutes ago, NRKstudio said:

The AF is not really comparable to a d850 or even a z7.  Also, the lack of eyeAF definitely is a big drawback (compared to a z7 or Sony or any new Fuji).  CDAF is decent though in AFS, tracking is not bad, but face or body detect is not usable in events if you are relying on making every shot for $.  The Crons do focus better the Sigmas.  The Sigma zoom is a stunner though, as well as the 28 Art.  It’s tough though sometimes in single point, AFC, I’ll focus on the eye closer to me (SS>1/250) on a standing person at even a slight angle, and it’ll miss focus by a few inches rendering the far eye or the persons shirt in sharpest focus.  Face detect will work directly looking at someone though in AFC, but it at an angle, the focus accuracy and precision is unreliable.  When it hits though it shines with a Cron 50 or 75.  

I do not take shots for $.

Most of my experiences using the AFC tracking based on single point has been positive provided the camera AF tracking successfully locks on and subject has sufficient exposure and size in frame.

I have less experience using face recognition mostly in static or slow motion only.  Can you illustrate what you mean by ‘not usable’. You refer to the focusing shifted off during subject motion in continuous shots or the focusing on subject is not nailed? How is the lighting of your venue? What shutter speed were you using? Were you shooting against strong backlight? 

[Kim Dahl]

I live as a photographer and have done it since 1986. As a permanent employee not freelance. 

I am sorry to write this, because I love Leica and have always a Leica. But it's not because of autofocus. But because of build quality and simplicity. And of course optical quality. 

I use Leica more privately. And when I retire I will have no doubt that I will use my Leica more. But that's because I can use M optics on the best camera body. And SL/TL optik as the best kvalitet. I think most photographers who live as press photography use Nikon, Canon and today also Sony.

I now a few colleagues who have leica, but not as many as in “film” time, that has a Q or M with. Them. It's a shame that Leica doesn't spend more energy on their autofocus, then I think it will add more users. Said with great love for Leica.

[sillbeers15]

4 hours ago, Kim Dahl said:

I live as a photographer and have done it since 1986. As a permanent employee not freelance. 

I am sorry to write this, because I love Leica and have always a Leica. But it's not because of autofocus. But because of build quality and simplicity. And of course optical quality. 

I use Leica more privately. And when I retire I will have no doubt that I will use my Leica more. But that's because I can use M optics on the best camera body. And SL/TL optik as the best kvalitet. I think most photographers who live as press photography use Nikon, Canon and today also Sony.

I now a few colleagues who have leica, but not as many as in “film” time, that has a Q or M with. Them. It's a shame that Leica doesn't spend more energy on their autofocus, then I think it will add more users. Said with great love for Leica.

We all know that Leica has its strength as a lens / optics maker. Granted Leica cameras are designed to take advantage of the great optics. Leica situated in Europe/Germany not in the heart of electronics hardware and software site in Asia. It is only a $300mil turnover company makes it tough to afford a big R& D team. Naturally it takes on the strength of its partner Panasonic. Panasonic today does not posses the best AF technology but looking its progress in Micro 4 thirds. I am confident it will make great AF happen soon for FF bodies. 
What I want to say is that the SL2 AF may not be the best in class today but neither is it so bad that it does not work or only produce low success rate. User optimisation is also critical. 

[caissa]

The current AF is the best we ever had in the SL. If your skills are not good enough to cope with that, choose another camera.

All I read here is not interesting or helpful. I simply wait for the next firmware release and in the meantime try to improve my skills to handle the shortcomings. (All cameras always had shortcomings.)

I hate to waste time with complaining about the AF. So silly. 

[NRKstudio]

6 hours ago, sillbeers15 said:

We all know that Leica has its strength as a lens / optics maker. Granted Leica cameras are designed to take advantage of the great optics. Leica situated in Europe/Germany not in the heart of electronics hardware and software site in Asia. It is only a $300mil turnover company makes it tough to afford a big R& D team. Naturally it takes on the strength of its partner Panasonic. Panasonic today does not posses the best AF technology but looking its progress in Micro 4 thirds. I am confident it will make great AF happen soon for FF bodies. 
What I want to say is that the SL2 AF may not be the best in class today but neither is it so bad that it does not work or only produce low success rate. User optimisation is also critical. 

I wish they take a page from Fuji’s book.  It’s a smaller company that is producing world class optics in the GFX system, and they went from the worst eyeAF to some of the best eyeAF in their XPro and XT3 line, as well as their fixed lens consumer cameras x100v.  It’s not really Leicas size that holds them back, it’s their focus and strategy.  Their reliance on brand loyalty, optics, luxury demand and price separation have caused them to ignore the basics in usability and tech.  I unfortunately am a sucker for all of those things, as well as the M system.  so I sold my Sony and bought an SL2, and now complain on the LUF! 
 

Leica needs a new Director of Technology, please, for the L System! 

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[ChasMP]

I’d love to have an SL2 as a second body for weddings, there are plenty of times where high speed AF isn’t critical and plenty of the quieter moments where it would be a pleasure to work with. At the moment I use the M, so maybe I’ll just buy that 28mm Summicron M I’ve always wanted...

Digressing a bit, if the M11 comes with a better / faster EVF attachment option then I’d be absolutely after that. Fast access to focus peaking during a wedding would widen my shooting envelope somewhat...