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shots upside down?

MEB

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MEB

MEB

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Has anyone else experienced this?  I took my M11 with a Leica 35 cron for a walk and took 38 pictures.  When I got home and transferred the shots to Lightroom Classic, five shots in a row were upside down and flipped sideways.  It was only those 5 pics...none of the others.

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adan

adan

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The digital Ms have an internal "tilt-meter" for (supposedly) detecting vertical vs. horizontal shots - and for use with the "leveling indicator" in the most-recent cameras with electronic viewing capability, and the on-screen level-indication feature included.

But as to orientation, that can be fooled or confused by making pictures taken with the lens significantly pointed up or down (up at the sky/tall buildings/stairways/ceilings, down at the sidewalk/floor/flowers/etc.) Copying documents laid flat on a table or a floor is another problem area.

What is "up" or "down" when the top and bottom of the camera are nearly level with one another?

The tilt-meters can also get "sticky" with age - unlikely with the quite-new M11, but my M10 now gets confused as to up and down/vertical-horizontal a bit more often than 7 years ago (maybe 1 shot in 200?)

Fortunately, most image-processing software includes simple ways to rotate the image through 90°/180° until it is as intended - or even in smaller increments.

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  • 2 weeks later...
Jan Y

Jan Y

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On 11/25/2023 at 6:38 PM, Gelatino said:

I've seen this after the last trip, just looking at the first results on the PC. Not so many, and not really disturbing as frequent freezing I must deal with my M11 after the last FW upgrade.

I am experiencing the upside down photos - both before and after the most recent firmware update. Also, the freezing! I looked through multiple posts about the freezing and decided to follow the advice to format my SD card using SD Association's SD Formatting program.  I think the formatting improved my freezing problem.

Also, I emailed Leica warranty folks about the freezing problem.  Leica emailed back stating I need to mail my camera in (ugh) if the new firmware did not resolve the freezing.  

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LanceR

LanceR

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I have had my M11 since launch and a couple of months ago I had some upside down shots.  That is the only time I have ever seen it across thousands of photos.  I have taken hundreds of photos since and I have not seen it.

It was during a walk around a nature area where I was taking photos for a couple of hours.  Out of the 50 or so shots about ten were upside down.  Interestingly, they were all together and about in the middle.

Unfortunately, I do not know the exact circumstances that lead to it.  It was a beach area with spray, etc. so I did not simply have the camera out the whole time.  I was putting it away as I navigated tricky areas.  I do not know if it was caused during a period when I had turned the camera on and off or it came back from sleep.

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  • 1 month later...
hmzimelka

hmzimelka

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I think this may also be a Lightroom issue and not just a camera issue... 

I recently went on a trip with my brother and didn't take my computer with. I imported my M11 files via Lightroom to his MacBook M1 Pro, and many of the files were not oriented properly. 

Back home, on my MacBook M1 Pro, I imported the same files from the SD card into my Lightroom catalogue, and not a single file was affected.

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Al Brown

Al Brown

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Posted (edited)

Man Leica was NOT joking when they wrote this promo piece on their website... they turned the whole known concept upside down...

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

Edited by Al Brown
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ianforber

ianforber

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Posted
10 hours ago, hmzimelka said:

I think this may also be a Lightroom issue and not just a camera issue... 

I recently went on a trip with my brother and didn't take my computer with. I imported my M11 files via Lightroom to his MacBook M1 Pro, and many of the files were not oriented properly. 

Back home, on my MacBook M1 Pro, I imported the same files from the SD card into my Lightroom catalogue, and not a single file was affected.

There’s a YouTuber called Dave Herring who’s having the same problem with the latest version of LR. Might not be all LR’s fault though. I use C1 and once had a few shots upside down from one outing when I was taking quite a few in portrait orientation. Might be that the camera got confused?

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hmzimelka

hmzimelka

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Posted (edited)
10 hours ago, ianforber said:

There’s a YouTuber called Dave Herring who’s having the same problem with the latest version of LR. Might not be all LR’s fault though. I use C1 and once had a few shots upside down from one outing when I was taking quite a few in portrait orientation. Might be that the camera got confused?

Likely a mix of both Adobe and Leica. Lightroom (Classic) can do weird things... it's always been a little buggy and unfinished for me. My biggest recent annoyances was that Lightroom would partially import M11 files from the SD or camera. I would have to re-import from to get the balance. Sometimes rarely, one unreadable DNG that would be fine on second import. This seems to finally have been fixed in one of the more recent updates.

Edited by hmzimelka
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dugby

dugby

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I suggest it could be an intermittent internal-camera issue, as all images natively light up the sensor upside down, and upon triggering the firmware records and associates the image and metadata for that shot.

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BillCB

BillCB

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Posted
On 1/9/2024 at 4:00 PM, ianforber said:

There’s a YouTuber called Dave Herring who’s having the same problem with the latest version of LR. Might not be all LR’s fault though. I use C1 and once had a few shots upside down from one outing when I was taking quite a few in portrait orientation. Might be that the camera got confused?

I use C! and had the issue.

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LeicaR10

LeicaR10

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Posted (edited)

Al Brown,  I completely agree with your post #11.  My multi-M11 variant experiences became such that I couldn't reliably do M photography.  So much so, I sold them all and took a trip back to the future with the M10-M and R.  I embrace technology...but not so much when it starts doing things like "Hal" from 2001 Space Odessy.  The flipping files, corrupted files, no files (just headings) and other events simply became too much.  Maybe when the  M12 arrives some year, the M camera will return to "earth" and take reliable photographs, like most M10s.  Last, there are times, that I start to wonder if some firmware developer has to be doing sabotage, especially with the latest firmware.  Bugs that were "fixed", suddenly start to reappear.  But hey; it was just a passing thought.  Anyways, I appreciate your post.  r/ Mark

Edited by LeicaR10
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Smudgerer

Smudgerer

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Posted (edited)
5 hours ago, LeicaR10 said:

Al Brown,  I completely agree with your post #11.  My multi-M11 variant experiences became such that I couldn't reliably do M photography.  So much so, I sold them all and took a trip back to the future with the M10-M and R.  I embrace technology...but not so much when it starts doing things like "Hal" from 2001 Space Odessy.  The flipping files, corrupted files, no files (just headings) and other events simply became too much.  Maybe when the  M12 arrives some year, the M camera will return to "earth" and take reliable photographs, like most M10s.  Last, there are times, that I start to wonder if some firmware developer has to be doing sabotage, especially with the latest firmware.  Bugs that were "fixed", suddenly start to reappear.  But hey; it was just a passing thought.  Anyways, I appreciate your post.  r/ Mark

I love the "HAL" reference...........Maybe that could be the last Special Edition of the M11 after the P, the M11 HAL?.........."Open the Pod doors........"

Edited by Smudgerer
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Herr Barnack

Herr Barnack

Posted
Posted (edited)
On 1/9/2024 at 5:08 AM, hmzimelka said:

I think this may also be a Lightroom issue and not just a camera issue... 

I recently went on a trip with my brother and didn't take my computer with. I imported my M11 files via Lightroom to his MacBook M1 Pro, and many of the files were not oriented properly. 

Back home, on my MacBook M1 Pro, I imported the same files from the SD card into my Lightroom catalogue, and not a single file was affected.

I have experienced inverted files in Lightroom - files that were created with my M-P 240 and Q2.  This makes me suspect that Adobe has incorporated some  "improvement" ( 🙄 ) to Lightroom that is the culprit - or perhaps Lightroom code just does not work and play well with Leica code.

Quote

...Maybe when the  M12 arrives some year, the M camera will return to "earth" and take reliable photographs

@LeicaR10 my concern is that Leica will not learn from the M11 and its issues and will choose to stubbornly forge ahead on this trail of flawed and dysfunctional technology. 

The worry is that when it lands, the M12 could be as bad as the M11 was in the beginning - or possibly even worse, which would be disastrous.  If that comes to pass, Leica could easily find itself in very dangerous waters.  Companies are easily sucked under by flawed decisions that are stubbornly adhered to; Kodak comes to mind.

The M12 is surely already in the works; I fervently hope these pitfalls have been thought through and addressed by the Pooh-Bahs in Wetzlar.

Edited by Herr Barnack
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