Mono 264 or M10M

[Kamyar]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

Hey everyone. I have mono246, And I love it so much.  Is it wise to replace it with m10m?  Do you recommend this?  I already own the SL2.  Should I replace m10m with mono 246.  Please guide me.  Thankful

[Likaleica]

I can think of only 3 reasons.  

1. You love the form factor and UI of the M10 platform much more than the 240 platform;

2. You plan to make very large black and white landscape prints

3. You need higher ISO for your photography

Fourth reason:

4. You want it (and can afford it). 😁

Edited February 3, 2020 by Likaleica

[Kamyar]

Actually i can sell my m246 and pay more for this. But. I want know Is this right? I've also printed at 24 mega pixels in large size.  Is this wise?

[Likaleica]

Can you rent one?  I think only you can decide what is best.  At the very least play with one at a store for an hour or so and compare with your 246.

[Kamyar]

Yes.  I held it in the store for a short time.  It is lighter and smaller.  I couldn't see the big photos of it.

[Jeff S]

1 hour ago, Likaleica said:

I can think of only 3 reasons.  

1. You love the form factor and UI of the M10 platform much more than the 240 platform;

2. You plan to make very large black and white landscape prints

3. You need higher ISO for your photography

Fourth reason:

4. You want it (and can afford it). 😁

Or often need to crop significantly. 

Jeff

[SrMi]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

1 hour ago, Likaleica said:

I can think of only 3 reasons.  

1. You love the form factor and UI of the M10 platform much more than the 240 platform;

2. You plan to make very large black and white landscape prints

3. You need higher ISO for your photography

Fourth reason:

4. You want it (and can afford it). 😁

I have also found high-resolution files to be more malleable in post, including when applying perspective transformations (assuming the same output size as with lower resolution sensors).

Edited February 3, 2020 by SrMi

[wolfloid]

I posted this on Fred Miranda.com https://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1631448/3

I'm sure that this is a beautiful camera, and that many will lust after it. However, I thought long and hard about buying the M246 or waiting for the future M10M, and in the end decided that I would prefer the M246. Here is my rationale:

 

1. The most important thing for me was the viewfinder experience, but testing the M246 and the M10 side by side, again and again, I decided that the M10 was only marginally better (and I wear glasses), and not enough to sway me one way or another. Also, I don't possess anything with a shallower depth of field than the CV 50/1.5, for which the M246 viewfinder seems to work very well.

 

2. Battery life is much better in the M246 - much better for trekking in Nepal, which I do.

 

3. I preferred the M246 ISO button and spinning the wheel to the awkward-to-lift M10 ISO dial (it needs a redesign).

 

4. Video (B&W, a delight) might come in useful. I'll give it a go one day, perhaps.

 

5. I've heard so much obsessing about the thickness of the M246, and indeed I much prefer the feel of my thinner & lighter M6 bodies, but find that on the digital (no thumb lever to cock) it makes no difference to me. I am now very used to the M246 lump. The weight is the same as the M10M anyway, both the M246 and the M10M are heavier than I would prefer.

 

6. It seems the early reviewers are confirming my suspicion 40MP files require the use of a higher shutter speed to get a fully sharp image than is needed on the M246; this seems to more-or-less negate the 1 stop noise/banding advantage of the M10M that Reid Reviews indicates.

 

The real difference for me is the surprising and not expected MP boost to 40MP. Obviously for landscape photographers, working on tripods this is not to be ignored. It might also be a boon for those wanting to crop heavily. However, for me as a primarily reportage style photographer, the resolution of the M246 is already an abundance. I might change my mind at some time in the future if my needs change, but to me at the moment the M246 is just superb! 

 

So for those who want to shoot in digital B&W and who like rangefinders, and who do not want to spend over $8,000, you really do not have to, consider the older model, it is just so good. Those who have it already, think a moment before you sell your spare kidney.

 

bear in mind that many people will recommend that you upgrade, because we humans just like new, better toys.

Edited February 3, 2020 by wolfloid
Tried to get rid of the black around the text

[T25UFO]

49 minutes ago, wolfloid said:

I posted this on Fred Miranda.com https://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1631448/3

I'm sure that this is a beautiful camera, and that many will lust after it. However, I thought long and hard about buying the M246 or waiting for the future M10M, and in the end decided that I would prefer the M246. Here is my rationale:

 

1. The most important thing for me was the viewfinder experience, but testing the M246 and the M10 side by side, again and again, I decided that the M10 was only marginally better (and I wear glasses), and not enough to sway me one way or another. Also, I don't possess anything with a shallower depth of field than the CV 50/1.5, for which the M246 viewfinder seems to work very well.

 

2. Battery life is much better in the M246 - much better for trekking in Nepal, which I do.

 

3. I preferred the M246 ISO button and spinning the wheel to the awkward-to-lift M10 ISO dial (it needs a redesign).

 

4. Video (B&W, a delight) might come in useful. I'll give it a go one day, perhaps.

 

5. I've heard so much obsessing about the thickness of the M246, and indeed I much prefer the feel of my thinner & lighter M6 bodies, but find that on the digital (no thumb lever to cock) it makes no difference to me. I am now very used to the M246 lump. The weight is the same as the M10M anyway, both the M246 and the M10M are heavier than I would prefer.

 

6. It seems the early reviewers are confirming my suspicion 40MP files require the use of a higher shutter speed to get a fully sharp image than is needed on the M246; this seems to more-or-less negate the 1 stop noise/banding advantage of the M10M that Reid Reviews indicates.

 

The real difference for me is the surprising and not expected MP boost to 40MP. Obviously for landscape photographers, working on tripods this is not to be ignored. It might also be a boon for those wanting to crop heavily. However, for me as a primarily reportage style photographer, the resolution of the M246 is already an abundance. I might change my mind at some time in the future if my needs change, but to me at the moment the M246 is just superb! 

 

So for those who want to shoot in digital B&W and who like rangefinders, and who do not want to spend over $8,000, you really do not have to, consider the older model, it is just so good. Those who have it already, think a moment before you sell your spare kidney.

 

bear in mind that many people will recommend that you upgrade, because we humans just like new, better toys.

That's a good summary.  I had the MM1, sold it when the sensor went and eventually bought the M246.  When the M10 was released I compared the viewfinders and, for me, the M10 was far better.  I wear glasses for reading only and use a diopter when taking photographs.  I eventually traded the M246 for M10 and have been happily making B&W copies, often using Silver FX Pro, ever since.

However, I am on the list for the M10 Mono and will use this alongside my M10.  Same form factor, same battery, it all helps.  Having said that, if I owned the SL2 and M246, I wouldn't spend more money on M10 Mono.  I'm sure you an get really good B&W conversions from the SL2.

[a.noctilux]

Kamyar,

if you ask, it's too late.

Just buy the M10 Monochrom.

Nothing can justify not to buy it.

[shirubadanieru]

7 hours ago, a.noctilux said:

Kamyar,

if you ask, it's too late.

Just buy the M10 Monochrom.

Nothing can justify not to buy it.

the harsh reality of all Leica camera owners right there ahah 
once it's in your head, you can't stop it and you'll eventually buy it 🤣

[a.noctilux]

8 hours ago, shirubadanieru said:

the harsh reality of all Leica camera owners right there ahah 
once it's in your head, you can't stop it and you'll eventually buy it 🤣

Leica (or Patek Philippe, Ferrari, ...and much, much more ) knows this 😘

[jaapv]

16 hours ago, a.noctilux said:

Nothing can justify not to buy it.

Empty wallet, hungry kids at home?

[a.noctilux]

8 minutes ago, jaapv said:

Empty wallet, hungry kids at home?

Jaapv, I think that these are not one of Kamyar's situation.

[benqui]

I think the best solution is to rent one for a weekend and to test it against your Mono 246. And it will be like always: your brain will say there is no need for an upgrade, your heart will say I neeeeed it.

khoda hafez

Marc

[AceVentura1986]

19 hours ago, wolfloid said:

I posted this on Fred Miranda.com https://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1631448/3

I'm sure that this is a beautiful camera, and that many will lust after it. However, I thought long and hard about buying the M246 or waiting for the future M10M, and in the end decided that I would prefer the M246. Here is my rationale:

6. It seems the early reviewers are confirming my suspicion 40MP files require the use of a higher shutter speed to get a fully sharp image than is needed on the M246; this seems to more-or-less negate the 1 stop noise/banding advantage of the M10M that Reid Reviews indicates.

 

The real difference for me is the surprising and not expected MP boost to 40MP. Obviously for landscape photographers, working on tripods this is not to be ignored. It might also be a boon for those wanting to crop heavily. However, for me as a primarily reportage style photographer, the resolution of the M246 is already an abundance. I might change my mind at some time in the future if my needs change, but to me at the moment the M246 is just superb! 

 

I’ve been saying this since I first read about the 40mpx sensor. Camera shake becomes more  ore noticeable with every increase above 24 mpx. For the typical, traditional Leica street shooter, it’s not only overkill, it’s actually counterproductive. 

Now, for landscape photographers, this might be the holy grail, better than anything else on the market. Different horses for different courses. 

[shirubadanieru]

Not sure on this though because those same reviewers also mentioned that they couldn’t do f/1 on a 24mp but I never had issues shooting a 35mm lens at 1/30 on the M10...other reviewers/users say this is not a problem at all and there are even shots in the image thread that are shot with slow shutter speeds and they seem sharp enough...so let’s see if f/1 is not really possible on the M10M (I’ll get the camera next week so will find out then). I mainly shoot street, so obviously if I can’t shoot the camera at lower shutter speeds (at least f/2) then it makes little sense. But like I said I’ll have to try it myself since I do see a lot of people saying this is not an issue.

[mmradman]

Majority of publicly available M10M pictures including native files i saw suffer from sharpness issues, could be something to do with low light, low shutter speed high MP.

Using M246 (24Mp) i tend to shoot at least 1/250sec or faster and am getting pretty sharp images.  Incidentally, shooting Nikon Z7 which is 46Mp and having IBIS seems to make all the differenfe between sharp and blurry.

[dkmoore]

2 minutes ago, mmradman said:

Majority of publicly available M10M pictures including native files i saw suffer from sharpness issues, could be something to do with low light, low shutter speed high MP.

Using M246 (24Mp) i tend to shoot at least 1/250sec or faster and am getting pretty sharp images.  Incidentally, shooting Nikon Z7 which is 46Mp and having IBIS seems to make all the differenfe between sharp and blurry.

IBIS in the M10M would have been a revelation and made the camera perfect. I was very much hoping. 
 

I have not noticed any difference in what shutter speeds are needed between any of the Monochrom variants. I think the notion that one has to use a higher shutter speed on the M10M is wrong and over propagandized. 
 

my technique sucks and I’m getting the same results at 1/60 as I did with MM1 and M246.  This is mostly as low as I go because my technique is garbage. 

I think Brent posted a few images at slow shutter speeds that furthers my point. I think somehow this high MP/shutter speed drama has morphed into an enigma. 
 

 

[Advertisement]

Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[mmradman]

Apart from few Neuro Surgeons and Dentists majority, myself included, have shaky hands.  High shutter speed and/or IBIS is a god send.