Should I buy a copy of the Summicron-S 100mm?

[ZHNL]

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No need for speculation. Just put on tripod and print a big target and focus. 

[setuporg]

So far I have mixed results.  Faces from a distance might be soft on AF, since the circle is rather large and it looks like sharper edges are chosen in front or behind them.  Manual focus in OVF seems a bit iffy but simply because it’s hard to do.  Live View MF shows very sharp target.  I wish the AF was as good as SL2 with the same lens or X1D.

[Jan1985]

I now have also a copy of the 100mm summicron... I really think if I should buy it? Because I already have the 70mm and the 120mm

[setuporg]

On 2/1/2020 at 2:03 PM, Jan1985 said:

I now have also a copy of the 100mm summicron... I really think if I should buy it? Because I already have the 70mm and the 120mm

Yes!  I went to town to shoot mine and it turned out quite fine.  Exceptional lens.  Also small.  Fits the SL2 as well as the S.

[Milan_S]

I am thinking of purchasing the Summicron-S 100mm f2 again but I am afraid that the focus hunting and back front focusing will cause me trouble and frustration. The 70mm is very reliable in this way and although a stop slower it focuses always correct and fast even with low light. Can anybody report about the focusing in lower light @geetee1972 @setuporg @ZHNL ?

Thank you guys!

[albireo_double]

The 100/f2 will always hunt on the S007, especially in lower contrast scenes. Mine does and it causes me frustration. Leica acknowledged the issue in an email to me four years ago, saying they were going to address this through firmware. So far, this has not materialised. But the lens is usable, of course, it's just that the hit rate is not as high as the 70 or 180, for instance. It is my "go to" lens usually, when I start a model shoot, because of the ideal focal length and the great rendering. But then I tend to switch to another lens, because of the hunting. So, for anyone who has a 70 and 120, I'd suggest to resist the temptation, especially because the 120 is a very competent portrait lens too, as well as a macro lens. OK, for the dedicated portrait / wedding photographer, the 100 might make sense, but it is a hard tool to master. And for those thinking that it might redeem itself on the SL/SL2 via adapter - no, it won't...it will hunt there too, almost comically. Now, if someone here is not deterred yet, you can PM me and I may let you persuade me to sell my immaculate copy of the 100 to you. 

Edited February 4, 2020 by albireo_double

[Milan_S]

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@albireo_double just ordered one, but do you think the 120mm hunts less in lower light? I remember because of the focus hunting in lower light the focus was also often off for me with the 100mm f2, the 70mm on the contrary is very reliable even in low light...

[geetee1972]

2 hours ago, Milan_S said:

I am thinking of purchasing the Summicron-S 100mm f2 again but I am afraid that the focus hunting and back front focusing will cause me trouble and frustration. The 70mm is very reliable in this way and although a stop slower it focuses always correct and fast even with low light. Can anybody report about the focusing in lower light @geetee1972 @setuporg @ZHNL ?

Thank you guys!

It's quite ironic that you should now be asking me whether you should buy a copy of this lens on the thread I started to ask whether I shoudl buy this lens 😁

I've not had it long but it is terribly beguiling and I am very happy I bought a copy. I have seen some instances where the focus was slightly off but nothing that would stop me using the images and actually in some instances the slight off focus is better; it's more pleasing and analogue like. I don't shoot in anything other than natural light so have no problems wth trying to focus in the low light conditions that a modeling light would entail.

[ZHNL]

3 hours ago, Milan_S said:

I am thinking of purchasing the Summicron-S 100mm f2 again but I am afraid that the focus hunting and back front focusing will cause me trouble and frustration. The 70mm is very reliable in this way and although a stop slower it focuses always correct and fast even with low light. Can anybody report about the focusing in lower light @geetee1972 @setuporg @ZHNL ?

Thank you guys!

You know my position already on this now. Even if you buy it, you better have a good return policy. 

mine is finally working now at least under controlled test. (Well defined target over different distance) 

My friends who sent his combo to Leica just told me that Leica send him back both lens and camera again without fixing the issue. 

my past experience is it is always front focus over different body’s combo. His is the same. And also I remember I see one example here show that same behavior. (S007 and 100cron)

I don’t know others, but I think it is easy enough to have other checks.  if it can’t pass controlled test, how Can you expect it works for real shooting.

120 seems fine. All S glasses can give wrong focus given its SLR nature, poorer AF tech and big focus point, however the only one consistent fail is 100cron.
 

At least most of them, Mine is finally works so I do believe there should be some perform Normal out there. Yours maybe as well if you are lucky.

Having said that, I use manual focus most of time. It doesn’t really bother me much even before.

 

 

[albireo_double]

9 hours ago, Milan_S said:

@albireo_double just ordered one, but do you think the 120mm hunts less in lower light? I remember because of the focus hunting in lower light the focus was also often off for me with the 100mm f2, the 70mm on the contrary is very reliable even in low light...

Yes, I'd say the 120 hunts less but, of course, it is not the fastest lens to focus either, because of the long focusing "throw" typical of macro lenses. But it does less "to and fro". The 120 has the most amazing bokeh and is super sharp at any focused distance. So sharp that maybe the dedicated portrait photographer might prefer the 100 which render differently.

Btw, my 100 focuses accurately - no issues with front or back focus. It just takes more iterations than the other lenses before it settles.

[Milan_S]

1 hour ago, albireo_double said:

Yes, I'd say the 120 hunts less but, of course, it is not the fastest lens to focus either, because of the long focusing "throw" typical of macro lenses. But it does less "to and fro". The 120 has the most amazing bokeh and is super sharp at any focused distance. So sharp that maybe the dedicated portrait photographer might prefer the 100 which render differently.

Btw, my 100 focuses accurately - no issues with front or back focus. It just takes more iterations than the other lenses before it settles.

Does your 100mm focuses also with low light and focusses accurately in lower light situations?? 

[albireo_double]

Well yes, it focuses (eventually) in low light, and accurately so, but it has to catch onto something contrasty no matter what the light. But shooting a lens like this wide open, at a distance of say 1-1.5 m on AFS (with no reliable tracking or focus/recompose automation) is a game of hit and miss. Minute movements of model or photographer result in unfocused images. Best to shoot more images / bracket focus, if you want the eyelashes sharp. And, with the size of the focusing spot, the camera may focus on eyelashes or the eyes themselves - wherever it finds contrast. So again, you need some patience and method. Talking about the latter, I think I have already mentioned on this forum (if so, forgive me for repeating myself) an RGG Edu video where Sandro Miller focuses his Hasselblad H4 on portraits in dark houses somewhere in PNG, with the aid of his assistant who momentarily shines a torchlight at the subject's face to help the camera focus properly. I have focused an RZ67 in the studio like this, with a 110mm lens, and obtained super sharp results on a 80MP digital back. The moral of the story is that sometimes you have to help yourself, or the camera/lens, and not frustrate yourself about their inability to focus quickly in low light (as my grandma used to say: "If the mountain does not come to Mohammed, then Mohammed has to come to the mountain"). 

[Viv]

Don't buy a copy. An original would be much better.

[setuporg]

This is all very interesting as my S100 doesn't hunt much at all, just front-focuses sometimes but does a good job other times.  The problem is the depth of field is paper-thin at 2.0.  Manual focusing with Live View shows that a tiny turn brings it OOF.  And if the target is a human who moves their head even a little bit, while talking, it's very hard to catch focus on the eyes.  Basically it calls for the M Daguerre's original restraint, the metal headband that kept his models still.

[geetee1972]

5 hours ago, Viv said:

Don't buy a copy. An original would be much better.

I'm sure you've cracked that joke before. 😂

[Jan1985]

My first shooting today with the 100mm.

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[Milan_S]

36 minutes ago, Jan1985 said:

My first shooting today with the 100mm.

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nice photo, so what are your first thought about this lens? How is your "copy" focusing and performance in lower light?

[Jan1985]

vor 4 Minuten schrieb Milan_S:

nice photo, so what are your first thought about this lens? How is your "copy" focusing and performance in lower light?

Thank you. I guess it suits my needs. My most favorite lens is the Leica Noctilux 0.95 which I mostly use and love. The 100mm seems to be a lens with such a unique signature in rendering. Focusing is not as difficult as I thought. Maybe I am in good practice with the Noctilux. I notice the advantage in low light as I am making a lot of low light black and white portraiture. I will see in the next shootings.

[Milan_S]

15 hours ago, Jan1985 said:

Thank you. I guess it suits my needs. My most favorite lens is the Leica Noctilux 0.95 which I mostly use and love. The 100mm seems to be a lens with such a unique signature in rendering. Focusing is not as difficult as I thought. Maybe I am in good practice with the Noctilux. I notice the advantage in low light as I am making a lot of low light black and white portraiture. I will see in the next shootings.

I love the Noctilux 50mm a lot have two of them the earliest one and the lastest and use both of them although not so much as the 50 APO, but I also love the rendering of the Noctilux and you are right the Summicron S 100mm has a gorgeous rendering. I am curious what your findings are about focusing the Summicron 100mm in low light

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[Jan1985]

vor 23 Minuten schrieb Milan_S:

I love the Noctilux 50mm a lot have two of them the earliest one and the lastest and use both of them although not so much as the 50 APO, but I also love the rendering of the Noctilux and you are right the Summicron S 100mm has a gorgeous rendering. I am curious what your findings are about focusing the Summicron 100mm in low light

What you own both Noctilux? Great. I additionally have the 50 APO. Yes that it. this Lens just make sense when you shoot wide Open. I will tell what i notice during shooting.