Leica X Vario Photos

[Photomic38]

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Entirely of your opinion dkCambridgeshire on this formidable camera. Here is a small test at iso 6400 from the restaurant on Lake Geneva.

 

@28mm , 1/30th , F/3.5 , ISO 6400 !!!  Camera against window frame .

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[ropo54]

Superb image Gary. The Peter Karbe team's design of the XV's lens is one of their finest achievements. Contrary to all the naysayers' ignorant opinions of the camera, it has one of the most versatile APS-C zoom optics and it's such a shame that it was discontinued and not developed further. The less than anticipated sales were likely caused by the band wagon negative comments by those who dismissed it for, 'in their expert (not) opinions', having too slow a lens. 'Experts' who seem to forget that we are no longer living in the film era when ISO 200 was the max speed which enabled decent large colour prints and exhibition quality transparencies. Nowadays slow-ish lenses are no barrier to quality results and the XV's sensor combined with its superlative lens and image processing is quite capable of producing exhibition quality results at e.g. ISO 800 … and also throughout its aperture range and at any zoom setting. Furthermore, as is illustrated in Gary's image, the XV can be harnessed into a superb close-up 'tool camera' by the addition of one or more achromatic supplementary c/u lenses. I've stacked three Leitz VIb Elpros onto my XV with excellent results; you don't need a macro lens if you have an XV and a couple of Elpros - Elpro VIb or Elpro 2 -  both of which can be sourced relatively cheaply and are easy to adapt to the XV's 43 mm filter thread.

 

dunk  

 

EDIT:  The Leitz Elpro VI (and VII) series of achromatic c/u lenses were originally designed in the mid-1960s for use with the first Leitz (Leica) R lenses e.g. the 1964 Leitz 50mm Summicron R … they are thus over 50 years young … and are testament to the quality of 1960s Leitz optics. 

 

My guess is that the new TL will come out in the next year, and it is intended to supplant/merge/absorb the X series line. Perhaps some specialty lenses along the way. It really makes no sense to have the separate bodies for the the X and T.   At least, I am hopeful that Leica is taking the line in that direction, along with its homogenization with the SL line. 

 

My prediction is more mp for the TL, built in superb evf,  modified user interface like the SL, and a continuing ala carte lens menu. (And, the next SL will also have more mp so that the smaller TL lenses have greater number of pixels to work with).  One's new TL can be a small one-lens system like the TL w the 23 mm, or an X Vario version with the 18-56. It can have the flexibility of being all systems, as well with multiple lenses, and some 'character' lenses as well.

 

For certain, I know nothing about what I am talking about (!) but it makes perfect sense to me for the 2 systems to be 'merged' and continued with gusto!

Edited March 5, 2017 by ropo54

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[dkCambridgeshire]

My guess is that the new TL will come out in the next year, and it is intended to supplant/merge/absorb the X series line. …   It really makes no sense to have the separate bodies for the the X and T.  

 

…   For certain, I know nothing about what I am talking about (!) but it makes perfect sense to me for the 2 systems to be 'merged' and continued with gusto!

 

 

The two different systems actually are quite sensible and appeal to different markets - because some users cannot be bothered with, or do not fully understand how to use, interchangeable lens cameras … but they still want Leica APS-C quality … which is one reason why Leica has so far introduced 4 different X series APS-C format cameras. 

 

dunk

[ropo54]

The two different systems actually are quite sensible and appeal to different markets - because some users cannot be bothered with, or do not fully understand how to use, interchangeable lens cameras … but they still want Leica APS-C quality … which is one reason why Leica has so far introduced 4 different X series APS-C format cameras. 

 

dunk

 

It would seem that simply buying a T body with a mated 18-55 gives one the X-Vario camera they are seeking.  Or, the T body with the 23mm lens gives one the X-typ 113.   Would this not suffice with the appropriate marketing scheme by Leica?  Sell them as packages, if need be! (And, if necessary revert to the traditional user face as found in the X series)

 

Perhaps you are correct, I certainly don't know, but to my way of thinking that would be a very cost effective way to proceed. 

 

Rob

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It would seem that simply buying a T body with a mated 18-55 gives one the X-Vario camera they are seeking. ...

All the controls of the T are behind glass and are operated with a touch screen. The important controls of the X are on manual controls which can be operated while the camera is off. The two do not compare at all. The XV is close to the Digilux 2 in its look and feel. I think I even would have bought a successor to the Digilux 2 with the same l&f, the same lens but a more recent sensor and EVF.

[DwF]

Just following these posts re the "T"   I have to say that for me, the Leica T does not look or feel like a camera I would even consider buying- I have handled one.  The X line cameras have the aesthetic and more importantly feel of a iia, c  or f. Of course the older cameras are more solid "brick-like".  Leica seems to be lacking anyone at the design level who both, understands the elegance that the old bodies including M cameras brought to the market place, and also has a voice in decision making.

[ropo54]

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All the controls of the T are behind glass and are operated with a touch screen. The important controls of the X are on manual controls which can be operated while the camera is off. The two do not compare at all. The XV is close to the Digilux 2 in its look and feel. I think I even would have bought a successor to the Digilux 2 with the same l&f, the same lens but a more recent sensor and EVF.

 

 

Just following these posts re the "T"   I have to say that for me, the Leica T does not look or feel like a camera I would even consider buying- I have handled one.  The X line cameras have the aesthetic and more importantly feel of a iia, c  or f. Of course the older cameras are more solid "brick-like".  Leica seems to be lacking anyone at the design level who both, understands the elegance that the old bodies including M cameras brought to the market place, and also has a voice in decision making.

I

am obviously the lone voice here, but, it seems that Leica is proceeding down the path of abandoning the X line, by eliminating the X1, X2, XVario.  

 

It would also seem that there could be an economy of production by letting one APS-c line serve in dual capactities - as a platform for that which the X does so well and for that which the T can do. Therefore, why not merge the 2 uses?  Many have gripes with the T interface, so, why not have a "" the differences? (Might it even be possible to make an electronic selection as to the interface that one wishes to use?  I'm not an engineer and have no idea what is involved, but I would think it could be done). 

 

Does my suggestion make any economic sense for Leica?

 

Could this new TL then be marketed to both X and TL/SL end users?

 

Again, I defer to those with more knowledge than myself. But, I just cannot understand why this would not be the "way to go" moving forward for Leica. 

 

Appreciate your thoughts, comments, and criticisms in the good spirit of debate! 

 

Rob

[dkCambridgeshire]

This is an X Vario IMAGES thread …    … So here's a few pics taken with my XV of the BIG EATS at The Leica Society April 2016 AGM Weekend at Guyers House Hotel, Corsham near Bath … and which feature 5 Leica Forum members, one of the co-authors of The Leica Pocket Book 8th Edition, a well known Leica/vintage camera dealer, a very well known Leica professional wedding photographer, and the RPS President … but I'm not specifically identifying any of them

 

 

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The Leica XV coped quite well over the weekend … … and there's not long to wait for the 2017 TLS AGM Weekend in Chester …

 

 

Best wishes

 

dunk 

Edited March 5, 2017 by dkCambridgeshire

[Photomic38]

Very serious meeting. Only water to drink ...

[DwF]

Very serious meeting. Only water to drink ...

Really, it was because the magenta of a nice Cab would be more than the X Vario could handle to process for color balance!   Kidding aside these are all beautifully done Dunk.

 

And Rob,  I hope that I didn't offend re my comments about the T.  It is all very personal and my relationship with Leicas (iia, iif, CL, M2-6 and then M8-MM) is personal.  The X seems a logical extension as far as feel and handling. It will be interesting to see what they develop with the T, how it holds up or sells and where they are in 5 years   

[ropo54]

Really, it was because the magenta of a nice Cab would be more than the X Vario could handle to process for color balance!   Kidding aside these are all beautifully done Dunk.

 

And Rob,  I hope that I didn't offend re my comments about the T.  It is all very personal and my relationship with Leicas (iia, iif, CL, M2-6 and then M8-MM) is personal.  The X seems a logical extension as far as feel and handling. It will be interesting to see what they develop with the T, how it holds up or sells and where they are in 5 years   

 

No offense taken and thank you for your concern.

 

I have had both the X cameras and the T, and frankly, never loved the T interface, but did love the images it could produce (as I did the X images, and particularly the X Vario).  My personal preference would be to have the X body, with its user interface, and the multitude of lens options that the T line affords.  I loved the output from the T, and frankly thought the innovative design of the body was quite a piece of camera-sculpture, but never really completely warmed to the touch screen interface.  Having said that, I thought perhaps that Leica might merge the 2 aps-c lines into 1, since it seems that they may be discontinuing the X line and the T line has gotten a somewhat cool reception.

 

We shall see, but, under any circumstance this is all fun to consider, or perhaps in light of Dunk's dinner table shots, I should say more "food for thought".

 

Regards,

Rob

Edited March 5, 2017 by ropo54

[wda]

Dunk, excellent social photography handled so well with the X-Vario.

[DwF]

No offense taken and thank you for your concern.

 

I have had both the X cameras and the T, and frankly, never loved the T interface, but did love the images it could produce (as I did the X images, and particularly the X Vario).  My personal preference would be to have the X body, with its user interface, and the multitude of lens options that the T line affords.  I loved the output from the T, and frankly thought the innovative design of the body was quite a piece of camera-sculpture, but never really completely warmed to the touch screen interface.  Having said that, I thought perhaps that Leica might merge the 2 aps-c lines into 1, since it seems that they may be discontinuing the X line and the T line has gotten a somewhat cool reception.

 

We shall see, but, under any circumstance this is all fun to consider, or perhaps in light of Dunk's dinner table shots, I should say more "food for thought".

 

Regards,

Rob

Thanks Rob,

 

I am using the Fuji X Pro 2 for lens options....and having too many options opens a can of worms. I enjoy a camera like the X because it only has one! I am enjoying the Fuji though quite a bit.

 

David

[gbealnz]

Can of worms indeed. I had at the same time the X-Vario, and the T. Loved both but wanted to reduce the inventory a touch, so sold the T. The T with the 18-56 was similar to the X-Vario, but like others I didn't really get on with the touch screen, sometimes it didn't work, plus I am old school and liked to see the relevant settings I had selected (or not) before turning the camera on. I do miss the T though, but am happy with the X-Vario.

 

The X-Vario even remained recently, I sold the X-Pro2. It's nice, but the only way for me to enjoy the X-Pro2 was with Fuji lenses, not my M or R lenses, so it went.

 

Anyway, enough deliberating, here's an example of having a camera with you. This is a "pop-up" theater, here for a short time, and showcasing short plays etc.

Gary

 

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[Stonewall Brigade]

My X Vario images:  https://triumph.smugmug.com/Photography/Leica-X-Vario-Goes-to-the-Flea/

[DwF]

The X-Vario even remained recently, I sold the X-Pro2. It's nice, but the only way for me to enjoy the X-Pro2 was with Fuji lenses, not my M or R lenses, so it went.

 

I have the MM and of course Leica glass to go with.  I considered another M9 (the M9 is the one I like) but finding a really great deal on the X Pro2 decided to go that route.  I already had a couple Fuji lenses. You are correct that Fuji lenses are the way to go with those cameras.

[wda]

Dunk, excellent social photography handled so well with the X-Vario.

Dunk, what focus mode did you use for these challenging groups? Sometimes face recognition works well but you are dependent on reasonable depth of field.

[dkCambridgeshire]

Dunk, what focus mode did you use for these challenging groups? Sometimes face recognition works well but you are dependent on reasonable depth of field.

 

 

I always use 'spot focus' and shift it to wherever required e.g. midpoint of the room or one person in the room … in these pics set camera to f11 to enable reasonable DOF throughout and used Leica SF58 TTL flash at 45º with its small white reflector extended … forget which ISO chosen but likely 200   I have never used face recognition … I'm a Luddite  

 

dunk

Edited March 6, 2017 by dkCambridgeshire

[wda]

I always use 'spot focus' and shift it to wherever required e.g. midpoint of the room or one person in the room … in these pics set camera to f11 to enable reasonable DOF throughout and used Leica SF58 TTL flash at 45º with its small white reflector extended … forget which ISO chosen but likely 200   I have never used face recognition … I'm a Luddite

 

dunk

And I very rarely use flash Although I might do if I had a lot of commissioned social photography to do. Thankfully I do not. Your lighting is very natural. Well done.

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[gbealnz]

I agree, very well done Dunk, good coverage of light from front to rear, not all at the front as per usual with flash.

Gary