There is NO "Digital Rangefinder Experience"

[setuporg]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

To answer many replies in various threads -- no, there is no such thing as digital rangefinder experience.

A rangefinder is a mechanical device that couples to Leica M lenses that allow for it, that is, that are real manual focus Leica lenses.

Simulating "rangefinder" with pixels is

• Bullshit
• Abomination
• Abhorrent
• Fake
• Terrible
• Ugly
• Stupid
• Nonsensical
• Idiotic

... you get the gist.  Do not propose it.  Do not speak about "digital rangefinder experience."  There is no such thing; there's never been such a thing; and there will never be such a thing.  Same as "digital childbirth experience."

Edited 15 hours ago by setuporg

[LUF Admin]

Interesting question, definitely worth a discussion.

But do you need to start it with such a barrage of invectiveness?

Yes, it's meant to be funny. But the tone is set, and not in a good way.

[lct]

22 minutes ago, setuporg said:

[...] there is no such thing as digital rangefinder experience [...]

What will i say to justify my M11 then? That it is for the M experience? Hardly so if i have a MEV1. For the lack of EVF? Impossible if i keep my Visoflex. For the very Visoflex? Confusing at best, is it optical or electronic? Because it is in silver and looks like a film camera? Problem is how to justify the Visoflex then? Because the Visoflex has tilting capabilities? Expensive tilt then! The good answer is: for the rangefinder experience. Incredible perhaps, but true.

[setuporg]

27 minutes ago, LUF Admin said:

Interesting question, definitely worth a discussion.

But do you need to start it with such a barrage of invectiveness?

Yes, it's meant to be funny. But the tone is set, and not in a good way.

Somebody has to say it to set the baseline!  Nothing personal, just a technical opinion.

[setuporg]

15 minutes ago, lct said:

For the very Visoflex?

Visoflex has nothing to do with the fake imaginary "digital rangefinder experience" where folks imagine pixellated rectangles converging.  At least for now until it is implemented to be shown in the Visoflex.  The simulated rectangles are not "digital rangefinder experience".  They are moving pixels onto each other experience.

[LUF Admin]

vor 3 Minuten schrieb setuporg:

Somebody has to say it to set the baseline! 

Wrong baseline.

Do you want me to start a discussion with you by telling you my honest opinion about your social skills?

If you like a direct approach:

Do not start (or continue) a discussion in this forum by insulting other opinions.

Am I clear?

[setuporg]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

100%!

[maidenfan84]

I don’t know…Leica, the king of rangefinders, seems to believer that it’s a true rangefinder in their eyes. I’d tend to trust the experts on this one. 

[SrMi]

30 minutes ago, setuporg said:

Somebody has to say it to set the baseline!  Nothing personal, just a technical opinion.

I do not believe that a technical opinion uses adjectives such as 'stupid,' 'fake,' 'ugly,' etc.

You dug yourself a hole with the initial post, and there is no way out :).

[Olaf_ZG]

Yep, the tone is set. Pity.

Digital rangefinder is like the digital crop on the Q: marketing talk from Leica.

Marketing rarely is about wrong or right.

[LocalHero1953]

A post that says more about the person writing it than it does about the subject matter.

[adan]

15 minutes ago, LocalHero1953 said:

A post that says more about the person writing it than it does about the subject matter.

That is true of every internet post ever made. 😁

The only thing that changes is what it says about the person writing it. Which is not limited to rudeness or politeness.

Edited 13 hours ago by adan

[SrMi]

18 minutes ago, Olaf_ZG said:

Yep, the tone is set. Pity.

Digital rangefinder is like the digital crop on the Q: marketing talk from Leica.

Marketing rarely is about wrong or right.

Hey, it's a big thing among Fuji RF owners.

Off topic: And no, Fuji RF has no rangefinder. It is interesting that the word 'rangefinder' has such marketing potential. 

P.S.: only "off-topic" posts can save this thread :).

Edited 13 hours ago by SrMi

[Kiwimac]

I’m always a bit quizzical about this. 
 

I started photography many aeons ago. My first real camera as it were was a Canon SLR. At that time, the only person with AF was Captain Kirk. 
 

Thus I learned using a manual focus split image fresnel screen. 
 

I don’t find using a rangefinder a great deal different from that. Parallax and not actually seeing through the lens is the only difference really. 
 

“but you can see outside the frame!” They cried. Well, maybe. Try seeing outside the 28 frame. Or even the 35. You can’t see much. 
 

The EVF M may well be a great thing - I can well imagine it will make certain lenses much easier to use. 90mm f1.5 anyone?

I saw comment that it would be great for people who’ didn’t want to learn how to use a rangefinder’. Seriously? It’s not terribly hard to learn. It’s pretty much identical to focusing a manual SLR: twist barrel until image in focus and press button. Not a lot to learn. 
 

I’m still in two minds about it. Yes, technically it’s not a rangefinder experience. But it sort of is. It allows the user to use the lenses in a body the same size and shape. I suspect many new members will join the cult. 
 

Would I? Sure. If I could no longer see well enough to use the rangefinder. I could keep on using my lenses and become ‘rangefinder adjacent’. 
 

History tells me not to buy the first version though…!

[adan]

26 minutes ago, SrMi said:

It is interesting that the word 'rangefinder' has such marketing potential.

It has been a truism that "every camera tends towards (or hopes to tend toward) the condition of a Leica."

Literally, in the case of post-WW2 and other copies (the Russian FEDs, Canon screw-mounts, etc.)

But also, split-image focus aids in SLR screens since the 1960s.

And the "smaller SLR boom" of the 1970s - Olympus (O)M system, Pentax ME, Nikon FM/E/A, Canon AE-1/A-1, even Leica's own shrinking SLRs: Leicaflex > R3 > R4/5/6.

Sadly, the rotbloat set in again, with AF's needs and built-in motor-winders, and so on.

Edited 12 hours ago by adan

[250swb]

You could mount an accessory rangefinder on the flash shoe and it would be a rangefinder digital experience. But isn't the problem that people are using the words 'digital rangefinder' because they've spent years deriding variations of Fuji and Sony cameras and now want to somehow make the M-EV1 seem different?

[adan]

22 minutes ago, Kiwimac said:

‘rangefinder adjacent’. 

Love it! 🤪👍

[pgk]

I would re-pose the OP as whether there is any point trying to achieve any sort of digital rangefinder experience. If a opto-mechanical solution exists then why not use it (within its operational parameters). Whilst there may be a way of mimicking the rangefinder electronically, why bother? Surely the better solution is to produce an electronis solution for precise and accurate manual focus which to my mind already exists but does not deliver as accurate nor as fast a solution for focus as the rangefinder can when parameters are optimal for it to do so.

[Chris W]

With the M EV-1, I do not see why they couldn't have invented a digital way of two images coming together, rangefinder style, perhaps with 'zoom in' so you could see how tight the two images were.

But they haven't, so the camera doesn't interest me, and neither do any of the Fujis

[Advertisement]

Hallo,

Look here: Interesting Leica gear

[Chris W]

3 minutes ago, pgk said:

Whilst there may be a way of mimicking the rangefinder electronically, why bother? 

Because  people who love rangefinder focussing tend to give up on it when they develop eyesight issues.