Code Name "Clooney"

[vikasmg]

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Thanks for your feeback.

The missing back-button focus capability was my very first feedback to Leica. Unfortunately it doesn't seems to be part of the "Das Wesentliche"-philosophy.  

Thank you for an excellent review.

 

- Vikas

[FlashGordonPhotography]

The batteries are the same as a number of Panasonic models. There are excellent third-party batteries on the market (for instance Jupio)

 

But the CL battery is NOT the same as a TL battery, which was the point. It should have been for those that are already in the system. The CL battery door has been described as cheap. Not something that should be said of a $3000 camera. Makes the whole camera sound like an expensive re-badged panasonic.

 

Leica's designs are all over the place like a burst bag of hundreds and thousands. Pop out batteries on the S, SL and TL. Cheap doors on the Q and CL. Multiple menu systems. Different control layouts. It would have been nice if Leica evolved their camera platforms into a cohesive and evolving style. What we actually have is a bunch of cameras that have nothing in common except their pricing structure and a lens mount. I had hope for Leica when the SL seemed to evolve from the S but now we have a dogs breakfast of a range. I can't think of any other manufacturer that's camera range is so disjointed. Leica make 4 different interchangeable systems (S, SL, TL-CL and M) and have SIX different batteries!!!! (M10, M, CL, TL, SL, S) and 5 different control systems!!!.

 

Gordon

[Jeff S]

But one can use the same 50 year old lenses on a variety of modern digital cameras. Just not the same batteries.

 

Jeff

[thighslapper]

But the CL battery is NOT the same as a TL battery, which was the point. It should have been for those that are already in the system. The CL battery door has been described as cheap. Not something that should be said of a $3000 camera. Makes the whole camera sound like an expensive re-badged panasonic.

 

Leica's designs are all over the place like a burst bag of hundreds and thousands. Pop out batteries on the S, SL and TL. Cheap doors on the Q and CL. Multiple menu systems. Different control layouts. It would have been nice if Leica evolved their camera platforms into a cohesive and evolving style. What we actually have is a bunch of cameras that have nothing in common except their pricing structure and a lens mount. I had hope for Leica when the SL seemed to evolve from the S but now we have a dogs breakfast of a range. I can't think of any other manufacturer that's camera range is so disjointed. Leica make 4 different interchangeable systems (S, SL, TL-CL and M) and have SIX different batteries!!!! (M10, M, CL, TL, SL, S) and 5 different control systems!!!.

 

Gordon

 

 errrr ....... isn't this called product differentiation and variety ....... 

[rosuna]

The best design toch of the Leica CL is the two wheels with buttons and the small LCD screen in between. 

 

Simple but a great idea.

[FlashGordonPhotography]

 errrr ....... isn't this called product differentiation and variety ....... 

 

Nope. Every other manufacturer seems to have some sort of consistency throughout their range except Leica.

 

So last night I had a chance to actually play with the CL. Nick Rains, who I trust, and who is a Leica CL ambassador has had his for a month or so and is very enamoured with it. So there's that. He wouldn't buy a camera he can't get on with.

 

It feels really petite. Numbers say it's very close to the TL2 but it "looks" smaller. And it's light. I stand by my criticisms but it's not as ugly in real life and the black smooths things out a bit. The Olympus PenF is much prettier though. It feels good in the hand for such a tiny thing and balances well with all the lenses. Balance is very important to me so this is good. I didn't put on the SL lenses but was told the grip is a big improvement. With how small it is I have no doubt that's true.

 

Focus seems pretty snappy although we were in a dim room and I didn't test it sided by side with the TL2. But I saw nothing in single shot that concerned me. The dials are great. Really like those. The battery door is cheap. Cheap. Cheap. Kind of pulls the rest of the build quality down just a notch.

 

EVF was good. Not SL good but big and bright. Menus are M10 like. I'd still prefer the wonderful TL menus and the CL ones don't work with touch. The CL confirmed to me the M10 would have benefited from a touch screen. My favourite feature will be the 1/8000 shutter. Nice.

 

So having seen it, I'm much more positive about the CL. I still don't like the things I didn't like before but the important stuff seems sorted. No camera is perfect and I can live with stuff I don't like (I'll still complain though) as long as the usability and balance are good. The CL gets that right.

 

I also think the appeal will be wider than I thought. It works as a stand alone system with those wonderful TL lenses. But SL and M users will be tempted as well as it's a nice and familiar complimentary camera to those systems.

 

Gordon

[Chaemono]

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Thanks for the feedback. Very helpful. I still have a hard time seeing how it appeals to a broader audience beyond Leica’s loyal user base. Will Fuji users switch? I seriously doubt it. Fortunately, the CL comes with a fabulous EVF even if its resolution is no better than what the Visoflex has and with very fast AF. But Fuji offers dust and moist resistant bodies and lenses in the APS-C format and a broad range of very good and optically stabilized lenses.

[Ingo]

Nope. Every other manufacturer seems to have some sort of consistency throughout their range except Leica.

 

So last night I had a chance to actually play with the CL. Nick Rains, who I trust, and who is a Leica CL ambassador has had his for a month or so and is very enamoured with it. So there's that. He wouldn't buy a camera he can't get on with.

 

It feels really petite. Numbers say it's very close to the TL2 but it "looks" smaller. And it's light. I stand by my criticisms but it's not as ugly in real life and the black smooths things out a bit. The Olympus PenF is much prettier though. It feels good in the hand for such a tiny thing and balances well with all the lenses. Balance is very important to me so this is good. I didn't put on the SL lenses but was told the grip is a big improvement. With how small it is I have no doubt that's true.

 

Focus seems pretty snappy although we were in a dim room and I didn't test it sided by side with the TL2. But I saw nothing in single shot that concerned me. The dials are great. Really like those. The battery door is cheap. Cheap. Cheap. Kind of pulls the rest of the build quality down just a notch.

 

EVF was good. Not SL good but big and bright. Menus are M10 like. I'd still prefer the wonderful TL menus and the CL ones don't work with touch. The CL confirmed to me the M10 would have benefited from a touch screen. My favourite feature will be the 1/8000 shutter. Nice.

 

So having seen it, I'm much more positive about the CL. I still don't like the things I didn't like before but the important stuff seems sorted. No camera is perfect and I can live with stuff I don't like (I'll still complain though) as long as the usability and balance are good. The CL gets that right.

 

I also think the appeal will be wider than I thought. It works as a stand alone system with those wonderful TL lenses. But SL and M users will be tempted as well as it's a nice and familiar complimentary camera to those systems.

 

Gordon

 

Gordon, I just can agree with every sentence in this post. 

+1

[jaapv]

I'm not quite so dogmatic. Leica has customers clamouring for small cameras - so they need a small battery.

And they have customers clamouring for high-megapixel, fast-buffered, highly specified cameras that drink power - so they need big batteries in larger bodies. Hard to reconcile.

I hope, that with the CL all coming Leicas will use non-specific batteries.

[rosuna]

I hope, that with the CL all coming Leicas will use non-specific batteries.

 

 

First priority. It would allow lower prices and longer availability of batteries... 

[lct]

[...] I hope, that with the CL all coming Leicas will use non-specific batteries.

 

+1

[FlashGordonPhotography]

If they'd just keep a battery from one model to the new one I'd not have to buy new ones everytime I upgraded a body. That'd make me happy. And if they were consistent then the generic options would follow.

 

Gordon

[FlashGordonPhotography]

I'm not quite so dogmatic. Leica has customers clamouring for small cameras - so they need a small battery.

 

The CL and TL batteries are about the same size.  Would have been no issue to use the same battery but I suspect they had more Panasonic input on this camera than the TL.

 

Gordon

[jaapv]

Anyway I'm happy as I have no TL batteries - but plenty of BLC 12 ones 

[Guest VVJ]

Menus are M10 like. I'd still prefer the wonderful TL menus and the CL ones don't work with touch. The CL confirmed to me the M10 would have benefited from a touch screen. 

 

Can the menu be operated through the viewfinder? 

 

That was one thing I did not like with the TL menu.  I needed my reading glasses to change menu options...

Edited November 25, 2017 by JorisV

[LocalHero1953]

Can the menu be operated through the viewfinder? 

 

That was one thing I did not like with the TL menu.  I needed my reading glasses to change menu options...

Yes.

[Guest VVJ]

Excellent!

[miro]

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[Irakly Shanidze]

Any chance it could be a video-oriented camera? CL...Cine-L? APS-C = super35? With SL Leica got their feet wet in video and on Photokina 2016 they showed something that looked like an old-fashioned camcorder, but built with all sorts of components from current photo cameras. The SL EVF was one of the more striking ones. Add an IBIS a la GH-5 from partner Panasonic, the range of TL lenses and quite a video-system right there.

Just a thought...

 

 

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

this is what i would use CL for. I found it super convenient in prepping for video shoots, namely for scouting locations, vantage points, perspective. The beauty of it is that for video it uses the same frame size as the SL for 4K: Super-35. So, instead of de-rigging the SL, which is heavy even on its own, I can put the same lens that i want to use in a project on a tiny CL body, shoot everything handheld, or from a small tripod, and then use the footage as a reference.

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica L-Mount

[scott kirkpatrick]

The CL and TL batteries are about the same size.  Would have been no issue to use the same battery but I suspect they had more Panasonic input on this camera than the TL.

 

Gordon

Besides the fact that the Panasonic batteries the CL uses are more powerful, there is the problem that the CL needs to fit a chip socket in beside the battery, so the flush fit of the TL battery doesn't work on the CL.  The CL leaving off the extra door for chip, USB3 and HDMI outputs fits the concept to me.  I like Irakly's positioning of the CL as useful for video as a kind of sketchbook tool rather than the final production camera.