So would you rather have one M11 or 2 M10-R?

[lucerne]

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2 minutes ago, scott kirkpatrick said:

I've been using an M11 with the VF-2 since pretty close to its first appearance, so I went through some of the growing pains.  But with firmware 1.6.1, the M11 has been trouble-free. I was using both M11 and M10-R recently, in order to keep two lenses at hand, and the slower response of the M10-R was pretty off-putting.    So the 10-R may get sent off soon to raise a little cash for whatever is coming next.  Now, the M10-D is going to stay around for quite a while.  

Thanks Scott.  I'm settled with  M10-r.  For me, the file sizes from the M11 were too large.  

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[Jeff S]

There are many reasons I’m not interested in the M11, but file size isn’t a factor.  First, storage is cheap these days.  But the M11 is also capable of shooting lower resolutions than the M10-R.

Jeff

[jakontil]

I keep the M10r BP while adding the M11, good for back up too when travel, and like yours, on a day shooting i have one lens mounted on each so dont need to swap 

when travel afar, i usually carry another M films to accommodate another lens

what i love about M11 mostly its usb c charging and battery life, very gimmicky, as for the outputs i cant really tell the difference but i love both im comfortable applying the same presets in LR

however bout file size, my M10R stuck with 40mpx while i use 36mpx with M11

[Jewl]

M11 - why do I need two of the same model? Okay if I need to decide (same price) I would sell both M10Rs buy an M11 and use the remaining money to buy a lens 😉

[don daniel]

One M11 with one Apo-Summicron 35mm ist enough. 😀

[ianforber]

M11. As the Leica systems move towards a different battery, getting the M11 should hopefully allow a longer life by interoperability with other Leica cameras. Ideally there would be identical batteries for the Q, SL and M series cameras

[T25UFO]

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I have M10R Black Paint.  I bought it before the M11 was released and had a choice between regular and Black Paint, so that was easy.

However, Black Paint is just cosmetic and if I was buying today, I would go for the newer model.  Would I trade the M10R BP for an M11?  Only if it was a zero sum trade, and I have seen the Black Paint model offered for silly prices on eBay, but that doesn't mean anyone is actually buying!

[Warton]

2 hours ago, T25UFO said:

I have M10R Black Paint.  I bought it before the M11 was released and had a choice between regular and Black Paint, so that was easy.

However, Black Paint is just cosmetic and if I was buying today, I would go for the newer model.  Would I trade the M10R BP for an M11?  Only if it was a zero sum trade, and I have seen the Black Paint model offered for silly prices on eBay, but that doesn't mean anyone is actually buying!

I got M11 brand new first for about US$ 8000.

then a few weeks later a one-year old used M10-R black paint turned up for about US$ 6300. I couldn't resist it.

[acalmplace]

One M11 in my case. I don't have a dire need for two bodies and prefer lighter and smaller kits. I'm also ok with changing lenses as needed, that also points to not needing two bodies.

[Guest]

Easy decision because I prefer one M10-R over one M11. 

[phongph]

4 minutes ago, Studienkamera said:

Easy decision because I prefer one M10-R over one M11. 

Dear Studienkamera!

Pls. advise why You prefer M10-r over M11. Because color render, clasic color (vs digital color) or other reasons?

Thanks, Phong!

 

 

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, phongph said:

Dear Studienkamera!

Pls. advise why You prefer M10-r over M11. Because color render, clasic color (vs digital color) or other reasons?

Thanks, Phong!

I prefer the simpler shutter operation and the resulting sound of the M10-R. 

[Kiwimac]

Having used both, I would say one M11.

[Pierre68]

2 hours ago, Al Brown said:

The title of the thread reminds me of the Stanford marshmallow experiment

Two M10-Rs.
Welcome to my TED talk.

The Stanford experiment demonstrated children who were able to wait longer for the preferred rewards (ie 2 marshmallow later instead of immediate reward of 1 marshmallow) tended to have better life outcomes. 

In the "Leica experiment" who do you think would have better life outcome? Those with 1 M11 or those with 2 M10-R? Curious to know 😉 (Caution: Humorous post)

[Warton]

4 hours ago, Al Brown said:

Absolutely taken with humour! I bet those with two M10-R’s… so you could still use one body while you wait seven months for the other to be serviced in Wetzlar.

I didn't wait. I bought M11 and M10-R almost same time. And I am still happy.

so this Stanford experiment doesn't apply to me.

[lldd]

On 7/25/2023 at 4:42 PM, scott kirkpatrick said:

I've been using an M11 with the VF-2 since pretty close to its first appearance, so I went through some of the growing pains.  But with firmware 1.6.1, the M11 has been trouble-free. I was using both M11 and M10-R recently, in order to keep two lenses at hand, and the slower response of the M10-R was pretty off-putting.    So the 10-R may get sent off soon to raise a little cash for whatever is coming next.  Now, the M10-D is going to stay around for quite a while.  

Can you explain where/how the M10R is slower in response than the M11?  Not doubting you at all, just trying to understand the nuances between these two as I have the M10-R and am thinking about the M11.

[ELAN]

I used an M11 everyday for over a year.  Recently went back to the M10-R because I prefer its shutter experience and color science.  I miss many of the features of the M11 but the shutter and colors are most important to me.  I will happily trade my black M11 for a BP M10-R.

[pgh]

I prefer the M10 system, so I'll take one M10-R. But why not 2.

The resale value of the 2 will always be higher than one M11 - if you're the sort of person that is never quite happy with what you've got. In addition, unless this is all just a hobby for you I think anyone who actually is making work with an M series needs two, because service times are so long and it's not a matter of if but when. 

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[scott kirkpatrick]

On 7/30/2023 at 4:29 PM, lldd said:

Can you explain where/how the M10R is slower in response than the M11?  Not doubting you at all, just trying to understand the nuances between these two as I have the M10-R and am thinking about the M11.

I'm fairly sure that the M8, M9, and M10s all built their firmware about a set of distinct chips that each did one job -- manage the charging, handle the WiFi, process the image from the chip into the buffer, move it from the buffer to the SDcard, etc.  These were the signal processing substrates of an older generation of equipment.  With the M11, there is a leap to an Arm microprocessor in an SOC ("system on a chip") which offers multiple cores, operating in parallel to do everything.  The good side of this is that there is a huge market supporting these designs, so they can offer the latest, fastest circuits and have fast macros for the most important functions.  The bad side is that all of the software gets rewritten.  Many of the coders responsible for the original functions may have gone on to other jobs, most of them may be in contract firms that are not in Wetzlar.  And since some of the speedup comes from having more things running in parallel, it takes a while to find out how to make the tasks always keep each other fully informed and consistent.  Cameras freezing probably means that some function is waiting for a "done" signal from some other function that sent it long ago, or doesn't know that it is expected.  That's why we are at release 1.6.xx already.  Leica has done a great job making the menu interfaces of all their first-rank cameras as consistent as possible, but there are hard problems in layers further down, and it takes time for the bugs to surface.

[thrid]

I guess it depends. 

If you can afford two M11 and don't mind with the new shutter cycle then obviously it's the better choice. Bigger battery, better sensor, matrix metering, more future proof etc

I can see the advantage of the two M10-R bodies. It still is a very good camera and you can probably pick up two of them for a little more than the price of a single new M11.

Two M11 bodies would cost you a solid $20,000 vs 2 x M10-R for about $10-12k.

For an active shooter having two bodies with let's say a 35 / 50 mounted is a real boon. Also one acts a backup.

Personally I have seriously considered the two M10-R vs one M11 question myself. Still working on the final answer, but ultimately I will probably go for the M11

Edited August 1, 2023 by thrid