M11-D?

[newtoleica]

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On 6/16/2024 at 8:36 PM, gotium said:

Well I’m going cold on the idea of an M11-D. Firstly with the lack of support or fixes for the M10-D and now with parts apparently becoming unavailable if it needs repair, I can’t help but think of the cameras as having a short shelf-life for the cost. And with the D versions coming so late in the product cycle, I no longer think it makes sense to invest so much into it. Better just get whatever most basic model is avail for the best price and use it until it needs replacing. 

So I instead just bought a demo M11. But right off the bat I’m getting corrupted  and unreadable DNG files. I’m going to request a return for refund and don’t think I’ll want to get any of the M11 variants at this point. Too high risk of getting stuck with a defective product. 

Not sure what to do with my M mount lenses now. I was thinking I might get an M10, or an SL. But with Leica’s pricing plans, maybe now it’s time to jump ship. 

Just get a nice well looked after M10-P. Good solid camera and 24MP is the sweet spot on an M.

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[Budfox]

4 hours ago, newtoleica said:

Just get a nice well looked after M10-P. Good solid camera and 24MP is the sweet spot on an M.

Totally agree on the M10-P - prob should have never sold mine.

You could also go back to a new sensor M9 or M9-P, +/- MM if your budgets allows, with a nice side bag to hold them both. Great for perfecting your rangefinder technique and with super retro charm. Then just and wait and see what happens with the M12.

[setuporg]

So... where's the D?:)

[fenykepesz]

...perhaps for september ? i got the money together, mucho Geld, but where is that darn box ?  i am going to travel in Europe during the summer, perhaps i should get the m11d there in CH, pretty close to Wetzlar.  though it may not be ready by august, as much antifreeze as an M11* needs nowadays, right ?

[gotium]

1 hour ago, setuporg said:

So... where's the D?:)

They're adding a screen for a spinning beachball

Edited June 29, 2024 by gotium

[Kim Dahl]

I'm waiting too. Not sure if it should supplement my MD.

I think maybe we are now so close to the Leica M12 that I should see what it will be - what do you think?

Perhaps the freezing problems cannot be solved with the design that the Leica M11 has now and therefore the Leica M11-D has the same problem … 

[Robert Blanko]

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I would wait for the M12 which is hopefully more reliable than the M11.

[goodbokeh]

11 hours ago, Kim Dahl said:

I'm waiting too. Not sure if it should supplement my MD.

I think maybe we are now so close to the Leica M12 that I should see what it will be - what do you think?

Perhaps the freezing problems cannot be solved with the design that the Leica M11 has now and therefore the Leica M11-D has the same problem … 

Kim, I've considered a M11-P or D because of new features my dependable M10-R & M don't offer. For now the stubborn bugs have stopped my purchase but I'm hopeful a future firmware update can finally hit home. From a cost point of view, time is also pressing here in the States with the possible prospect of new 10% import tariffs on all products sometime in 2025.

Regarding the M12, with the recent introduction of the Q3 and SL3 cameras they have had their share of problems but not as bad as the M11. Possibly because they have a good bit of Panasonic DNA in them. So I would be very watchful on the M12 in the bug department.

Edited June 29, 2024 by goodbokeh

[grahamc]

The “did xxxxx update help your M11 freezing problems?” surveys and threads by admin here on this (wetzlar affiliated) forum should be a big red flag for anyone considering M11-D

Years after release they still aren’t certain where the M11 problems are or how to fix them

 

 

Edited July 3, 2024 by grahamc

[evikne]

It doesn't sound too promising when people talk about the next-next release even before the first one is launched. Let's hope that Leica gets it right and that the M11-D will be a great and successful camera. 

[Smogg]

1 hour ago, grahamc said:

The “did xxxxx update help your M11 freezing problems?” surveys and threads by admin here on this (wetzlar affiliated) forum should be a big red flag for anyone considering M11-D

Years after release they still aren’t certain where the M11 problems are or how to fix them

 

 

It is very important that Leica has stopped hiding problems and we know for sure that they are working on a solution. Some time ago there was an absolute vacuum and this caused great irritation; we did not understand whether we should expect something. Now the situation looks different and this has greatly increased my personal level of confidence in Leica.

[grahamc]

On 7/3/2024 at 7:15 PM, Smogg said:

It is very important that Leica has stopped hiding problems and we know for sure that they are working on a solution. Some time ago there was an absolute vacuum and this caused great irritation; we did not understand whether we should expect something. Now the situation looks different and this has greatly increased my personal level of confidence in Leica.

It’s very cute that they are trying.  Unsure that having customers be the beta testers for an expensive product is the best approach, but here we are 

Edited July 5, 2024 by grahamc

[Smogg]

1 hour ago, grahamc said:

It’s very cute that they are trying.  Unsure that having customers be the beta testers for an expensive product is the best approach, but here we are 

The one who does nothing makes no mistakes. We can see that the manufacturer made the right decisions and delayed the release of the M11D, although I am sure this led to some financial losses. I think this is a testament to Leica

[RobW0]

3 hours ago, grahamc said:

It’s very cute that they are trying.  Unsure that having customers be the beta testers for an expensive product is the best approach, but here we are 

It seems to have worked for Elon Musk. 

[grahamc]

3 hours ago, Smogg said:

The one who does nothing makes no mistakes. We can see that the manufacturer made the right decisions and delayed the release of the M11D, although I am sure this led to some financial losses. I think this is a testament to Leica

I do hope the extra time they have given themselves enables a trouble-free camera for this M11 variation, particularly for the D model as I've very happily owned D-262 and M10-D

But in reality it's 2.5 years since the release of M11 and still they are surveying users to see if their updates fixed freezing (and finding they didn't), so I would think the move on to M12 can't come soon enough for Wetzlar

Hopefully the D variant can be the odd one out though.

 

Edited July 5, 2024 by grahamc

[IkarusJohn]

Or it will be the M12-D.

[fenykepesz]

vor 4 Stunden schrieb IkarusJohn:

Or it will be the M12-D.

...an m12-d with global electronic shutter and IBIS and ISO starting at true 64 and 16bit readout ?

oh, and not to forget, a dynamo thumb rest, as there will be now space enough for such !  in fact, on my m10d i am constantly playing with its thumb rest - then why not charge a battery that way ?

Edited July 6, 2024 by fenykepesz

[evikne]

39 minutes ago, fenykepesz said:

...an m12-d with global electronic shutter and IBIS and ISO starting at 64 and 16bit readout ?

oh, and not to forget, a dynamo thumb rest, as there will be now space enough for such !  in fact, on my m10d i am constantly playing with its thumb rest - then why not charge a battery that way ?

If possible, then go for it! 

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[SrMi]

3 hours ago, fenykepesz said:

...an m12-d with global electronic shutter and IBIS and ISO starting at true 64 and 16bit readout ?

A global electronic shutter, instead of a stacked sensor, has the only advantage of having faster synchronization speed (flash) but a much lower dynamic range. I'll take stacked sensors instead of a global shutter sensor.

With the current sensor technology, a 16-bit readout would only contain noise in the two lowest bits, i.e., 16-bit would be a waste.

[hdmesa]

On 6/29/2024 at 12:23 AM, Kim Dahl said:

...I think maybe we are now so close to the Leica M12 that I should see what it will be - what do you think?...

We still have about a year and a half's worth of special editions to be released. Perhaps not all of these will be made, but still:

• M11-D
• M11 Safari
• M11 White or Ghost
• M11 Reporter
• M11 LHSA
• M11 Black Paint

The end of the run for a digital M is the best time to buy one because the firmware issues are nearly all fixed.