M11 freeze issues [Merged]

[Fractal]

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24 minutes ago, Al Brown said:

If you search for M11 freezing and similar phrases in the search bar of the forum you will see that all the answers have already been given, with long debates and many opinions.
Two examples:

https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/328694-m11-freezing-up-and-becoming-un-responsive/

https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/350093-technical-question-about-freezingnot-responding/

 

Thank you. Yeah, I had read some of the threads on it. I was just wondering really what the scale of the cameras affected has been. If it's something that doesn't happen as frequently as I may think then I'd likely go for the camera.

[chris_tribble]

… though I’ve found the M10-R has been a reliable delight to work with. If you want to step up from the M240, I’d strongly recommend this, or a used M10 as a great value way of experiencing the improve Leica digital experience. I’ve as yet to find a compelling reason to get an M11.

[lct]

Indeed seems like most people don't have any problem with the M11. Got only one due to a faulty memory card in 4,500+ shots personally. Now an important firmware update is due at the end of 2022 so it could be wise to wait a bit more as a precaution.

[hdmesa]

1 hour ago, Al Brown said:

The problem here is that only those who had it report it as a problem (obviously) and nobody knows how many never had it as they are not talking about it. Usually those who had a certain problem with Leica (here the freezing issue) are fewer than those who did not have it.

More people could be having lockups than we read about here. No way to know for sure, but we can't assume either way.

Matt Day just bought one and is having occasional lockups.

https://youtu.be/aNa1SQLNJ3g?t=1213

Edited November 26, 2022 by hdmesa

[Fractal]

2 hours ago, chris_tribble said:

… though I’ve found the M10-R has been a reliable delight to work with. If you want to step up from the M240, I’d strongly recommend this, or a used M10 as a great value way of experiencing the improve Leica digital experience. I’ve as yet to find a compelling reason to get an M11.

Thanks for the input. This was the direction I was considering, the M10-R, but the internal storage and uhs-II reader has me looking at the m11. Coming from Sony and being used to dual slots and UHS-II I like these features quite a bit. 

2 hours ago, Al Brown said:

The problem here is that only those who had it report it as a problem (obviously) and nobody knows how many never had it as they are not talking about it.

Yeah, online perceptions can be skewed based on a few who have issues

[Fractal]

1 hour ago, lct said:

Indeed seems like most people don't have any problem with the M11. Got only one due to a faulty memory card in 4,500+ shots personally. Now an important firmware update is due at the end of 2022 so it could be wise to wait a bit more as a precaution.

This was the information I was looking for, i figure there’s more positive experiences than negative. I did see some issues with Sony cards and all my UHS-II cards are Sony tough, however none of them were affected by the recall from Sony so I’m not sure if these would cause a problem. I have a number of Sandisk UHS-I cards as well. 

 

40 minutes ago, hdmesa said:

More people could be having lockups than we read about here. No way to know for sure, but we can't assume either way.

Matt Day just bought one and is having occasional lockups.

https://youtu.be/aNa1SQLNJ3g?t=1213

I saw Matt Days video yesterday and it’s what brought me to ask this question. I was getting ready to buy an M11 and just wanted some assurance before doing so.

[lct]

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1 hour ago, Fractal said:

I did see some issues with Sony cards and all my UHS-II cards are Sony tough, however none of them were affected by the recall from Sony so I’m not sure if these would cause a problem.

I am pretty sure it is one of the causes at least since my only issue went from a Sony Tough card. I only use UHS-I (not II) Sandisk cards since then with no problem at all. Now if you're after some assurance, i would wait for the next firmware update as suggested above.

[MikeMyers]

5 hours ago, Fractal said:

found a really good deal at a Leica dealer on a near mint M240. I figured it'd be good to try it out and see how I got along with it. Needless to say I'm loving the experience and fulfills what I had previously been searching for with manual lenses on my Sony cameras

Curious, if you are loving the experience of the M240, what is it that you hope to improve in a newer camera?  In what way does your M240 lack the ability to meet your needs?

If it's a larger file size, how many megs do you need?  In what way do you feel the M240 to be lacking?

[Fractal]

13 minutes ago, MikeMyers said:

Curious, if you are loving the experience of the M240, what is it that you hope to improve in a newer camera?  In what way does your M240 lack the ability to meet your needs?

If it's a larger file size, how many megs do you need?  In what way do you feel the M240 to be lacking?

Honestly, it's partially GAS but really I  would like something with better high iso performance. To me on the 240 1600 iso seems passable, and 3200 was ok but borderline unacceptable. This is more of a daily camera for me, I still have my Sony gear for when I need auto-focus or off-camera flash. It's not really the sensor size, I could do with or without it and it's not a selling point for me, but some of the other stuff like the better low light performance, internal memory and UHS-II.

I like shooting with redundant storage for peace of mind. I've had cards corrupt in the past, although this was when I first started shooting with a DSLR and the memory cards weren't the most reliable. I haven't had this happen in 10 years since getting better cards, but I like to be safe.

[Luke_Miller]

I still find my M240 sufficient for my needs. While better high ISO performance would be nice, currently available noise reduction programs produce results that are very acceptable in my high ISO shots. 

[Tailwagger]

Have you gone back and read all the complaints about the 240, M10 and 10-R?  Every generation of M has had it detractors, particularly in its first year. I've experienced occasional lockups with every digital Leica I've ever owned which includes the 240, M10, M10-R, Q and SL2.  The advantage of the M11 over all the previous generations in this regard is that it takes a split second to pull the lever on the battery and push it back in.  Was a real PITA with the previous generations bottom plate to force a reset.

AFAIC, the M11 is a substantial upgrade over the 10/10-R, but much depends on what you value and how you shoot.  Personally, having traded my 240 and M10 when I upgraded to the 10-R, if I knew then what I know now, I'd have kept them for their gentler rendering particularly with earlier glass, skipped the R and waited the year and half for the M11. Each generation of M has had some measure of unique character, but of the four, I personally find the 10-R the least compelling in that regard.  Since acquiring the M11, mine has sat gather dust waiting for the day when I figure out just what to trade it in on.  That said, if pressed to crown one of the four I've owned, I'd have to say that the original M10, while not the most capable, nor accurate, remains my favorite. The M11 is a very close second.

 

[hdmesa]

4 hours ago, Fractal said:

This was the information I was looking for, i figure there’s more positive experiences than negative. I did see some issues with Sony cards and all my UHS-II cards are Sony tough, however none of them were affected by the recall from Sony so I’m not sure if these would cause a problem. I have a number of Sandisk UHS-I cards as well. 

 

I saw Matt Days video yesterday and it’s what brought me to ask this question. I was getting ready to buy an M11 and just wanted some assurance before doing so.

Sony Tough issue with Leica M cameras is something else entirely. It's not about the defective card issue they had for a while.

Matt Day was not the first YouTuber with an issue – Hugh Brownstone's first copy completely died.

[Fractal]

2 hours ago, Tailwagger said:

Have you gone back and read all the complaints about the 240, M10 and 10-R?  Every generation of M has had it detractors, particularly in its first year. I've experienced occasional lockups with every digital Leica I've ever owned which includes the 240, M10, M10-R, Q and SL2.  The advantage of the M11 over all the previous generations in this regard is that it takes a split second to pull the lever on the battery and push it back in.  Was a real PITA with the previous generations bottom plate to force a reset.

AFAIC, the M11 is a substantial upgrade over the 10/10-R, but much depends on what you value and how you shoot.  Personally, having traded my 240 and M10 when I upgraded to the 10-R, if I knew then what I know now, I'd have kept them for their gentler rendering particularly with earlier glass, skipped the R and waited the year and half for the M11. Each generation of M has had some measure of unique character, but of the four, I personally find the 10-R the least compelling in that regard.  Since acquiring the M11, mine has sat gather dust waiting for the day when I figure out just what to trade it in on.  That said, if pressed to crown one of the four I've owned, I'd have to say that the original M10, while not the most capable, nor accurate, remains my favorite. The M11 is a very close second.

 

Good insight, thank you. I do intend to keep the M240 as a backup, so having a higher resolution camera such as the M10-R or M11 would allow me to do have a use case for the 240 other than just a backup.

[LeicaR10]

Fractal,  I sent you a PM so not to derail your OP thread.  r/ Mark

[rxj]

Newish M11 user here. Taken about 2000 shots so far and never had a freeze up or any kind of lock up. Have a latest firmware on it.

[ianforber]

Never had any problem with my M11 but I appreciate that some have, possibly depending on their choice of SD card, settings or pure bad luck. Personally, I’d buy the M11 (I did!). If you’re buying new, you have the warranty. If second hand, there’s either the remaining Leica warranty or, if you don’t want it, you’ll be able to sell it with very little if any loss of money. 

[IkarusJohn]

My M Editioin 60 bricked and went back to Leica.  When they returned it, they commented that I have an unusual set up (can’t remember what it was now - I think it was a variation on something that Thorsten Overgaard had suggested).  The point was that Leica can only test so many scenarios - some configuratioins and circumstances may just expose a flaw in the firmware.

Hopefully, Leica has, or will sort this with an upgrade.  The M11 seems to be at the complicated end in terms of its electronics.  I’m sure they’ll sort it.

[lct]

17 hours ago, MikeMyers said:

Curious, if you are loving the experience of the M240, what is it that you hope to improve in a newer camera?  In what way does your M240 lack the ability to meet your needs?

If it's a larger file size, how many megs do you need?  In what way do you feel the M240 to be lacking?

Your question was not directed at me but FWIW i own both M11 and M240 and i kept the latter as a solid backup as well as for occasional video shootings. I don't miss its slow LV, outdated EVF nor banding at 6400 iso though to be honest. Let alone its lack of BSI sensor preventing red edge issues with symmetrical WA lenses. It is not a flaw of the M240 though as BSI sensors were not in use at its launch if memory serves me well.

[Herr Barnack]

16 hours ago, Luke_Miller said:

I still find my M240 sufficient for my needs. While better high ISO performance would be nice, currently available noise reduction programs produce results that are very acceptable in my high ISO shots. 

@Luke_Miller Which noise reduction programs are you using, and which do you prefer? 

Please elaborate for us...

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[MikeMyers]

1 hour ago, ianforber said:

possibly depending on their choice of SD card,

Easily avoided - I only buy SD cards from a brand that I trust, and a source that I trust.  They used to come from B&H.  Lately,  I've bought some from Amazon.  Saving money on cheap SD cards sounds like a huge risk to me.