I ordered the m10-r black paint

[Guest]

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5 hours ago, Steven said:

I know ! I was just joking ! 

Must say, Steve’s M10-R BP looks insane! So nice.

Would love to own that edition of the M10-gen camera…

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[ianman]

31 minutes ago, mcpallesen said:

Must say, Steve’s M10-R BP looks insane! So nice.

Keep this to yourself but I think Steven is a bit insane... but nice

 

[IkarusJohn]

I just find the whole idea baffling.  When I saw Brian Brake’s battered M4, now held in Te Papa Tongarewa (our National Museum), I thought it was fascinating, with its black paint worn off and scratched; not because it was beautiful, but because it reflected the realities of his journeys through China, in the grips of the Cultural Revolution, and other interesting places.

I just don’t get taking sandpaper to an expensive, beautiful new black paint Leica.  But each to her or his own.  Hate?  No.  Mockery, well sometimes it is too tempting!

[ianman]

49 minutes ago, Steven said:

Third most dangerous human behavior i can think of, right after hate and judgement. 

Selfishness, anger, jealousy, etc. They all derive from ignorance. Judgement is ok depending on the intent. For example - and without wishing to reopen the debate - when a while ago I mentioned the red edges I and others could see on some or your photos, there was no ill intent.

[IkarusJohn]

2 hours ago, Steven said:

Third most dangerous human behavior i can think of, right after hate and judgement. 

Then you will go through life misinterpreting the intentions of others, and being needlessly hurt by the interactions of people who mean you no harm.  For someone who posts so prolifically, sharing opinions and passions, do you really expect others to universally applaud your contributions?

I have zero reasons to “hate” you, or what you post.  But, to be honest, some of it I struggle to take seriously.  Sanding a brand new camera is a case in point.  You post, anticipating praise (which you get), but surely you can cope with others looking askance …  The black paint finish on the M10-R and other Leicas is beautiful.  It’s a badge of honour, I guess, to see it worn, like an old scarred war-horse, probably matching the cameras’ owners.  What does sanding the lovely lacquer paint off achieve?

Most of us here can laugh at ourselves (this distinguishes this forum from so many others).  Can you?

Edited September 2, 2021 by IkarusJohn

[Guest BlackBarn]

On 8/24/2021 at 8:52 AM, Steven said:

Of course ! It looks 60 years old now, except for the screen. I love it. 

‘But it’s alright, bring it on’……ok bait taken!

I can see why you love it - as a decorative object - it stands up because for my eyes it’s creative,  sensitively done with the black against the applied discreetness of the gold - all visually appealing.

Its the ‘looks 60 years old now except for the screen’ bit which doesn’t quite fit and implies tapping into the ethos of the hard travelled photographer/s. When a camera is made with the intent that it looks 60 years old then its easy to perceive it’s not simply the visual impression of the camera that is being replicated/faked but the camera and its associated use. A camera which has aged naturally has seen life and I would suggest that life matters as it does to those photographers using their cameras consistently as well as to appreciative collectors.

I think the sand papered camera falls between being artistic yet - based on the comment -  the attraction is also in carrying the aged , leaving it open to falling into the faked category with all that implies. We are not looking at a camera with a Picasso dove painted on it nor one with a Banksy’s girl and red ballon. It looks attractive  because it looks old and that implies a  transfer of ‘meaning’. This is where the intent becomes fuzzy and for me  overrides its artistic qualities. The doing can be interpreted as trying to shortcut and highjack the meaning.

Concluding this friendly banter - Keeping  and using a 2021 BP ‘digital’ camera for 16-60 years for it to acquire its natural patina is a hard thing for anyone to imagine and almost impossible to imagine when considering a collector photographer of the rare, greatest and try the latest. As the look was so appealing, there was little choice but to go for it….Bravo!

ps.

The  sinister side of me suspects that the  marketing boys at Leica knew a 2021 BP digital would unlikely have the time to naturally age…their success is based  on producing the next bit of romance to sell. Likewise, when we got the  M10 we were certain we didn’t need or want the  M11 and when we get the M11 we know we will never need or want the M12 or M13… Unfortunately Leica knows we will.

 

 

[harmen]

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There is an element of fashion to these cameras.  Some of the appeal is similar to that of a mechanical watch.  The feel and texture of the material is what makes the camera a great object to hold, as is its heft.  I find this even more so with the film-based versions, which can also be held more easily without smudging a screen.  Jeans can be fashionably torn and weathered.  Why not cameras?  There seems to be a fine line between the Lenny Kravitz bling and something more elegant and it has something to do with how natural the unnaturally obtained result looks.  It works not only for jeans, but coffee shops too.  The tension within something that can both last and fades with time is particularly appealing: both diamond and snowflake.

[panoramer]

Am 22.7.2021 um 13:59 schrieb Steven:

When I first posted about that camera two month ago, I had seen an internal document that clearly read (limited edition of 2000 copies). But of course, we have seen it before, so it could happen again. 

I only believe them when they write it on the item, like my Silver Noctilux that is actually numbered ! 

My black painted Summilux 1.4 / 50 mm pre-asph. is also from a limited number of 2000 pieces. The product does not have the number 1-2000, but the normal production number. The very limited editions of 200 or 50 are again marked in this way (181-200). Now I was able to combine my Summilux with the new Leica M10-R BP, which I was able to pick up from the Leica dealer on Thursday. It looks awesome.

[ianman]

On 9/3/2021 at 2:50 PM, harmen said:

There is an element of fashion to these cameras.

Well yes, that's the problem.

[Gobert]

On 9/2/2021 at 5:02 PM, Steven said:

Why not !! 

About the rest, chill. I don't care about what you say, what you think, or what anyone on here thinks! I'm just having a good time. Only love, no stress. Everything is ok 🥰🥰😘

You’re in hippie mode?

[250swb]

On 9/1/2021 at 2:29 PM, Al Brown said:

Wow no sarcasm and haters on Steven's sand paper job, but lots of hate on some others before in the very same thread. Quite interesting.

Yes I dislike Steven's sandpaper job a lot. I dislike the fact that it could have been done so much more authentically instead of looking so obviously fake, along the lines of 'if you are going to do a job, do it well'. I think he'd have been better to leave it until after studying what real worn cameras look like, but it would still be fake. But there are always internet shit stirrers who are like little schoolboys gathered around a playground fight egging the participants on and interjecting words like 'hate' where none exists, hoping to ramp up disagreement on a camera into outright conflict between people.

[250swb]

1 minute ago, Al Brown said:

Yup, and they frequent this forum.

You do.

[benqui]

Am 1.9.2021 um 15:29 schrieb Al Brown:

Wow no sarcasm and haters on Steven's sand paper job, but lots of hate on some others before in the very same thread. Quite interesting.

maybe the haters are mellowed with age

[IkarusJohn]

Crikey, give it a miss!

The thing about this forum is that people are generally honest and helpful.  We are NOT haters and shit stirrers.  We speak our minds; honestly, usually helpfully and respectfully.  If you take the time to actually read what people write, over many threads, and many issues, you will see that this is the case.  Sure, some people have particular ways of communicating, but we know that.

To say that Steven taking sandpaper to a new camera is stupid is not hating.  It’s saying what we think.  This is a space where a number of us have been contributing for some years.  We enjoy it.  Get in step and join in; preferably without such such disrespect!

[M9reno]

The decision to use sandpaper is personal.  An assessment of the final result is personal: there is no objective way to say that the end result looks bad… or good: de gustibus non disputandum est.

The question of whether the conspicuous destruction of (commercial value) - in this case the potential resale price of an expensive camera - should shock us, impress us, etc., is a different sociological question (Veblen, Leisure Class).  It is not to be mixed up with the question of taste, although it is true that one important role of the leisured elite is to establish standards of “good” taste.

Yet, I really doubt that the latter is what Steven is trying to do here.  Harmless fun with Leicas, any way you look at it.

[harmen]

Why say that something is stupid?  That sounds like watering it down.  Stupidity could seem to be a more acceptable reason for someone's behaviour, maybe?  It would suggest that the perpetrator could not have done better due to inherent limitations to their brain.  However it may be more to the point to say their decision was one of terrible taste, acknowledging that someone has made the decision despite being of sound mind.  I would not water down what was done to plain stupidity.  There was attention.  There was intention.  It was done thoughtfully.  Alcohol was not a factor.

Just thoughts and desires that I can't fathom 😉   Frankly, there is no excuse!

[ianman]

On 9/10/2021 at 9:51 AM, Steven said:

Sure, but it’s a bit of strong judgement. 

It’s an opinion on the act, not on the person… at least, that’s how I read it.

[grahamc]

Reddit is this you ? 

I didn't see anything too offensive although only had time to look through 3 pages of the great sandpaper debate. Probably time we all move on (and put the sandpaper away)   

Edited September 12, 2021 by grahamc

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Hallo,

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[rtai]

I remember hanging out with Tom Abrahamsson when a follow Leica aficionado pulled out a brand new at the time LHSA black paint M6TTL sandpapered for a vintage look. Tom said you know it would take me 10,000 rolls of film to make a new camera look like that so looks like you saved yourself a lot of money. I sure miss hanging out with good ol’ Tom.

[Tessar.]

There are advantages further down the line when someone takes sandpaper to a new camera.  Three years ago I bought this camera that had been owned by photographer Sara M Lee for about a thousand pounds below the price of a mint M240-P.   I sold it six months later for a small profit, or at least the increase offset the commission fee, making it cost neutral. 

Interestingly my normal dealer for commission sales didn't want to touch it and said it had been abused (which it hadn't), but another well known commission seller did accept it without question.

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