Stealth3kpl Posted October 28, 2013 Author Share #21 Posted October 28, 2013 Advertisement (gone after registration) Uh Oh! I've been playing with the configurator. Pete Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted October 28, 2013 Posted October 28, 2013 Hi Stealth3kpl, Take a look here MP vs M4. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
semi-ambivalent Posted October 29, 2013 Share #22 Posted October 29, 2013 Uh Oh! I've been playing with the configurator. Pete Abandon all hope, ye who enter there... s-a 3 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
stephen.w Posted October 29, 2013 Share #23 Posted October 29, 2013 Which do you think is most valuable, a dented M4 Black Paint or a mint, possibly boxed, Wetzler Black Chrome M4?I suppose both wil have framelines 35/50/90/135 Pete If you're buying it to use, get the MP rather. You already have an M2 for the "ultimate rangefinder experience" etc etc. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stealth3kpl Posted October 29, 2013 Author Share #24 Posted October 29, 2013 Yes, I think I might splash out on my (almost) perfect Film M. I see there's an option for Vulcanite rather than that awful sand paper, 35/50/90 framelines, classic script on Black Paint. There's no option for the M2/M3 release but you can't ask for everything. Who would I contact about maybe a black frame counter and a one stage shutter release? Just dreaming out loud you understand. . Must get my M9P listed. Pete Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wattsy Posted October 29, 2013 Share #25 Posted October 29, 2013 Pete, I think I read somewhere recently that the ALC vulcanite is no longer available, at least not the vulcanite that resembles the vulcanite of old. The ALC configurator is a dangerous distraction. Many times have I been tempted by a black paint MP with M7 rewind, 35/50/90 VF and fancy engraving option. Thankfully there is no instant online 'buy it now' because I always come to my senses and ask myself whether I really want to pay £4250 for a glorified M6 (or metered M4, depending upon how you look at it). 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarkP Posted October 29, 2013 Share #26 Posted October 29, 2013 Thankfully there is no instant online 'buy it now' ). Thankfully Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
philipus Posted October 29, 2013 Share #27 Posted October 29, 2013 Advertisement (gone after registration) Pete, I just re-read your OP. Why the fascination with the MP? If it is only because you used to have one, then I can understand it. But from your post it seems you won't use the meter. I accept the MP has a certain allure - and I have also toyed with the Konfigurator - but there little, if any, functional difference to other M6-based cameras. Let me plug for the Millennium - the real name of which, to the extent it is relevant, is M6TTL Black Paint, is 2mm taller, true, but costs less than an MP (and significantly less than an ALC MP). It has the M3 rewind and rubber ring around the eye piece. Plus it has black paint on the rear door and the non-goofy-looking (all imho of course) ISO selector. Lastly, it is one of only 2000 made, whereas there are thousands of MPs. As I said, I accept the allure of the MP but - playing the voice of reason here, as I have done to myself when I've been pulled into the Konfigurator - in reality it is an expensive M6 with a few cosmetic choices (better duck and run now). Pete, I think I read somewhere recently that the ALC vulcanite is no longer available, at least not the vulcanite that resembles the vulcanite of old. I think I provided this info, after my contacts with CS in Solms concerning my M4 and TTL. I considered switching to the modern "vulcanite" on the TTL since they needed to remove the covering to open up the camera, but I was told that this covering was no longer offered and that the Konfigurator needed to be updated. It may be worth checking with CS to be sure because things may have changed (or the info I was given may have been incorrect). cheers Philip 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
semi-ambivalent Posted October 29, 2013 Share #28 Posted October 29, 2013 Pete, I just re-read your OP. Why the fascination with the MP? If it is only because you used to have one, then I can understand it. But from your post it seems you won't use the meter. I accept the MP has a certain allure - and I have also toyed with the Konfigurator - but there little, if any, functional difference to other M6-based cameras. Let me plug for the Millennium - the real name of which, to the extent it is relevant, is M6TTL Black Paint, is 2mm taller, true, but costs less than an MP (and significantly less than an ALC MP). It has the M3 rewind and rubber ring around the eye piece. Plus it has black paint on the rear door and the non-goofy-looking (all imho of course) ISO selector. Lastly, it is one of only 2000 made, whereas there are thousands of MPs. As I said, I accept the allure of the MP but - playing the voice of reason here, as I have done to myself when I've been pulled into the Konfigurator - in reality it is an expensive M6 with a few cosmetic choices (better duck and run now). I think I provided this info, after my contacts with CS in Solms concerning my M4 and TTL. I considered switching to the modern "vulcanite" on the TTL since they needed to remove the covering to open up the camera, but I was told that this covering was no longer offered and that the Konfigurator needed to be updated. It may be worth checking with CS to be sure because things may have changed (or the info I was given may have been incorrect). cheers Philip Because I had read some (maybe your) reference to this I emailed my vendor, Dan Tamarkin, who contacted Leica. He relayed to me that Leica expected no problem and that my MP would be built "to spec" which, I assume, means with Vulkanit, as I had ordered with the configurator. Now if you look closely you'll see there is no "Leica" badge on my jacket, so keep your communications open with Leica should one go the ALC route. Leica is BIG on heritage and I can't see how they could not continue to offer a Vulkanit-type covering for their premier "just the way you like them" product line. Ostrich, but no vulkanit? Please. But Leica can be quirky if some of the posts on various blogs are any indication so it is wise to get your concerns pushed as far upstream as you can get them pushed. PS - Perhaps Leica is constantly being peppered with requests for the real hard rubber Vulkanit covering and there is some confusion between it and the modern stick-on plastic with the Vulkanit-ish embossed surface. Language often fails us. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stealth3kpl Posted October 29, 2013 Author Share #29 Posted October 29, 2013 The issues I've had with one of my M2s has made me lose a little confidence in the other. I've thought to send my M2 in to Leica to see if they'll still overhaul the M2 and sort out the separating rangefinder optics. I'm awaiting their reply. I started thinking about getting a younger film M and, because there are a few features of the MP about which I'm not thrilled, I took myself off to the configurator. I wouldn't be happy with a standard MP. I do like the look of the millennium, but I've always fancied an MP3. However, I don't want to risk issues with bodies that haven't been used much. It might be that my M2 comes back with its light leak fixed and I'm happy as Larry again, but I do like the thought of a BP companion that I've configured and which ages in my caress. Pete 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wizard Posted October 29, 2013 Share #30 Posted October 29, 2013 ...and perhaps pick up another M2 if mine can't be fixed.... I have yet to see an M2 that can't be fixed. Unless yours was run over by a truck, where is the problem? Andy 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
smkoush Posted October 29, 2013 Share #31 Posted October 29, 2013 About a year ago I sent my MP to Leica NJ for a CLA (as the camera crossed the 10-year old mark). I asked them to a la cart it by replacing the skin with vulkanit and making the viewfinder a 4-0.72 (framelines for 28/90, 35 & 50 only). They called to say that the vulkanit was no longer an option, and offered to change it to the Monochrom-looking one. I declined the option. Upon receipt of the camera I was pleasantly surprised to find the camera with a very nice brand new vulkanit cover. My suspicion is that the vulkanit cover is not an option for replacing a digital M (e.g., M9/Monochrom), but it is still available for the film M's. I didn't question it much as I got what I wanted anyway. By the way, a la cart'ing the MP is much cheaper than ordering one from the configurator. The only thing I would go for the configurator is the 0.58 viewfinder. Anyway, here is the vulkanit on the MP and the clean framelines of the 50 (after removing the 75 ones). S. Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! 7 Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/215496-mp-vs-m4/?do=findComment&comment=2452973'>More sharing options...
Stealth3kpl Posted October 29, 2013 Author Share #32 Posted October 29, 2013 By the way, a la cart'ing the MP is much cheaper than ordering one from the configurator. S. What's the distinction? Pete Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stealth3kpl Posted October 29, 2013 Author Share #33 Posted October 29, 2013 I have yet to see an M2 that can't be fixed. Unless yours was run over by a truck, where is the problem? Andy They haven't contacted me yet. Pete Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
smkoush Posted October 29, 2013 Share #34 Posted October 29, 2013 What's the distinction?Pete Hi Pete, What I meant was that if you already have an MP (or buy used) and change the skin/frame lines it is cheaper than buying a brand new a la cart with the same configuration. Of course this does not apply to viewfinder magnifications other than 0.72, or if you like something other than the standard top plate Leica logo. Savvas 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stealth3kpl Posted October 29, 2013 Author Share #35 Posted October 29, 2013 Good point. I'll ask them how much changing to the 35/50/90 framelines and vulcanite costs. I'd be happy with that. Pet Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stealth3kpl Posted October 29, 2013 Author Share #36 Posted October 29, 2013 I have yet to see an M2 that can't be fixed. Unless yours was run over by a truck, where is the problem? Andy The reply: "Hello Peter Leica in Germany can still refurbish the M2 however the balsam separation in the viewfinder can't be corrected but they can change the rangefinder for one from the later MP camera. This may differ in spec to your M2 with a change of magnification and the frame lines. The rest of the camera can be done. The price for the refurbishment depends heavily on the condition of the camera and so we can't quote a price until the factory have examined the camera. Please also be aware that the classic M cameras such as M3's & M2's do take longer than our normal repair times of 20 working day. If you would like to go ahead with the repair quote you can either drop off the camera at our Mayfair Client Care at the address below, or if it's not convenient for you to bring the camera to London Mayfair then we can arrange for a client direct repair. With the client direct repair, we arrange for a UPS prepaid shipping label to be sent to you along with a copy of the repair form via e-mail. The direct repair does cost 40 euros for repairs that are not proceeded. " Now to put on my thinking cap. Pete Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
semi-ambivalent Posted October 30, 2013 Share #37 Posted October 30, 2013 About a year ago I sent my MP to Leica NJ for a CLA (as the camera crossed the 10-year old mark). I asked them to a la cart it by replacing the skin with vulkanit and making the viewfinder a 4-0.72 (framelines for 28/90, 35 & 50 only). They called to say that the vulkanit was no longer an option, and offered to change it to the Monochrom-looking one. I declined the option. Upon receipt of the camera I was pleasantly surprised to find the camera with a very nice brand new vulkanit cover. My suspicion is that the vulkanit cover is not an option for replacing a digital M (e.g., M9/Monochrom), but it is still available for the film M's. I didn't question it much as I got what I wanted anyway. By the way, a la cart'ing the MP is much cheaper than ordering one from the configurator. The only thing I would go for the configurator is the 0.58 viewfinder. Anyway, here is the vulkanit on the MP and the clean framelines of the 50 (after removing the 75 ones). S. The configurator does not offer a 0.72-4. The framelines you mention are exactly what I wanted but Leica, Solms and Joisy, said it couldn't be done. Well maybe not as new. I'll just wait a few decades and have the 135 mask removed during a CLA. Yes, they can be quirky. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
CalArts 99 Posted October 30, 2013 Share #38 Posted October 30, 2013 (edited) The reply: "Hello Peter Leica in Germany can still refurbish the M2 however the balsam separation in the viewfinder can't be corrected but they can change the rangefinder for one from the later MP camera. This may differ in spec to your M2 with a change of magnification and the frame lines. The rest of the camera can be done. The price for the refurbishment depends heavily on the condition of the camera and so we can't quote a price until the factory have examined the camera. Please also be aware that the classic M cameras such as M3's & M2's do take longer than our normal repair times of 20 working day. This is a problem with the M3 and M2. I had a separation happen with my M2 and it happened with no warning. I ended up selling it as is and before it became completely unusable. It's also why I personally tend to stay away from those models. They are definitely great cameras, but they're just a bit too old now and I need to something to use every day and not worry about. afaik, CRR Luton is the only person who is willing to repair and resilver existing rangefinders after they've been done in with balsam glue degradation. Here are the details: M2/3/4 Rangefinder Restoration You might consider asking for an estimate from Luton before you decide. I know that DAG and Sherry Krauter use either a donor M2/M3 and will replace the rangefinder that way, or install a later version (as Solms does.) Edited October 30, 2013 by CalArts 99 fixed added link 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
philipus Posted October 30, 2013 Share #39 Posted October 30, 2013 On the point of the time it takes, I heard from CS yesterday that they are behind schedule concerning service of analogue Ms. Apparently seasonal flu has caused absences in the staff which delays repairs. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
almoore Posted October 30, 2013 Share #40 Posted October 30, 2013 Which would you choose? The one that feels nicest in my hands. Every film M that I've picked up has a different feel for wind-on and shutter release, so I wouldn't make a decision without comparing them. Having said that, assuming the M4 isn't utterly shagged out it should nicer than an MP, which is no more than a bog standard M6 in black paint drag with a slower rewind and a less comfortable wind-on lever. 2 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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