Film returnee - XP2 & Plustek 7200 advice

[tashley]

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Hi all,

 

as a once film-boy and for many years digital head (two M8s and some glass) I recently decided to take a pop at film again, when presented with a mint MP which naturally I could not resist.

 

Where I live it's tough to get B&W film developed well and even tougher to get it scanned properly. There's a local lab that'll do chromogenic XP and I thought of buying a Plustek 7200.

 

Any advice or thoughts? When I did film years ago I favoured the pushed tri-x look but am happy to experiment, but do people think that XP2 is a vile imposter?

 

Any other reasonable priced scanner suggestions?

 

Thanks in advance!

 

Tim

[Photoskeptic]

Tim, XP-2 is ok. I find I have to open up 1/2 to 1 stop compared to Tri-X. Got a roll in my M4 right now Might be my last as I really prefer slower films. I find I can go street shooting with 100 speed and do just fine, but there are those who think it isn't street shooting unless some grain is involved.

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[tashley]

Tim, XP-2 is ok. I find I have to open up 1/2 to 1 stop compared to Tri-X. Got a roll in my M4 right now Might be my last as I really prefer slower films. I find I can go street shooting with 100 speed and do just fine, but there are those who think it isn't street shooting unless some grain is involved.

 

John, what scanner do you use? The Plustek seems great value for money...

 

t

[Photoskeptic]

Tim, I use a Minolta 5400 (first series). Never heard of the Plustek. But my never hearing of an item doesn't mean anything. If the 5400 ever breaks I'll get up to speed quickly:D

[Mark Antony]

Tim

I think that XP2 is a very good choice for people who don't want to process their own, gives nice sharp punchy images not unlike those from digicams.

But I don't use it as I find it has a slight lack of shadow detail compared to my favourite emulsions. This can be balanced by down rating to say 200, but I still personally don't like the smooth but sharp, grain free character.

 

As for scanners, I use a S/H Minolta I bought for £100 and it does the job nicely I regularly do A3+ on my R2400 and like the results.

 

Mark

P.S I have some info on my blog about film and scanning:

Photo Utopia

[tashley]

Tim, I use a Minolta 5400 (first series). Never heard of the Plustek. But my never hearing of an item doesn't mean anything. If the 5400 ever breaks I'll get up to speed quickly:D

 

I've just read Sean Reid's piece on sticking with film and he rates the Minolta and says that it's all he's ever needed...

[tashley]

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Tim

I think that XP2 is a very good choice for people who don't want to process their own, gives nice sharp punchy images not unlike those from digicams.

But I don't use it as I find it has a slight lack of shadow detail compared to my favourite emulsions. This can be balanced by down rating to say 200, but I still personally don't like the smooth but sharp, grain free character.

 

As for scanners, I use a S/H Minolta I bought for £100 and it does the job nicely I regularly do A3+ on my R2400 and like the results.

 

Mark

P.S I have some info on my blog about film and scanning:

Photo Utopia

 

Thanks Mark, useful advice. I did shoot a couple of rolls of it and it seemed to have a slightly plastic look but it was badly scanned in a photolab. I'll take a look at your blog!

 

Best

 

Tim

[photophile]

i find that using portra 160 color film, c-41 process and tiff scan, then converted to grayscale in lr works really well. i make up to 17 X22 prints with exceptional detail and film grain without it being overwhelming. does not digiplastic at all. imo. good luck. this is a close-up crop example. outdoor,m6 35cron pre-asph

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[tashley]

i find that using portra 160 color film, c-41 process and tiff scan, then converted to grayscale in lr works really well. i make up to 17 X22 prints with exceptional detail and film grain without it being overwhelming. does not digiplastic at all. imo. good luck. this is a close-up crop example. outdoor,m6 35cron pre-asph

 

That's really nice to my eye. And I like the idea that there is always the option of having the shot in colour if it works better that way. Hey, it's going to be just like shooting RAW...

;-0

 

Tim

[innerimager]

Hi Tim, good to see ya hear. My experience is quite limited, as I am not returning to film but only recently shooting it for the first time with an M7. I have a coolscan 5000D, seems quite good. I've shot many rolls of XP2 and liked the results for the most part. But... my favorite images were from a Tri-Ex roll that a friend developed. I think the convenience of XP2 will mean I use it more often. It's great having the cleaning routines that spot dust / scratch clean the chromogenic emulsion, and of course I can get it devloped 5 minutes from home for $2. But the effort to use "real" film may well be worth it. best....Peter

[tashley]

Hi Tim, good to see ya hear. My experience is quite limited, as I am not returning to film but only recently shooting it for the first time with an M7. I have a coolscan 5000D, seems quite good. I've shot many rolls of XP2 and liked the results for the most part. But... my favorite images were from a Tri-Ex roll that a friend developed. I think the convenience of XP2 will mean I use it more often. It's great having the cleaning routines that spot dust / scratch clean the chromogenic emulsion, and of course I can get it devloped 5 minutes from home for $2. But the effort to use "real" film may well be worth it. best....Peter

 

Thanks Peter... it sure is quiet around here though - or should I just say that it's exclusive!

 

I can see my self getting the bug quite badly. Tsk tsk...

 

;-)

 

tim

[marke]

Hi Tim,

 

I'm just following you over from dpr-Leica.

 

Anyway, I can't help you much on the XP2 subject. I have been shooting it off and on with my M6TTL, along with Kodak 400CN. I'm not sure which one I prefer, but since I bought about 40 rolls of the Kodak when Walmart closed it out last month, I'll be using that for a while. Mostly though, I've been shooting Portra 160 or 400 NC. I like the color, and as others here have mentioned, you can always convert to B&W in the scan.

 

As far as the Plustek 7200 scanner goes, I bought it on the suggestion of someone at dpr. You can probably figure who it is by doing a search for Plustek 7200 on the dpr-Leica forum. Unfortunately, this is about the only person I've ever seen passionately defend this scanner, so take it for what it's worth. It's a bit slow, and I have yet to process anything for print. But so far for web use, I'm more than pleased, especially when you consider the price.

 

I'm not sure how it compares to the Minolta or Nikons, but for the money it can't be beat. I wasn't ready to invest in a Nikon since I wasn't sure how much film I would be shooting this time around. Now I have to admit, I would like to know how the 7200 compares to the Nikon Coolscans. Part of the reason I'm considering that move is because I have yet to be able to use the Plustek with my new laptop which has Windows Vista. I'll have to give it another try, but the Vista compatible driver on the Plustek website hasn't worked for me yet.

 

As far as shooting B&W goes, compared to shooting color and converting, well, if I keep shooting B&W, I will probably go back to developing my own again, since I have been very unhappy with the scratched film I get back, even from the better local lab.

 

I'll be curious to see what you think of the 7200 if you chose to try it out. I have no personal experience with any other film scanner, so I can't offer an honest comparison.

[tashley]

Mark, that's very useful info - I've been reading some reviews and they say the Plustek is great value and gives very good results but that it is slow. I use a Mac and it's a sad commentary on the way Apple has developed that they are now in the business of marginalising people like themselves (i.e. those with great products but limited market share) and with Leopard coming out this fall, I wouldn't place money on the Plustek making the transition as soon as the Nikons.

 

I am going to try the Portra route, though it does look too grain-free for me but hey, I could always add grain later! What a strange world it's becoming!

 

Best

 

Tim

[innerimager]

Tim- here's one with XP2. In addition to liking it's look, the story is so different than digital. I ripped through several roles at the Kentucky Derby. One was never developed, just forgot. That's never happened with a card of images. So I came across it, walked over to the shop to develop it, having no idea what, if anything was on it. How old fashioned! There were several keepers, like rediscovering a forgotten memory. Oh well enough of the romanticized view....Peter

[Jamie Roberts]

Hey Tim,

 

I have my 750 sitting in a box waiting for time to set it up and try it out.

 

As for XP2--feh. I shot Ilford and Agfa forever in addition to Kodak, and XP2 was sort of the film of last resort for me. I just never liked the results as much (probably says more about me than the film though )

 

I like pushing TriX, personally; I also like slower films as well, Delta100 in particular. I wish I could get some Tech Pan and Technidol but they say it's all gone now. Crap. Haven't shot ISO 6 in a long while...

[peter55]

Hello Tim and Hello MarkE,

 

It's me Peter-Artist Eyes on dpreview

 

Ok so it was me over at dpreview that was recomending the Plustek OpticFilm 7200 DPI dedicated film scanner. To be honest it is a little slow, but for the price in the USA of $189 it is an excellent buy.

I scan at different output print sizes and also different dpi. This effects the speed.

Do you gentlemen scan at 72dpi for the preliminary scan? This will greatly speed things up. As you know dust and scractch removal is part of the supplied Silverfast 6 software but it only works on color and not on B&W.

The PlusTek OpticFilm7200 is a very good starter scanner. It may actually be as good IQ wise as scanners costing a grat deal more. But they have other features, like scanning multiple frames. But I'm conservative and scanning one image at a time in my opinion allows me to make adjustments to exposure, framing and color setting so that's why I recomended it to Mark. Perhaps in several years I'll spend 10 times the money for something else. But from what my scans look like I think it would at the most be just a little better, if even that.

 

When I really like an image and I think I may print it out at 13 inches x 19 inches (sorry I'm American and not very good at converting inches to metric but it's about 25mm to an inch) I scan as output 13" x 19" and at 2400dpi, and that's a large file.

Most of the time I scan output image size at 8 inches x 10 inches and at 300dpi some times at 600dpi if I like it enough to perhaps print larger than 8" x 10".

My best home printer is the HP8750 that prints 13" x 19" in 9 colors. BTW it has 3 color B&W and is rated as being in the top performers in B&W printing.

My next printer should be the HP Z2100 that is even better at B&W and it prints out images as large as 24" x 36" size. This is the famous 2 foot by 3 foot Golden Rectangle Shape and the same size canvas that painters use for Landscapes and Portraits.

So now there are 3 of us who have made it into the Leica Camera Forum from dpreview. That's great.

Tim you have the MP, Mark you have the M6 and I have the M5. Do I hear an M4 coming onboard soon - any one?

I have used Kodak Portra 160NC and it's very good. Also I use Kodak ISO 400 CN Professional B&W and it's very good, both C-41 processing.

 

I so wish I had a 35mm focal lenght lens....soon maybe. Well I'll see you two over on the dark side.

[Mark Antony]

Hello Tim and Hello MarkE,

 

It's me Peter-Artist Eyes on dpreview

 

So now there are 3 of us who have made it into the Leica Camera Forum from dpreview. That's great.

Tim you have the MP, Mark you have the M6 and I have the M5. Do I hear an M4 coming onboard soon - any one?

 

I so wish I had a 35mm focal length lens....soon maybe. Well I'll see you two over on the dark side.

 

Peter

Don't forget me! I post at DPR as well, I also have an M4-P I use a 35mm focal length lens on mine as well

Photo Utopia: June 03, 2007

A Canon though:)

Regards

Mark Antony Smith

[tashley]

Thanks Peter,

 

I have to say that I am increasingly liking what I see from this film when other people develop and scan it so well - unfortunately, my local pro lab was no better than the local consumer lab - poor development and cruddy scanning - so I'm looking into alternatives at the moment before I can really experiment with different emulsions myself.

 

I just got back a roll I shot at Stonehenge for the Summer Solstice and for now at least I am really glad I shot my M8 for all the important stuff because for whatever reason the MP had only exposed 4 frames out of 24. I am pretty certain it wasn't winding on, since the last four frames I shot were the only ones that came out, and were the first four on the roll!

 

:-(

 

T

[tashley]

Jamie, please do let us know how you get on with the Epson - I'm itching to buy a scanner but the Plustek sounds too slow and Jono says the Nikon 5000 was a huge PITA so I am really hoping that the Epson comes up trumps...

 

Best

 

T

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[tashley]

Hello Tim and Hello MarkE,

 

It's me Peter-Artist Eyes on dpreview

 

Ok so it was me over at dpreview that was recomending the Plustek OpticFilm 7200 DPI dedicated film scanner. To be honest it is a little slow, but for the price in the USA of $189 it is an excellent buy.

I scan at different output print sizes and also different dpi. This effects the speed.

Do you gentlemen scan at 72dpi for the preliminary scan? This will greatly speed things up. As you know dust and scractch removal is part of the supplied Silverfast 6 software but it only works on color and not on B&W.

The PlusTek OpticFilm7200 is a very good starter scanner. It may actually be as good IQ wise as scanners costing a grat deal more. But they have other features, like scanning multiple frames. But I'm conservative and scanning one image at a time in my opinion allows me to make adjustments to exposure, framing and color setting so that's why I recomended it to Mark. Perhaps in several years I'll spend 10 times the money for something else. But from what my scans look like I think it would at the most be just a little better, if even that.

 

When I really like an image and I think I may print it out at 13 inches x 19 inches (sorry I'm American and not very good at converting inches to metric but it's about 25mm to an inch) I scan as output 13" x 19" and at 2400dpi, and that's a large file.

Most of the time I scan output image size at 8 inches x 10 inches and at 300dpi some times at 600dpi if I like it enough to perhaps print larger than 8" x 10".

My best home printer is the HP8750 that prints 13" x 19" in 9 colors. BTW it has 3 color B&W and is rated as being in the top performers in B&W printing.

My next printer should be the HP Z2100 that is even better at B&W and it prints out images as large as 24" x 36" size. This is the famous 2 foot by 3 foot Golden Rectangle Shape and the same size canvas that painters use for Landscapes and Portraits.

So now there are 3 of us who have made it into the Leica Camera Forum from dpreview. That's great.

Tim you have the MP, Mark you have the M6 and I have the M5. Do I hear an M4 coming onboard soon - any one?

I have used Kodak Portra 160NC and it's very good. Also I use Kodak ISO 400 CN Professional B&W and it's very good, both C-41 processing.

 

I so wish I had a 35mm focal lenght lens....soon maybe. Well I'll see you two over on the dark side.

 

Hi Peter, good to see you over here!

 

Does the noise reduction on the Plustek work with chromogenic B&W films like XP2? I mean, they are really colour films...

 

Best

 

T