SL2 issue with exposure simulation in Manual mode

[NRKstudio]

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Disclaimer: I am very new to the SLx firmware, so it may be user error here, but thanks in advance if you can solve this issue.  
 

Does anyone have an idea how to turn on permanent exposure simulation when the camera is in Manual mode ( set aperture, set shutter speed, auto iso)?  The SL2 will not preview the exposure even when the shutter is half way pressed.  I think it’s the autoISO that is disabling the exp preview in Manual mode.  When you use exposure compensation in Manual mode, it doesn’t change the look of the preview on the lcd at all, the exposure doesn’t seem to change until you take a picture and then see the screen as all black or washed out.  

I had the same problem with the Q2, I posted there a few months ago without a solid answer to the issue.  

Even when the exposure simulation is set to PASM, the exposure (f stop, shutter speed and iso) is not simulated when looking at the rear LCD or through the view finder.  

On the M10-p, this is not the same deficiency of exposure preview at all.  On the M, With the shutter set, the aperture set (manual lens of course), and the iso on Auto, you can change the Ev compensation and watch the preview react by brightening or darkening without having to half press the shutter.  The live view reflects the shot you are actually taking, unlike the SL2 which does not display how bright or dark the shot is going to come out.  

[NRKstudio]

Anyone know what the deal is with this?

[digitalfx]

it doesn't seem to work

[NRKstudio]

Does anyone have any idea if it’s the settings or what?  Forum gurus plz impart advice. 

[NRKstudio]

 

@jonoslack I hate to bother you again, but seeing as you are the resident Leica expert, please see the post above for my question regarding the exposure simulation settings.  I have yet to find an answer to this on this forum and elsewhere.  Thank you! @sean_reid (if this is in fact your username) your help is always appreciated ! 

[NRKstudio]

2 minutes ago, NRKstudio said:

 

@jonoslack I hate to bother you again, but seeing as you are the resident Leica expert, please see the post above for my question regarding the exposure simulation settings.  I have yet to find an answer to this on this forum and elsewhere.  Thank you! @sean_reid (if this is in fact your username) your help is always appreciated ! 

Looks like Sean hasn’t logged-in since 2015, so it’s up to you Jono!  

[Jeff S]

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6 minutes ago, NRKstudio said:

Looks like Sean hasn’t logged-in since 2015, so it’s up to you Jono!  

Well, you could subscribe to Sean's site and then email him your question.  We haven't seen him here in years, as you found.

https://www.reidreviews.com

Jeff

 

[NRKstudio]

1 hour ago, Jeff S said:

Well, you could subscribe to Sean's site and then email him your question.  We haven't seen him here in years, as you found.

https://www.reidreviews.com

Jeff

 

I subscribed to Sean's site when I purchased my first camera, an M-P 240.  Even though that was only about a year and a half ago, I've enjoyed the reading/viewing thoroughly.  He also has been accommodating enough to answer a few beginner questions as well.  Great site, author, and photographer.

[thighslapper]

6 hours ago, NRKstudio said:

 

@jonoslack I hate to bother you again, but seeing as you are the resident Leica expert, please see the post above for my question regarding the exposure simulation settings.  I have yet to find an answer to this on this forum and elsewhere.  Thank you! @sean_reid (if this is in fact your username) your help is always appreciated ! 

It sounds like a firmware bug that Leica have not noticed. I suggest emailing them with your observations.

The fact it works as expected on the M10 is the giveaway. 

Although it is many years ago I recall something along the same lines with the original M240 that was later fixed with a firmware update.  

[profus]

On 11/24/2019 at 3:50 AM, NRKstudio said:

Disclaimer: I am very new to the SLx firmware, so it may be user error here, but thanks in advance if you can solve this issue.  
 

Does anyone have an idea how to turn on permanent exposure simulation when the camera is in Manual mode ( set aperture, set shutter speed, auto iso)?  The SL2 will not preview the exposure even when the shutter is half way pressed.  I think it’s the autoISO that is disabling the exp preview in Manual mode.  When you use exposure compensation in Manual mode, it doesn’t change the look of the preview on the lcd at all, the exposure doesn’t seem to change until you take a picture and then see the screen as all black or washed out. 

It works like this on SL, I often use manual mode, Auto ISO and exposure compensation.

I have tested SL2 in Leica Store the other day and I am almost sure that I did configured the camera this way, too. I do not recall experiencing anything unusual, it just worked as I expected...But then of course, I could remember it wrong, maybe I didn't use camera like that after all...
Anyone that can make a quick test?

This is how I normally use my SL and if that doesn't work it would be a huge set back for me...
 

[anickpick]

I just checked: When I set Aperture, Shutter speed, and ISO manually, the EVF provides instant exposure preview.

Same settings but with Auto ISO, see Artin's post.

All good....

 

[profus]

51 minutes ago, Artin said:

I just tested with my SL2 ... here is what I found .. when in M exposure mode with Auto ISO.  As you change your exposure the camera will keep on adjusting the ISO. Therefore the exposure preview stays in (( in its natural position)) until you run out of ISO range , then it starts to dim or wash out.  Because the Auto ISO is not letting you to overexposed or under expose . 

If you had your auto ISO set to say maximum 400 you will see this 

"Change your exposure..." Just to be sure - how did you do that? You used "exposure compensation" feature in this scenario ( Auto ISO, M )?

Not only altered aperture and/or shutter speed? ( by doing this you get the behavior you described - also on SL - and that is fully expectable, too)

[profus]

4 minutes ago, anickpick said:

I just checked: When I set Aperture, Shutter speed, and ISO manually, the EVF provides instant exposure preview.

Same settings but with Auto ISO, see Artin's post.

All good....

 

I wouldn't say "all good". It is not working like this on SL nor M.
In AUTO ISO and M -mode you alter ISO value when using exposure compensation (aperture and SS stay unchanged ) and exposure preview is altered according to that.

You say SL2 doesn't behave like that?

[NRKstudio]

10 hours ago, NRKstudio said:

 

@jonoslack I hate to bother you again, but seeing as you are the resident Leica expert, please see the post above for my question regarding the exposure simulation settings.  I have yet to find an answer to this on this forum and elsewhere.  Thank you! @sean_reid (if this is in fact your username) your help is always appreciated ! 

Luckily today is a short work day.  Will identify the cause and exact settings.  I started a Q2 thread on this point a few months back with many others agreeing and also PM’ing me that they could find no fix.  
i think when you “run out of iso” (mentioned by someone above) the camera no longer displays permanent exposure simulation, it converts to only displaying exposure simulation when the shutter is half pressed, and/or not at all.  This may be a Leica firmware behavior that is known and intended unfortunately.  We will see later today with testing. 

[anickpick]

vor 26 Minuten schrieb profus:

I wouldn't say "all good". It is not working like this on SL nor M.
In AUTO ISO and M -mode you alter ISO value when using exposure compensation (aperture and SS stay unchanged ) and exposure preview is altered according to that.

You say SL2 doesn't behave like that?

The SL2 provides instant exposure preview - also in M mode with Auto Iso and exposure compensation (positive or negative). 

All good.

[anickpick]

vor 7 Minuten schrieb NRKstudio:

Luckily today is a short work day.  Will identify the cause and exact settings.  I started a Q2 thread on this point a few months back with many others agreeing and also PM’ing me that they could find no fix.  
i think when you “run out of iso” (mentioned by someone above) the camera no longer displays permanent exposure simulation, it converts to only displaying exposure simulation when the shutter is half pressed, and/or not at all.  This may be a Leica firmware behavior that is known and intended unfortunately.  We will see later today with testing. 

When "running out of iso" my SL2 provides exposure simulation when half pressing the shutter button.

[anickpick]

vor 3 Minuten schrieb Artin:

I really do not understand where you coming from .... when in Auto ISO  you do not have the ability to use exposure compensation in the same manner 

the Camera is trying to keep the exposure to what it deems to be accurate ..... in the M what you are basically setting the camera to over expose or under expose all your Images for as long as you see fit  .... But as you adjust your exposure , by the shutter or aperture .... as long as you are in Auto ISO the camera is going to adjust the ISO to keep the same amount of light sensitivity.. Therefore your EVF or your Screen will not shift. exposure compensation is telling your camera to push or pull your exposure globally ,, its not for over exposing or under exposing on each individual image .. therefore it is pointless to use AUTO ISO in manual mode 

 

Same here Artin, I actually never use Auto ISO in manual mode.

However, the SL2 offers this option.

And it works just fine.

[profus]

14 minutes ago, Artin said:

I really do not understand where you coming from .... when in Auto ISO  you do not have the ability to use exposure compensation in the same manner 

the Camera is trying to keep the exposure to what it deems to be accurate ..... in the M what you are basically setting the camera to over expose or under expose all your Images for as long as you see fit  .... But as you adjust your exposure , by the shutter or aperture .... as long as you are in Auto ISO the camera is going to adjust the ISO to keep the same amount of light sensitivity.. Therefore your EVF or your Screen will not shift. exposure compensation is telling your camera to push or pull your exposure globally ,, its not for over exposing or under exposing on each individual image .. therefore it is pointless to use AUTO ISO in manual mode 

Well, that is your opinion. It makes perfect sense to me to use AUTO ISO in M mode and then - if needed - alter ISO ( keeping the preferred values for A and S ) by using exposure compensation...

[lct]

I have no experience with the SL2 but in auto iso + M mode, exposure compensation alters iso values on all my digicams so far. Wouldn't be auto iso otherwise i guess but i may be wrong.

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[profus]

9 minutes ago, Artin said:

I Know it works fine but how is that manual exposure ??? when you still have a Auto setting that effects exposure selected by the CPU.

The way I see it is like this ... This is a Professional Camera at the Apex of the full frame Format. they have provided us with everything you need to create incredible images 

at price ticket of entry into this system it certainly is not for point and shoot therefore the thinking is right. If in manual mode??  then make every choice. do not rely on the CPU 

Leica has it right 

Simple. It is manual. I always decide aperture and shutter speed. Camera only calculates ISO ( AUTO ISO ). Then if i would like my image to be a bit darker/lighter I use exposure compensation that slightly alter ISO ( keeping A and SS unchanged ). Very convenient - you should try it.