M11 freeze issues [Merged]

[Jeff S]

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40 minutes ago, charlesphoto99 said:

In almost twenty years of using digital cameras, I've never had to use a formatter outside of the cameras. Let's face it, if this is the case with the M11, that one has to use a third party formatter, then it's a 'broken' camera. 

Same for all my 8 digital Leica bodies… from M8.2 through to M10-R and M10 M and SL2…never had an issue simply formatting in-camera after computer download.

Jeff

 

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[Jeff S]

2 hours ago, ianforber said:

My approach seems so simple. I insert the card in the camera and format it. Job done.
 

I’ve done this with all brands of digital cameras I’ve had over the years without any problems. I never delete an image in camera, just import them into my Mac and then put the card back in the camera and format it again. 

+1

Jeff

[SrMi]

2 hours ago, charlesphoto99 said:

In almost twenty years of using digital cameras, I've never had to use a formatter outside of the cameras. Let's face it, if this is the case with the M11, that one has to use a third party formatter, then it's a 'broken' camera. 

You do not need to format it in the computer. However, if you suspect that your SD card has gotten out-of-whack, it may be good to format it with SD Memory Card Formatter before throwing it away. Again, this advice is independent of the camera band or model used.

[SrMi]

3 hours ago, ianforber said:

My approach seems so simple. I insert the card in the camera and format it. Job done.
 

I’ve done this with all brands of digital cameras I’ve had over the years without any problems. I never delete an image in camera, just import them into my Mac and then put the card back in the camera and format it again. 

I would not advise deleting individual images. For me, it is either "Delete All" or "Format." I switched from "Format" to "Delete All" when it was more convenient. I assume that the advantage of "Delete All" is that I could still recover images from a card I accidentally erased.

[Pixeleater]

Why is deleting an images(s) in camera not advised? Are there artifacts that affect card performance?

[Jeff S]

I shoot with my cameras, never edit with them; that’s what my PP is for.  Only time I format a card in-camera is after files are successfully downloaded and safely backed up. No chance of accidental deletion/erasure.  Simple. 
 

Jeff

[Pixeleater]

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Makes sense.

[Kwesi]

7 hours ago, charlesphoto99 said:

In almost twenty years of using digital cameras, I've never had to use a formatter outside of the cameras. Let's face it, if this is the case with the M11, that one has to use a third party formatter, then it's a 'broken' camera. 

You don't have to change your sd card workflow to use the M11

[SrMi]

5 hours ago, Pixeleater said:

Why is deleting an images(s) in camera not advised? Are there artifacts that affect card performance?

In my case: it is too easy to delete images by mistake, using LCD to evaluate an image is not optimal, and there is plenty of space on SD cards so that deletion can occur after import.
There are not any performance impacts with SD cards, AFAIK.

[MikeMyers]

Interesting to read all the above.   What I learned to do ages ago, and have done on all my digital cameras for as long as I can remember, is when I'm done shooting for a day, to download all images to computer, then use the camera's "format" command to format the card.  I was under the mistaken idea that this was a "slow format", but I accept now that it's essentially doing an "erase all".  

I'ts probably not necessary, but I have several digital cameras I now use (M8.2, m10, Fuji, Nikons) and I tend to re-use the same card in whatever camera I used it last time.  My M8.2 cards are usually small and old, so the image counter  is still useful.  My M10 and Nikon cards are faster and larger.  All of them nowadays are SanDisk.

I doubt these are the best or fastest cards now available, but I've never had an issue with them (although they are way too big for my M8.2 camera).

I've got an unrelated question I need to ask in this forum before I consider replacing my M10, especially with a Leica M taking 60-meg images.

 

As to crashing with an M11, while it seems obvious that a poor memory card can crash a camera, is that really what is going on with these M11 crashes?  

 

Memory cards: this was my last order:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07H9DVLBB/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_image_o06_s00?ie=UTF8&th=1

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Edited December 6, 2022 by MikeMyers

[SrMi]

2 hours ago, MikeMyers said:

As to crashing with an M11, while it seems obvious that a poor memory card can crash a camera, is that really what is going on with these M11 crashes?  

Likely not the case.

[Jeremy Bunting]

My M11 crashed just before Thanksgiving and never recovered. I was formatting the internal memory to delete some old photos when the phone went dark. After that, it refused to boot up from the internal memory. It would still boot up from a memory card but would not connect to the Fotos app. The folks at my local store said they’ve never seen the problem before, and I had to send the camera back to Leica. They’ve told me they need to replace the mainboard and I’ve been quoted four weeks. It’s pretty annoying—I’ve only had the camera a couple months. I feel they ought to have just replaced it and sold the defective unit refurbished. 
 

In the interim I’m shooting a 60 year old M2. Go figure. 

[lct]

1 hour ago, Jeremy Bunting said:

I feel they ought to have just replaced it

Indeed. I would have required a replacement or a refund.  

[Jeremy Bunting]

1 hour ago, Jeremy Bunting said:

My M11 crashed just before Thanksgiving and never recovered. I was formatting the internal memory to delete some old photos when the phone went dark. After that, it refused to boot up from the internal memory. It would still boot up from a memory card but would not connect to the Fotos app. The folks at my local store said they’ve never seen the problem before, and I had to send the camera back to Leica. They’ve told me they need to replace the mainboard and I’ve been quoted four weeks. It’s pretty annoying—I’ve only had the camera a couple months. I feel they ought to have just replaced it and sold the defective unit refurbished. 
 

In the interim I’m shooting a 60 year old M2. Go figure. 

^^ I meant "camera," not phone, clearly. I suppose I'm more used to these issues with smartphones than I am with cameras. The idea that a camera can crash and fail to "boot" seems wrong to me.

[MikeMyers]

21 minutes ago, Jeremy Bunting said:

My M11 crashed just before Thanksgiving and never recovered. I was formatting the internal memory to delete some old photos when the phone went dark.

In your update, I'm not sure what you mean, but from what you wrote, it got me wondering.  When the M11 stores images on the internal memory, is that treated just like an external SD memory card, from which you can delete files at will, or "format" to get it clean again?  Do firmware updates ever get written to that internal memory?  Does camera software ever get written there?  If that memory were to somehow get "corrupted", would the M11 ever even notice it, unless/until you tried to save images to it?

Can you, whenever you wish to, "clean out" that internal memory so in effect it is "wiped clean"?  Does the M11 even look at that memory when the camera is booting or being shut down?

I understand that the people at the store didn't know what was going on, but if you live in the USA did you call the Tech Support technicians at Leica USA ?

[Jeremy Bunting]

19 minutes ago, MikeMyers said:

In your update, I'm not sure what you mean, but from what you wrote, it got me wondering.  When the M11 stores images on the internal memory, is that treated just like an external SD memory card, from which you can delete files at will, or "format" to get it clean again?  Do firmware updates ever get written to that internal memory?  Does camera software ever get written there?  If that memory were to somehow get "corrupted", would the M11 ever even notice it, unless/until you tried to save images to it?

Can you, whenever you wish to, "clean out" that internal memory so in effect it is "wiped clean"?  Does the M11 even look at that memory when the camera is booting or being shut down?

I understand that the people at the store didn't know what was going on, but if you live in the USA did you call the Tech Support technicians at Leica USA ?

I had an incorrect word in my initial post. I said "when the phone went dark," rather than "when the camera went dark."

I'm unclear on whether software is stored on the same 64gb that's earmarked for photos. I am inclined to think not given my camera was booting with an SD card in, but not from internal memory. 

Yes, you can format the internal memory whenever you want to wipe the photos from it. It was during a routine reformat that my camera crashed and the internal memory ceased to function.

I left my camera with my store on the understanding they would phone Leica USA and run the troubleshooting. No dice. Leica USA has confirmed to me that the mainboard needs to be replaced, and the camera has a fault in its electronics.

[Jeremy Bunting]

By way of update, this thread inspired me to call Leica USA again today to check on the status of the repair and shout into the void. I expressed my frustration that I was not offered a replacement camera, and instead have to wait for the defective M11 I was sold to be repaired so soon after purchase.

They're shipping me a loaner M11 while mine is being repaired. I am very pleased with this outcome, though I wish it had been offered to me initially. 

[Viv]

My M11 has never locked up.

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[MikeMyers]

4 minutes ago, Jeremy Bunting said:

Leica USA has confirmed to me that the mainboard needs to be replaced, and the camera has a fault in its electronics.

Maybe this is related to all the other M11 users dealing with crashes.  If that's the case, that would mean a lot of M11 cameras may need a trip back to Leica to be fully corrected.  That they are loaning you a replacement is wonderful service!

[Jeff S]

5 minutes ago, Jeremy Bunting said:

By way of update, this thread inspired me to call Leica USA again today to check on the status of the repair and shout into the void. I expressed my frustration that I was not offered a replacement camera, and instead have to wait for the defective M11 I was sold to be repaired so soon after purchase.

They're shipping me a loaner M11 while mine is being repaired. I am very pleased with this outcome, though I wish it had been offered to me initially. 

Old saying..,”squeaky wheel gets the grease.”  Speak up with the dealer, and/or change dealers. You should have been offered a new camera or refund, by the dealer.

Jeff