M10 M-D

[IkarusJohn]

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Wow, some strong reactions here!  At least it isn’t ho-hum!

The starting point is surely that this is an M-D, so if you want a screen this isn’t the camera for you. There’s nothing more to it.  The M60 aroused similar controversy, as did the M(262) M-D. 

Second, the camera is based on the M10.  Again, if you don’t like the M10, this camera is even less for you.  What will be interesting is what those extra buttons do - the one on the front, the top deck and the thumb wheel on the back. I guess they can be ignored, and you still have the direct controls - shutter, aperture, focus and ISO. I like the idea of being able to add the EVF if you need to, or not.

Third, the Fotos App is useful on the SL and TL2.  I think its a great idea.  To include it for the M10-D is sensible and useful. Needed? No, not at all.  I don’t imagine using it any more than I do for my other cameras, but it’s great when I need it.

Jury’s out on the thumb rest - I don’t think of it as a wind on lever. It isn’t. It’s a thumb rest. I don’t need it and I’m not at all sure I want it.

Otherwise, the camera is exactly what I expected.  Well done Leica!

[davidmknoble]

I've used the MD 262 for about 3 years and really enjoyed it.  I think some here have said the same thing.  I also have to say I was unsure about the M10D as thing unfolded.  However, one thing I love about my M10 is the size.  I still shoot a lot of film on two MP's and now my hands have the same size bodies, digital or film.  For me at least, I also love the tactile feel of the rewind lever.  Anyone that has shot film for any length of time has the rewind lever pulled out with a thumb resting on it.  So, I think Jono Slack said earlier this could be an interesting solution to the thumb aids that take the hot shoe spot - I agree.

Here is my likes about the M10D

• No LCD - like the MD 262 shooting in more inclement weather or at the beach, I think it is better sealed, better battery life and I cannot scratch an LCD that isn't there.
• Wifi App - this is ultimate flexibility - either use it or not.  I suggested something like this when the MD262 first came out so that we could easily change settings on the camera, like date and time, or even other parameters the MD 262 doesn't have.  Also, I have my phone with me all the time.  Taking a break at a coffee shop or just late in the day at dinner, I can see some of the shots I've made for the day without getting out a computer, and without opening the bottom of the camera up in a dusty or dirty environment.  Oh yes, and now I can share an image OOC if I want.  Or, I can never use it.  My choice.
• The thumb rest - having shot so much film with M3's and MP's I love that my thumb can rest on this lever, just like the film cameras.  Again, its a choice to use or not.  For me, it is consistency.  I know I'll hear backlash for this, but I would have loved it to wind with some resistance even if it did nothing.  It is habit to shoot and wind the lever for me and it keeps my hands doing something, so part of the creative process. I am sure I'm in the minority, but I love it along with the film body size.
• The EVF - I also wanted this in the MD 262, after all, why not?  I can put a 21mm lens on and look through the EVF to frame, but more importantly I liked the GPS.  The newer visoflex is so much better than the old one.  I wouldn't keep it on the camera, but I can use it if I want.  Nice choice, again, choice.

So lots of choices to use or not, which is great, IMHO.

What I don't like at first look (i've not held one yet, but may have one next week).

• I agree with some others, the ISO adjustment on the back of the MD 262 is perfect.  I am sure the ISO knob is on the top because that is the minimum of design change, but that is a better spot for +/- adjustment.  After all, on a film MP, I only use the rewind knob once per roll, not very often.
• I am curious if anyone knows, but is the wheel on the back of M10-D plastic or metal?  It looks like plastic and if so, would be a horrible design as it will get knocked and banged up as the camera is carried.  My MD 262 is scratched a little, but works fine.  Would hate to see a plastic wheel get broken or cracked on impact, so hoping it is at least aluminum if not brass.
• Yes, I am partial to black lacquer and which this was the case here, but I can live with black chrome.

So, that's my take as an old guy that loves film and has really enjoyed the MD 262!

 

[Ko.Fe.]

M-D 262 is more appealing to me. ISO where it is on film M and nothing is useless as exp comp and fake as level.

 

[NigelG]

1 hour ago, jonoslack said:

It isn't an anagram Nigel (close though!)

I think that not many were M-D 262 owners, and the word Ersatz was coined by someone who certainly hadn't!

Jono

I know it isn't (!) - a touch of paraprosdokia too far maybe.

My point was that the use of what visually resembles an "advance lever" as a optional thumb rest is the kind of thing that makes my (rational) architect heart sink....

Edited October 24, 2018 by NigelG

[FlashGordonPhotography]

I loved the M10-D for the two weeks I had it. An M-D camera isn't really for me but it really is beautiful. I like my M10 but the M10-D was very very pretty.

I won't be upgrading my M10 to a M10-P but if they had an M10 with the thumb rest I would. That's how much I liked it in use. For me the thumb rest is an absolute winner. Better than the thumbie I use or the Leica rest for the M10. It seems like a weird choice but I urge everyone to have an open mind until they actually pick one up.

Gordon

[Dr No]

Camera uses the thumb wheel to change the date and time. I did that once many years ago and never did again.

But no way to change white balances, lens codings, drive advance, flash sync all the things you really need. You have to go to app?

Aye aye aye.

[pico]

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I am fortunate to have kept several film M cameras and more film in storage than I can know without counting. When I need solace, it means I don't want a smart phone. Even my car has been stripped of stupid navigation devices.

And my mate feels the same. When we met some thirty years ago I asked her if she knew anything about GPS and she replied, "No, but I can fold a road map." We have been together since that very moment.

Oh, she has some old Leica her father left her. I used it to take this picture of the two of us.

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Edited October 24, 2018 by pico

[scott kirkpatrick]

8 minutes ago, pico said:

And my mate feels the same. When we met some thirty years ago I asked her if she knew anything about GPS and she replied, "No, but I can fold a road map." We have been together since. Oh, she has some old Leica her father left her.

Let's not get started on what GPS navigation has done for our sense of space and place.  I really miss driving back roads with the old DeLorme atlases.

Edited October 24, 2018 by scott kirkpatrick

[scott kirkpatrick]

1 hour ago, Outdoorimages said:

 

• I am curious if anyone knows, but is the wheel on the back of M10-D plastic or metal?  

 

I don't have one with me now, but I am pretty sure the back wheel is metal.

[IkarusJohn]

31 minutes ago, pico said:

... When I need solace, it means I don't want a smart phone ...

 

Then head out the door with  your camera and no phone.  The camera still works without a smart phone.

[SMAL]

vor 1 Stunde schrieb Dr No:

I'm not talking about viewing photos I have it switched off anyway. White balances, lens codings, flash sync, drive?

Not one of these things is set manually from me. I don’t shoot flash. Who needs that with perfectly usable ISO 6400 and even higher. Even with my none coded lens I don’t care. If these things are so important for you, the M10-D is simply not for you.

Too many in here overthink it.

For me the lever as an inbuilt thumb rest is genius. It looks nice and is functional. 

Will I buy an M10-D? No. Why? Cause I like to preview my photos when I rest for a coffee.

[pico]

Just now, SMAL said:

Not one of these things is set manually from me. I don’t shoot flash.

You might reconsider once you find out how to use minimal fill-flash under appropriate conditions.

 

[SMAL]

vor 2 Minuten schrieb pico:

You might reconsider once you find out how to use minimal fill-flash under appropriate conditions.

 

The only time I use flash is, when I shoot the reception on a wedding and even there I stopped using it since I have ISO12800 with my Sonys. 

I like to keep the ambient instead of manipulating it. If the light doesn’t appeal to me, I search for better light and composition. It’s simply matter of taste and it’s not mine. 

[logan2z]

7 hours ago, ianman said:

Is the MP out of production?? I missed that news!

Don't think so.  M7 yes, MP not to my knowledge.

[davidmknoble]

5 minutes ago, logan2z said:

Don't think so.  M7 yes, MP not to my knowledge.

The MP film body is still in production.  The M7 was halted earlier this year.

 

[logan2z]

5 hours ago, jmahto said:

In fact slowly my iPhone is becoming my digital capture companion next to my truly analog M2. 

Ditto.  I use my cell phone for quick digital snaps and my M-A for 'real' photography.  I've had a D-Lux Typ 109 sitting on the shelf practically unused for the past year, so I'm putting that up for sale to help cover the cost of the M4 that I just bought

[davidmknoble]

1 hour ago, Dr No said:

Camera uses the thumb wheel to change the date and time. I did that once many years ago and never did again.

But no way to change white balances, lens codings, drive advance, flash sync all the things you really need. You have to go to app?

Aye aye aye.

So, with the MD 262, you could only set the exposure compensation and date/time in the firmware.  Then I believe the firmware was updated with a better power management.  There isn't much you can do with no LCD screen and only the viewfinder red LED. Also, the MD 262 did not produce JPEGs, only DNG files, so white balance didn't matter.  The single or continuous shutter release was in the on-off switch.

I don't know yet if the M10-D will have settings for continuous or not.

But, it would be infinitely easier to change settings with the phone app rather than setting up complex button pushes and LED readouts on the camera.  I would think there would not be many things that need changing.  In terms of flash, on all my bodies I choose curtain sync one time and forget about it.  So, I assume if I have the choice here it would be about as easy.

Otherwise, it seems the answer to any question about settings is, what did we used to do when cameras were fully manual film bodies?  That's probably what we do here.  Bracket all the time with the MD 262 and have gotten some great shots in really odd lighting... 

Guess you can tell by now I'm a fan...

 

[sumolux]

Was really excited about this - but the 'folding thumb rest' killed it for me....

No need for film nostalgia because my M4 and MP-6 already have film rewind levers.

And my Q doe not need one.

With the money saved I'd rather invest in 100 rolls of Ektachrome and developing 😊

[earleygallery]

Film advance not rewind (that's the wheel the other end which looks like the ISO dial on the new M!).

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Hallo,

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[Xelor]

As the advance lever (thumb rest) is getting polarising feedback and different opinions I don't understand why Leica hasn't made it removable. Would be easy with minimal cost in production - and the customer could decide to keep it or not when using the cam.

 

 

Edited October 24, 2018 by Xelor