Leon Berg Posted June 9, 2021 Share #81 Posted June 9, 2021 Advertisement (gone after registration) vor 5 Minuten schrieb a.noctilux: @Leon Berg thanks. I've heard that some MP/M7 can be serviced to have only three framelines. Some regular M framelines can be "hiden", so you can have only "50" without "75" and "90 without 28", maybe 35 without 135 if required. I’d take 35/50/90 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted June 9, 2021 Posted June 9, 2021 Hi Leon Berg, Take a look here MP vs M4. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Michael Geschlecht Posted June 9, 2021 Share #82 Posted June 9, 2021 (edited) Hello Everybody, A bit of perspective here. All of the "M" cameras have frame lines that show less of an image than what is captured on the film or sensor. This means that there is ALWAYS more of an image captured on the film/sensor than the person sees inside of the frame lines in use. Looking thru the range/viewfinder window. Regardless of model. Best Regards, Michael Edited June 9, 2021 by Michael Geschlecht Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leon Berg Posted June 9, 2021 Share #83 Posted June 9, 2021 vor 11 Minuten schrieb Michael Geschlecht: Hello Everybody, A bit of perspective here. All of the "M" cameras have frame lines that show less of an image than what is captured on the film or sensor. This means that there is ALWAYS more of an image captured on the film/sensor than the person sees inside of the frame lines in use. Looking thru the range/viewfinder window. Regardless of model. Best Regards, Michael Thank you Michael! curious to know how you know this and can say it with such Bestimmtheit (so assertively) but it makes me happy to hear that. sometimes the impression is made that the MP is garbage,, didn’t want to give that impression to anyone Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
a.noctilux Posted June 9, 2021 Share #84 Posted June 9, 2021 Leon, I think that in your MP's manual, you have explanation. in my copy of M-A's manual, we have this Every Leica M has discrepencies in viewing/recording ! (here M-A) Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! B is the film "record" depending on distance, while we see in the VF framelines A Quote Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! B is the film "record" depending on distance, while we see in the VF framelines A ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/215496-mp-vs-m4/?do=findComment&comment=4216950'>More sharing options...
Michael Geschlecht Posted June 9, 2021 Share #85 Posted June 9, 2021 (edited) Hello Leon, I have been using & reading about Leitz/Leica for a long time. I also read a lot on this Forum & I talk to other people. There is a lot of information out & around. There is quite a bit on this Forum. Including the WIKI at the top of this page which has both a German & an English version. Both of which are translatable to the other. Please keep in mind that when people are discussing Leica "M" cameras, film & digital, they are all very fine cameras. Whichever 1 you have. Their differences are in degrees of each other. Whichever is the right combination for you is the right 1 to have. Please also keep in mind that there are variations, exceptions, contradictions & "other". Just like when you are researching anything else. This Forum is a good place to ask questions. Best Regards, Michael Edited June 9, 2021 by Michael Geschlecht Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Geschlecht Posted June 9, 2021 Share #86 Posted June 9, 2021 Hello Leon, Another point of clarification. The image being captured on the film/sensor is ONLY an image slightly larger than what is defined by the frame lines for the lens that is currently on the camera. NOT the entire range/viewfinder image. Also, if you move the frame line indicator to a different lens's frame than the lens that is currently on the camera: That does NOT change the image captured. The image captured is always defined by the frame lines of the lens currently on the camera & a little more. Best Regards, Michael Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leon Berg Posted June 9, 2021 Share #87 Posted June 9, 2021 Advertisement (gone after registration) vor 29 Minuten schrieb a.noctilux: Leon, I think that in your MP's manual, you have explanation. in my copy of M-A's manual, we have this Every Leica M has discrepencies in viewing/recording ! (here M-A) Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! B is the film "record" depending on distance, while we see in the VF framelines A Thank you for sharing, interesting! vor 9 Minuten schrieb Michael Geschlecht: Hello Leon, Another point of clarification. The image being captured on the film/sensor is ONLY an image slightly larger than what is defined by the frame lines for the lens that is currently on the camera. NOT the entire range/viewfinder image. Also, if you move the frame line indicator to a different lens's frame than the lens that is currently on the camera: That does NOT change the image captured. The image captured is always defined by the frame lines of the lens currently on the camera & a little more. Best Regards, Michael Thanks Michael, of course I know, that the lens makes the frame and not the frame line, but thank you for mentioning it I love my MP, it's the only M camera I have (together with a 35 and 50) and I was thinking, after I read the headline of this thread, if I should trade it for an older M, since it's still in almost new shape (got it used, but like new) and find myself a M2 plus a M4 for almost the same price as one MP. In the beginning I was a bit unsatisfied, because it had problems with the mount, that now have been fixed. But there was always a residue of that bad feeling "what could happen next?" My first M was a serviced M6, loved it, but traded it for the MP, since I got a good deal and also found someone to buy my M6 for the price I wanted.. I am not a collector, nor a nagger like I might seem now I shoot several rolls a month, mostly 2 per week, sometimes more, sometimes less, develop and scan/enlarge.. I shouldn't be thinking about all these subsidiary and distracting topics, but sometimes it happens just by itself I guess I will safe up a bit and get another M. I tend to find a M4, but M2 are still less expensive and everyone talks highly of them. That would be a great combination I think. Have a good night all of you! Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
a.noctilux Posted June 9, 2021 Share #88 Posted June 9, 2021 Leon, then keep your money planned for three framelines MP service, to fund M2 the original three framelines M. Keep in mind that you would loose a bit of contrast/clarity in VF iwith M4/M2 comparing to MP. With aging VF (glasses/optics/prism) and sometimes lost in contrast can be ennoying for framing/focussing which in turn is individual. Loading film can be another process to learn ( ...even foolproof in M2 slowish loading), etc. Anyway, each Leica M is fun/pleasing in it's own right. 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ktmrider2 Posted June 10, 2021 Share #89 Posted June 10, 2021 (edited) Funny but I have a mint 50th anniversary black chrome M4 and a button rewind M2 and I have given thought recently of trading them for an MP. Don't really know why except I find myself getting bored with a camera after a few years. Now I have never owned an MP but have had both the M6 and M6TTL as well as all earlier M film bodies. IMHO, Leica got something right with the M2 and the single 35/50/90 frame lines is the best viewfinder they ever produced. Now the M4 is almost as good as the 135 frame lines are so small they can easily be ignored and you have the advantage of the modern film loading and rewind. Do not miss the in camera meter (mostly) as my preferred technique is with a hand held incident reading. I would recommend keeping the MP and finding a nice M2 but we might be able to work a trade. Edited June 10, 2021 by ktmrider2 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Topsy Posted June 10, 2021 Share #90 Posted June 10, 2021 (edited) 6 hours ago, ktmrider2 said: I would recommend keeping the MP and finding a nice M2 but we might be able to work a trade. That's my combination and I would second that recomendation. I have tried M4-P and M6 Classic but prefer the rewind and advance levers on the Mp/M2. Frame lines are easy for me to ignore as I also shoot M9s (more frequently). Also as for the framing "inaccuracy" that is often mentioned, I find the frame lines against what is on film/sensor similar across all 3 models and am just used to working with it. FWIW I very rarely chimp on the M9s I tend to shoot them as I do film but enjoy the immediacy of digital for results. If I am just out for a walkabout I will shoot digital as I may only take a few shots I use my film Ms for days when I am out to shoot specifically and am likely to use a whole film. Apologies for mentioning the D word. 🙄 Edited June 10, 2021 by Topsy Apology for mentioning digital 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Antonio Russell Posted June 14, 2021 Share #91 Posted June 14, 2021 (edited) On 6/10/2021 at 3:07 AM, ktmrider2 said: Funny but I have a mint 50th anniversary black chrome M4 and a button rewind M2 and I have given thought recently of trading them for an MP. Don't really know why except I find myself getting bored with a camera after a few years. Now I have never owned an MP but have had both the M6 and M6TTL as well as all earlier M film bodies. IMHO, Leica got something right with the M2 and the single 35/50/90 frame lines is the best viewfinder they ever produced. Now the M4 is almost as good as the 135 frame lines are so small they can easily be ignored and you have the advantage of the modern film loading and rewind. Do not miss the in camera meter (mostly) as my preferred technique is with a hand held incident reading. I would recommend keeping the MP and finding a nice M2 but we might be able to work a trade. Yes! Those black chrome M4s used to be a lot cheaper a few years ago! They are all good just very slightly different. I have an M4 and MP and for some reason find myself now wanting an M2! I had an M6 in the past which was nice also. Leica's are addictive!! Edited June 14, 2021 by Antonio Russell Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leon Berg Posted August 18, 2021 Share #92 Posted August 18, 2021 Hey everyone. Sold the MP because I had a buyer who wanted it really bad. My reasons: Psychologically the removal of the battery is not the same as not having a meter in the first place. It just isn’t, for me at least. And also for others. You can say, I am just an idiot and/or or suffer from a cognitive disorder (which probably is true), well then, there is many of us. Lots of idiots. 😃 It was also because of the wonderful black paint. It was just toooo beautiful for me. I focused more on the camera than on taking pictures. I was thinking of replacing it with an chrome M-A (that I wanted in the first place before I was offered the MP for an insanely good deal) One day I will get a M-A, but for now decided to get an M4, mint, CLA, curtains replaced, perfect condition. For almost a third of a new M-A. Couldn’t resist. since I want two bodies, I start with this now. An M-A or serviced M2/3 will follow. Photos will follow , if you like The MP was wonderful, but it wasn’t for me. If you have it and love it, I am sincerely happy for you! 1 Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
a.noctilux Posted December 28, 2021 Share #93 Posted December 28, 2021 I think so, MP was wonderful MP was ( were I had two ) a nice adventure, for film, I prefer M-A and older M4/M5/M4-2/M4-P/M2/M3/MDa/etc. Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
a.noctilux Posted July 7, 2022 Share #94 Posted July 7, 2022 On 12/28/2021 at 3:15 PM, a.noctilux said: I think so, MP was wonderful MP was ( were I had two ) a nice adventure, for film, I prefer M-A and older M4/M5/M4-2/M4-P/M2/M3/MDa/etc. 😌 Strange that I keep these oldies. As a note, the old M4-2 had a quick adjust/CLA by a friend, some months ago... the VF is clear and contrast has never been so nice, now this old horse is a real pleasure to use again (better ... smoother than newer M-As). Quote Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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