Light Meter for the M3

[Topsy]

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29 minutes ago, MikeMyers said:

All done.  Meter is mounted, seems to work fine, 100 ASA B&W film is loaded, and maybe over this weekend I'll see how my images improve from getting the exposure correct.  In the 1970's, this was my main camera.  Then my love of Nikon gear pushed it out of the way.  I've got a good local shop for processing, and a good scanner, and as far as I know, everything I need to go back 50 years or so.  Gee, the viewfinder looks SOOO nice!

I'm not sure what I think about the meter.  I like what I see, it's light, and is fast and easy to use.  The rest is up to me.

Speaking which, this ancient 50mm collapsible Summicron has a focusing tab on the bottom - now that I've learned to take advantage of it, I'm impressed with this lens.  Supposedly this lens would work fine on my M10 if I mount and unmount it with the lens extended, but I've never dared to try.

I guess this meter will be just as useful should I ever want to shoot film with my old Contax cameras, or my Nikon SP...  but I think I'm better off sticking to Leica.

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TBH I think it's butt ugly also looks very complicated, why not just have a handheld meter or go Sunny 16?

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34 minutes ago, MikeMyers said:

Speaking which, this ancient 50mm collapsible Summicron has a focusing tab on the bottom - now that I've learned to take advantage of it, I'm impressed with this lens.  Supposedly this lens would work fine on my M10 if I mount and unmount it with the lens extended, but I've never dared to try.

I guess this meter will be just as useful should I ever want to shoot film with my old Contax cameras, or my Nikon SP...  but I think I'm better off sticking to Leica.

Of course the lens will work on your M10, why wouldn't it?

Your meter will also work with those other cameras, it's just a meter! It reads the light, which doesn't change with the camera!

I prefer taking incident light readings with a hand held meter - it will be useful for that with your M10 as well.

[MikeMyers]

I know the meter will work on any camera, and will work just as well if I keep it in my pocket.

As to the lens, the space inside of an M10 surrounding the lens is much less than on an old M3 film camera and the lenses designed way back when.  There have been too many warnings about this.  I think I understand that as long as I mount and un-mount the Summicron with the lens extended (NOT collapsed), I will be safe.  At some point I plan to send an email to Leica USA, with a photo of my lens and. the serial number, and verify if it is safe to use.  Until then, I don't plan to risk it.  

[250swb]

Personally I keep my Sekonic L-208 in my pocket and not just because it looks so ugly on the accessory shoe. The advantage of a hand held meter is that you can go from a reflective reading to an incident reading almost instantly, even pointing the meter over your shoulder for an incident reading while still looking ahead. No of course you don't lose the ability switch over with the L-208 meter mounted on the camera, but turning around and pointing the camera towards the light source each time is a pain. Also having it on the camera can for many people make it a two handed job, one to hold the camera and one to press the button. Hand held it is a one handed job to make a reading and the meter can be used to scan appropriate reflective readings as you walk towards the action so the exposure is already known in advance. 

As regards retractable lenses on the digital M's there are so many warnings because Leica warn people in the M10 manual, they also list the lenses that aren't compatible with the camera. But the warnings aren't that you can't mount a retractable lens in the closed position, they are to stop the people who can't mount their lenses square to the body and try to mount them sideways and who get it locked on by fumbling alone. This is when the rear of the lens can scratch the black paint inside the body. Sure it's safer to mount it extended, but other than the excluded lenses the warning is about damage the user can do, not the mechanical elements doing damage to themselves in normal use.

Edited August 6, 2021 by 250swb

[Vlad Soare]

Nothing beats an incident meter (except perhaps a spotmeter under very few specific circumstances). 

If you shoot B/W and rely on the film's native latitude and your darkroom skills to get an acceptable print out of a less-than-perfect negative, then sure, you can use whatever meter you wish, or even no meter at all. Even with colour slide film you'll be OK (sort of) if you plan to scan the film and to adjust the images digitally - just err on the side of underexposure and hope for the best. However, if you make actual slides, which you want to use as God intended them to be used, then a good incident meter is the only thing that will ensure perfect results each and every time. Get it wrong by as little as half a stop and your slide will be ruined. No reflected meter, no matter how complex and intelligent and expensive it may be, will get you perfectly exposed slides every time. It may give you good results most of the time, but not every time. Only an incident meter will.

 

Edited August 6, 2021 by Vlad Soare

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4 hours ago, Vlad Soare said:

Nothing beats an incident meter (except perhaps a spotmeter under very few specific circumstances). 

If you shoot B/W and rely on the film's native latitude and your darkroom skills to get an acceptable print out of a less-than-perfect negative, then sure, you can use whatever meter you wish, or even no meter at all. Even with colour slide film you'll be OK (sort of) if you plan to scan the film and to adjust the images digitally - just err on the side of underexposure and hope for the best. However, if you make actual slides, which you want to use as God intended them to be used, then a good incident meter is the only thing that will ensure perfect results each and every time. Get it wrong by as little as half a stop and your slide will be ruined. No reflected meter, no matter how complex and intelligent and expensive it may be, will get you perfectly exposed slides every time. It may give you good results most of the time, but not every time. Only an incident meter will.

 

Not that I disagree, incident meters are excellent.  But, Nikon Matrix metering, since the F5/F100 era, have done an excellent job metering for E6.

[MikeMyers]

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6 hours ago, 250swb said:

Personally I keep my Sekonic L-208 in my pocket and not just because it looks so ugly on the accessory shoe............Sure it's safer to mount it extended, but other than the excluded lenses the warning is about damage the user can do, not the mechanical elements doing damage to themselves in normal use.

Funny how we all have different ways of thinking about things.  The Sekonic came with a case and a neck strap.  My pockets are already filled with "stuff", and I don't know where I would put the meter, but it would certainly be in the case.  I had my large Sekonic with me when I shot with the M3 last time, but it wasn't convenient to keep taking it out of my pocket, and out of the case, every time I wanted to check exposure.  On top of the camera, it's simple.  I agree with what you wrote about shooting in incident light, but it's easier and faster for me to slide it out of the accessory shoe, take a reading, and replace it, than what I used to do.  I guess I have to agree with you that it looks "ugly" on top of the camera.  It's nice to think I'll learn to evaluate the light like I did in the 1950's, but considering how infrequently I use the M3, who knows....    And I do love the classic lines of the M3, and the only meter that looks good to me sitting on top of it is the Leicameter.  I wish I could buy a modern Leicameter that looked and worked the same, but with updated components.  I must agree with you more than a little - if the Visoflex looked better sitting on my M10, I'd leave it there forever, if for no other reason than to have the GPS.

 

About the collapsible Summicron.  I wish Leica (or @jaapv) were to say that the collapsible Summicron, extended, is no more or less dangerous than other 50mm Summicron lenses, and that the important thing is to have the lens "square" with the body when mounting.  The collapsible lens has always been very convenient for traveling.  Most of the time it makes little difference, now that I've bought my small Billingham bag.  Previously, I preferred to have the camera inside of my jacket or coat, like how I carry my X100f Fuji.

 

I'm still debating whether to stick with the Sekonic, or search for the latest version of the Leica Meter MR4.  

[MikeMyers]

On 8/5/2021 at 5:41 PM, Topsy said:

TBH I think it's butt ugly also looks very complicated, why not just have a handheld meter or go Sunny 16?

Unfortunately, I agree with you.  I'm only shooting B&W, and a found a working Leicameter MR at KEH for reasonable price.  It's now on order.  I expect to send the Sekonic back to B&H, but I may hang onto it for use in India, if I'm ever able to return.

Anybody else notice how expensive this forum can be?  So many good ideas.......

Thank you.

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[Mute-on]

I’ve always found having a good incident light meter very useful, even with metered cameras. 
 

Remember, the light meter in all cameras (that I know of) take reflected light readings at some version of an average 18% grey image. In some circumstances it is possible to “trick” the inbuilt incident meter, like highly reflective scenes over water (ignoring backlit scenes, sky, etc, for the moment). If used correctly, an incident reading overcomes this, and the 18% grey average.  
 

You are right to keep the Sekonic. It will come in handy, not least to check the accuracy of your newly acquired Leicameter. 
 

Yes, this forum has a very high voluntary participation fee!! 
 

Good luck

 

J