Thoughts on the Leica SL2 compared to the S1/S1R

[Chaemono]

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vor 5 Minuten schrieb jonoslack:

Hi There 

I don't have the 75 Noctilux, but that's unfortunate - is it worse than it was with the SL? - I think it was quite noticeable there as well, but it's a while since I had the 75 Noctilux. 

best

Could be about the same.  I don’t have an SL anymore to check. I prefer to use it on the M10 and it’s, therefore, not a big deal for me.  It’s super clean there.  I’m still waiting for a second unique picture with it in order to bring down the average cost. 😁

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[jonoslack]

32 minutes ago, Chaemono said:

Could be about the same.  I don’t have an SL anymore to check. I prefer to use it on the M10 and it’s, therefore, not a big deal for me.  It’s super clean there.  I’m still waiting for a second unique picture with it in order to bring down the average cost. 😁

Hi There

That figures - generally I reckon that the SL and SL2 are about the same with M lenses - from an IQ point of view, but the SL2 has advantages with the screen zoom and with the IBIS.

If you only have one unique picture - half a dozen or so would make the price seem much better! Like you I generally prefer to use M lenses on the M10

 

[sillbeers15]

1 hour ago, Chaemono said:

Could be about the same.  I don’t have an SL anymore to check. I prefer to use it on the M10 and it’s, therefore, not a big deal for me.  It’s super clean there.  I’m still waiting for a second unique picture with it in order to bring down the average cost. 😁

My M50/0.95 showed lots of purple fringing on OOF area on my SL. Yet to try it out on my SL2.

[johnbuckley]

I used the 75 Noctilux extensively with the SL2 over the weekend, all shots wide open. I've found literally no purple fringing or green fringing. It's a wonderful combination.

[Archiver]

On 11/24/2019 at 6:14 AM, jonoslack said:

Ah! another Father Ted devotee.

Down with these sort of videos! 😀

[sillbeers15]

My eyes could not tell the difference if not for reading this tread. Upon magnification, the SL2 EVF reveals much needed details say to confirm focus accuracy which the SL critically lack. I was pleasantly surprised by this improvement in the SL2’s EVF.

[caissa]

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Is it good that the S1/R is there ? Yes, if you need flash, if you need tethering, if you need high res mode.   Hopefully in the next few months Leica will address this.

For the SL2 this seems to be the current status:  The highres mode (Multishot) is announced for the next firmware release. Flash, I have no idea what Leicas plans are ...  I would really like to see a paper from Leica to describe the current options.  Tethering, seems still work in progress ... Did anybody seriously try it and involve Leica support in case it should not work ? Or can anybody seriously confirm that it is now working ? Again a paper would be welcome. And a hotline aware of the problem and capable of support.

Anybody involved in interviews with Leica, could you put this on the agenda. And see if there is finally a commitment from management to solve the problems ? (Are they not aware, or not interested ?)

 

Edited November 27, 2019 by caissa

[caissa]

In the meantime Ingo has confirmed that he used tethering with a preprod SL2 in September/October without any problems.  (in another thread)   Still no description ...

[scott kirkpatrick]

Putting up an S1R image for future comparison (in a week+ when I have my SL2). How to compare the ultimate resolution of the two systems?  Well, start with the best lens we know of., the 35 SL-SC. So here's a shot of lots of houses in a traditional neighborhood of Jerusalem, taken from a place that i can return to, in typical winter morning light.  First the whole frame and then a 100% crop that should show up at full size:

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

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P1022719 copy by scott kirkpatrick, on Flickr

P1022719 copy2 by scott kirkpatrick, on Flickr

Edited November 30, 2019 by scott kirkpatrick

[thighslapper]

Having used both SL2 and S1R concurrently all of today I have to confess I am rather ambivalent and not overly impressed with the SL2. 

It's a 'jack of all trades', but master of none ..... there are a few areas where it is noticeably better than the S1R, but plenty where it is lacking, particularly for landscape use. 

I'll run some more comparisons tomorrow before commenting more specifically ..... in the fairly certain knowledge that plenty will disagree with me .... 

Edited November 30, 2019 by thighslapper

[Chaemono]

Not a surprising first impression by thighslapper because for landscape photography, there is not much any FF can bring to the table that bests the S1R in functionality and IQ.  I agree with his findings that once one has gotten used to the workflow with the S1R for landscape work, the SL2 seems a bit lacking.  

I was shooting the SL2 at a street market this morning and I must say, that the minimalist design of the camera and the SL Summicrons make the SL2 really inconspicuous and allow one to blend in.  I took many pictures today, some of which I have posted in the image thread (see three here: https://chaemono.smugmug.com/SL2-light-and-color/, and I felt totally at ease to walk in a crowd of early morning shoppers with the SL2 in my hand and to try to catch some action.  I also must say, that I would not feel comfortable at all to take the S1/R to a busy street market in order to take pictures.  BTW, the Leica logo is taped on my SL2 which makes the camera even more camouflaged (😁).  As a walk-around camera, the SL2 with its minimalist Bauhaus design, the Panasonic AF system, and Leica’s implementation of that 47 MPx sensor in combination with the Maestro 3 processor is an absolute dream.  My other favored camera for this is, of course, the M10.  The SL2 has the advantage, though, of being blazingly fast to operate, i.e. to focus accurately (love the Pre-Focus function) and to shoot.  It almost felt like a better M today. 

 

Edited November 30, 2019 by Chaemono

[thighslapper]

2 hours ago, Chaemono said:

I was shooting the SL2 at a street market this morning and I must say, that the minimalist design of the camera and the SL Summicrons make the SL2 really inconspicuous and allow one to blend in.    It almost felt like a better M today. 

That was my thought as well ..... it behaves more like a larger M with AF..... with the same rather condensed function set and pared down controls. I'll be in London most of tomorrow and will give it a good run out with the either the 50/2 or 75/2 and am sure it will be a delight to use. Despite any misgivings as a landscape camera, it is a highly desirable object and a pleasure to use, so it's not going to be a choice of which to keep, but rather which to use and for what. 

[FlashGordonPhotography]

3 hours ago, thighslapper said:

Having used both SL2 and S1R concurrently all of today I have to confess I am rather ambivalent and not overly impressed with the SL2. 

It's a 'jack of all trades', but master of none ..... there are a few areas where it is noticeably better than the S1R, but plenty where it is lacking, particularly for landscape use. 

I'll run some more comparisons tomorrow before commenting more specifically ..... in the fairly certain knowledge that plenty will disagree with me .... 

Well, you do have  the better long exposure implementation on the SL2. But other than that I agree with you. The atriculated screen is brilliant on the S1R.

And dare I say it, the button layout is better on the S1R. I'm finding the SL2 buttons too small and fiddly and generally difficult to reach. On the S1R (for MY hands) the major buttons are exactly in the right spot. You can even remap a button on the right side of the camera to be a play button (where it should be on any EVF camera. I think they messed up and should have kept the original button layout from the SL.

This is somewhat made up with the SL2's brilliant quick menu. I'm loving it although I do wish it were properly customisable. It also feels beautifully put together.

I also think the S1R, while heavier, feels better in the hand than the SL2. Especially with the SL zooms.

The SL2 is certainly a more discrete camera. What'll probably happen is when I need to sling a camera over my shoulder I'll bring the SL2. For on and off a tripod and for landscapes, the S1R. For travel I'll probably take one of each, even though I have two S1R's.

Both cameras need an MRAW setting.

Gordon

 

[thighslapper]

1 hour ago, FlashGordonPhotography said:

The SL2 is certainly a more discrete camera. What'll probably happen is when I need to sling a camera over my shoulder I'll bring the SL2. For on and off a tripod and for landscapes, the S1R. For travel I'll probably take one of each, even though I have two S1R's.

My thoughts exactly. For landscape I'll take the SL2 as a second body (instead of my CL) permanently fixed to either the 16-35 or more likely the Lumix 70-200. The difference will only be a few hundred grams. I'm afraid I've become addicted to changing aspect ratios and have is set as a default on the Q menu so the options are only a button away..... and I've the function lever set for bracketing, so I just have to flip a switch. Everything is just so easy and accessible and I hardly ever have to access the menus. The SL2 seems like hard work in comparison ... at least until I've found some workarounds. Quite why they used up the long press option to change the function settings beats me ..... I'd have been happy to set it all and forget from the main menu and retain the option ..... at least on some buttons like the front two .....  with dual functions. The customisable choices are also rather limited and could have been expanded without making the interface more complex.  The 500 page S1R manual is rather daunting ...... but once you have sorted out the features you want and how to use them you realise just how much careful thought Panasonic have put into the camera. Leica seem to have put most of their thought in what to leave out..... which is fine ..... up to a point.....

[SrMi]

2 hours ago, FlashGordonPhotography said:

Well, you do have  the better long exposure implementation on the SL2. But other than that I agree with you. The atriculated screen is brilliant on the S1R.

And dare I say it, the button layout is better on the S1R. I'm finding the SL2 buttons too small and fiddly and generally difficult to reach. On the S1R (for MY hands) the major buttons are exactly in the right spot. You can even remap a button on the right side of the camera to be a play button (where it should be on any EVF camera. I think they messed up and should have kept the original button layout from the SL.

This is somewhat made up with the SL2's brilliant quick menu. I'm loving it although I do wish it were properly customisable. It also feels beautifully put together.

I also think the S1R, while heavier, feels better in the hand than the SL2. Especially with the SL zooms.

The SL2 is certainly a more discrete camera. What'll probably happen is when I need to sling a camera over my shoulder I'll bring the SL2. For on and off a tripod and for landscapes, the S1R. For travel I'll probably take one of each, even though I have two S1R's.

Both cameras need an MRAW setting.

Gordon

 

Why does SL2 have better long exposure implementation than S1R?

I noticed that S1R has EFC shutter type, while SL2 does not. Most mirrorless camera with focal plane shutters require EFC at certain stutter speeds in order to prevent blur caused by mechanical shutter. Is that a non-issue on S1R and SL2?

Edited December 1, 2019 by SrMi

[Tailwagger]

2 hours ago, FlashGordonPhotography said:

I'm finding the SL2 buttons too small and fiddly and generally difficult to reach.

They are small. This morning out in sub freezing weather with only M primes, and having not yet reconfigured any buttons, I found the front dual button setup to be less than ideal for invoking zoom. Not totally unexpected. I think the biggest problem in general is that the right fore finger has too much to do and too many subtlety awkward places to go to do it. The top dial feels great physically, but a more convention wheel on the grip below the shutter button would have been more natural and freed up space for two more buttons on top, as opposed the dual ones on front.

[Guest]

5 hours ago, Chaemono said:

Not a surprising first impression by thighslapper because for landscape photography, there is not much any FF can bring to the table that bests the S1R in functionality and IQ.  I agree with his findings that once one has gotten used to the workflow with the S1R for landscape work, the SL2 seems a bit lacking.  

I was shooting the SL2 at a street market this morning and I must say, that the minimalist design of the camera and the SL Summicrons make the SL2 really inconspicuous and allow one to blend in.  I took many pictures today, some of which I have posted in the image thread (see three here: https://chaemono.smugmug.com/SL2-light-and-color/, and I felt totally at ease to walk in a crowd of early morning shoppers with the SL2 in my hand and to try to catch some action.  I also must say, that I would not feel comfortable at all to take the S1/R to a busy street market in order to take pictures.  BTW, the Leica logo is taped on my SL2 which makes the camera even more camouflaged (😁).  As a walk-around camera, the SL2 with its minimalist Bauhaus design, the Panasonic AF system, and Leica’s implementation of that 47 MPx sensor in combination with the Maestro 3 processor is an absolute dream.  My other favored camera for this is, of course, the M10.  The SL2 has the advantage, though, of being blazingly fast to operate, i.e. to focus accurately (love the Pre-Focus function) and to shoot.  It almost felt like a better M today. 

 

Not disagreeing with anything you say but the downside is the weight I feel. 

Because of this most Leica shooters will still prefer the M, the Q or the CL for this type of work would be my guess...

[Chaemono]

vor 3 Stunden schrieb SlowDriver:

Not disagreeing with anything you say but the downside is the weight I feel. 

Because of this most Leica shooters will still prefer the M, the Q or the CL for this type of work would be my guess...

Yes, definitely.  I hold the camera by the lens in front of my body most of the time and switch hands.  The SL Summicrons are the perfect size for this and it allows me to protect them this way, too.  What is really impressive with the SL2 is the Pre-Focus Mode which makes acquiring pinpoint accurate focus with the cross-hair extremely fast and the speed of continuous shooting in Single Shot Mode (one has to keep the shutter pressed to experience this). 

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Hallo,

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[hotshew]

I was going to sell my S1R after receiving SL2, I've decided to keep it.

1. I can only sell it for about half what I purchased (thanks to Panasonic's steep discounting so shortly following release), and that's a tough one to stomach.

2. The two cameras complement each other well, and trying to decide which is best will have one going in circles.

I love the minimalist design of the SL2, but the SR1 button layout is superb and its usability is what initially attracted me to the S1R. I still need more time with the SL2, but I think the S1R is going to edge it out in terms of overall usability.

Ultimately, which one I  grab is going to come down to use case.

[Alistairm]

@hotshew I am in exactly the same boat. 

I am absolutely loving the SL2, especially with M glass, but the S1R is a fantastic companion to it, and for me a much preferred option when shooting with flash.