FTI Posted October 3, 2012 Share #21 Posted October 3, 2012 Advertisement (gone after registration) I am with you on this. Having finally gotten the M9; I've been able to compare the pics to my ex-M8.2. There are little differences in image quality. The current advantage I am noticing is the ability to crop more than I did with the M8.2 :-) So having the cam of my dreams (well for the last 1.5 years ) I'm happily planning my lens strategy. When I tested the M9 the owner let me shoot with a 35mm 1.4 asph.... WOW... The Leica M8 is a great camera. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Advertisement Posted October 3, 2012 Posted October 3, 2012 Hi FTI, Take a look here any plans to move to an M9/ME/M?. I'm sure you'll find what you were looking for!
Luke_Miller Posted October 4, 2012 Share #22 Posted October 4, 2012 My M9 arrived yesterday. In initial tests I am seeing improvement in high ISO performance versus my M8.2, which was my only real complaint with it. As much as I enjoy the M8.2, the M9 just seems a bit more refined and perfected. I quickly discovered that my most used lens (28 Summicron) on my M8.2 is too wide on the M9. So I guess I am now going to have to purchase a 35 Summicron. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronazle Posted October 6, 2012 Share #23 Posted October 6, 2012 I will buy a discounted m-9 from Leica if it is offered. Currently, my beloved black M-8 is off to Germany for eval of the coffee stained screen. If that is the case, I will be excited to quit having to play the IR cut filter games and just take pictures with the proper focal length lens. Of course, I will use my remaining M-8 for backup. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
!Nomad64 Posted October 6, 2012 Share #24 Posted October 6, 2012 The fact that new models came out didn't make my M8 work any worse and I'm pretty sure that no M9 or MM would make me a better photographer. So far the only reason that might make me switching would be shooting again in FF meaning that a 50 is a 50 and not a 66.5. Apart from that I still see no further advantages as the M8 was already an excellent starting point.Besides, whilst used lenses prices are increasing, prices of used M8s this side of the ocean are slowly but constantly falling. I paid mine 2.5 k€ in 2009, today they hardly exceed 1.6 k€ and I already see some selling around 1.1k€ so selling mine would be quite a bath of blood. Cheers, Bruno OK folks, from now on you can officially call me an hypocrite or quite so. Here's why. I went for a stroll at my favourite push... erm, dealer and amongst the rest I saw an used M9 for sale. In pristine conditions, not even a scratch on her gray paint or the plastic screen. Asked the price just out of curiosity. Quite lowish. The push... the dealer knows me quite well and made me a proposal: my M8 and 1.9 k€ on the top of that to take home the M9. I couldn't say no. Brought home an M9 of the end of 2010 with about 1800 actuations on her shoulders and covered by 12 months of dealer's guarantee plus a spare battery. First dummy test shots gave me good feedback apart from the expected magenta corners with the 24/2.8. Thank you and farewell, dear M8. You served me well. I wish you a worthy and passionate new owner. Welcome M9. Cheers, Bruno Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
FlorianM Posted October 10, 2012 Share #25 Posted October 10, 2012 Yes, I've got an M on order. The biggest reason is because I want to use my 50 summilux as a 50, and the M is not that much more than an M9. I can't wait! I'm quietly hoping Leica prefers to under promise and over deliver and I'll have my camera by Christmas Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wda Posted October 10, 2012 Share #26 Posted October 10, 2012 ...First dummy test shots gave me good feedback apart from the expected magenta corners with the 24/2.8. Thank you and farewell, dear M8. You served me well. I wish you a worthy and passionate new owner. Welcome M9. Cheers, Bruno Bruno, why did you expect magenta corners on your M9? That was a trait with unfiltered M8s. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
!Nomad64 Posted October 10, 2012 Share #27 Posted October 10, 2012 Advertisement (gone after registration) David, I beg to differ. The unfiltered M8 had never lens originating color cast issues. Her issue was structurally innate, namely the thin IR filter which caused the "magenta is the new black" issue with some synthetic fabrics. Based on the internet buzz and my very short direct experience the M9 seems to be plagued by either banding with non Leica lenses and asymmetric magenta/cyan color cast in the corners. The wider the lens and the more protruding of the rear elements towards the sensor the stronger the cast will be. In my case with the Elmarit I expected no banding as it's Leica but some color cast. This latter however revealed itself less bad than what I feared. Interestingly enough, older Berek designs such as the Summaron 35/3.5 LTM, Elmar 50/3.5 seem to be advantaged as their elements are in the middle of the barrel, thus keeping a safer distance from the sensor. A quick comparison between some shots I made with the Summaron 35/3.5 LTM and the Rollei Sonnar 40/2.8 LTM showed that the Summaron generated less color cast than the Sonnar as this latter's rear element is closer to the sensor no matter that the Summaron is wider than the Sonnar. In the next days I'll compare the Elmarit 24 with the CV Skopar 25/4 and with a Summaron 28/5.6 I expect to receive to see if the above theory is further substantiated. From what I can see so far apart from the magenta/black issue the M8 produced sharp images with brilliant and saturated color with little need for PP. The M9 delivers marginally superior imagery but in order to exploit it one has to work a bit more. I think it's for a very simple reason: the M8 had a smaller sensor therefore her images aren't but FF cropped in the center where lenses perform at their best and the angle of lightrays is less tight. Roughly speaking the M8 sensor picked the best out of a lens. Cheers, Bruno Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wda Posted October 11, 2012 Share #28 Posted October 11, 2012 Bruno, that is interesting. Currently I am reviewing and post-editing a lot of my older M8 and M9 files and, quite frankly, I see none of the symptoms you describe. So there may be other issues. Use of non-Leica lenses on either camera does not apply in my case, although I do have a mixture of old and new Leica lenses. Lack of consistently correct results suspected of being linked to coding issues with non-Leica lenses has been reported by some users, but I have no experience of that. My PP is always done in updated Lightroom and, apart from occasional need to adjust exposure slightly (usually done in batches), any further work is fine-tuning to suit my preferences. I should mention that I always shoot in Raw mode and habitually set white balance at the start of a shoot using a Pantone ColorChecker or WhiBal calibrated grey card. Then the raw processor knows my WB starting point before conversion. Judging from past threads, I sense that colour banding has only afflicted a small minority of users, luckily, not me. Many more users remark on the colour fidelity obtained with modern Leica digital equipment. So maybe you have just been unlucky. Incidentally I still use both bodies, the M8 (or X1) complementing the M9 depending on current needs or personal projects. The M9 remains my first choice for obvious reasons and, apart from occasional framing errors, I see no compelling need to change. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LikeMyLeica Posted October 11, 2012 Share #29 Posted October 11, 2012 Like Luke, just this morning I received my discounted, ex-demo but fully guaranteed and as new, steel grey M9. Just charging the battery now. I don't know about the IQ differences yet but the full frame and ergonomic changes (mainly manual lens selection) attracted me. I'm keeping my M8 as back-up and to shoot B&W. And I still prefer its top plate. I considered the M-E but this M9 was cheaper and - call me shallow - it has the USB port, which I use all the time (I've seen no one defend it - I guess I'm weird). At first I thought I liked the M-E's colour but I'm not so sure now. I admit, I've not seen one in the flesh - but by the time I did, would I still find a new M9 at such an advantageous price? I read somewhere yesterday - maybe on leicarumor?, dunno, IE9 can't be bothered to save browsing history properly - that there will be no other livery for the M-E. So I went for it. Will sell dSLR stuff to pay for it. I also have an (inherited) replica 0-Serie to dispose of but it seems worth very little in the UK. Do they do better in North America? I'm going there next month. I hope it's not against the rules to ask members' advice on this. Love this forum, by the way. Thanks to all, Nick My M9 arrived yesterday. In initial tests I am seeing improvement in high ISO performance versus my M8.2, which was my only real complaint with it. As much as I enjoy the M8.2, the M9 just seems a bit more refined and perfected. I quickly discovered that my most used lens (28 Summicron) on my M8.2 is too wide on the M9. So I guess I am now going to have to purchase a 35 Summicron. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerren Posted October 11, 2012 Share #30 Posted October 11, 2012 Syed, I'm right there with you with being a new m8u owner. I'm happy with what I have for now although I have to admit in the perfect world, I would have bought an m9. But for now, I'll proudly shoot the m8 as long as I can. Hopefully I'd get some better glass before getting a new body though. Maybe by time the m11 comes out, I'll have some better glass and would then be able to buy a m9/m9p for 2k. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
luigi bertolotti Posted October 11, 2012 Share #31 Posted October 11, 2012 I keep my beloved M8 and will look with strong attention at the feedbacks on M when people will have it hands-on : CAN be my next Leica, no doubt. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke_Miller Posted October 11, 2012 Share #32 Posted October 11, 2012 I'm keeping my M8 as back-up and to shoot B&W. And I still prefer its top plate. I too like the M8.2 top plate and its 2-meter-calibrated frame lines over the M9. I have my M8.2 listed for sale, but will happily keep it if it doesn't bring a fair price. With more use I find the M9's somewhat better ISO performance seems to be realized above ISO 1250. At 1250 my M8.2 and M9 are pretty much indistinguishable. The 35mm Summicron arrives today so I will be back to the field of view I prefer. I have not seen an M-E either, but my dealer says they are being distributed. Leica produced the R9 in Anthracite, but that seems to be a different color from the one used on the M-E. I must say my gray paint M9 looks much better in person than in any photo I saw. I think I now prefer it to black, which was the color I originally wanted for my M9. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
LikeMyLeica Posted October 11, 2012 Share #33 Posted October 11, 2012 I must say my gray paint M9 looks much better in person than in any photo I saw. Snap! I always wanted grey more than black, possibly because I love my silver M8. Don't get me wrong, I do think a black body and black lenses look great together. But I have more chrome/silver lenses than black. Tried to post a pic of one on the M9 but failed! Nick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
!Nomad64 Posted October 11, 2012 Share #34 Posted October 11, 2012 Bruno, that is interesting. Currently I am reviewing and post-editing a lot of my older M8 and M9 files and, quite frankly, I see none of the symptoms you describe. So there may be other issues. Use of non-Leica lenses on either camera does not apply in my case, although I do have a mixture of old and new Leica lenses. Lack of consistently correct results suspected of being linked to coding issues with non-Leica lenses has been reported by some users, but I have no experience of that. My PP is always done in updated Lightroom and, apart from occasional need to adjust exposure slightly (usually done in batches), any further work is fine-tuning to suit my preferences. I should mention that I always shoot in Raw mode and habitually set white balance at the start of a shoot using a Pantone ColorChecker or WhiBal calibrated grey card. Then the raw processor knows my WB starting point before conversion. Judging from past threads, I sense that colour banding has only afflicted a small minority of users, luckily, not me. Many more users remark on the colour fidelity obtained with modern Leica digital equipment. So maybe you have just been unlucky. Incidentally I still use both bodies, the M8 (or X1) complementing the M9 depending on current needs or personal projects. The M9 remains my first choice for obvious reasons and, apart from occasional framing errors, I see no compelling need to change. David, thank you for yr attention and yr comments which I found very interesting. I have a similar but not identical approach. I too shoot exclusively in RAW but so far I always relied on the in-camera automatic white balance settings. I develop my RAWs with Rawtherapee as I'm a Linux user and until now I've been happy with its settings. Reading yr comments made me think that however the color cast should be an intrinsic problem, the fact that you preemptively set the white balance might greatly contribute to reduce it. I should also check if the in-camera corrections work on jpegs only or are RAW effective. During this weekend I'll test and tweak a bit. These are my first steps with more a sophisticated tool which also brings issues unknown to me until now and I must figure the way to deal with them. Just to give an idea here are three samples. From left to right the outcomes of the Sonnar 40, the Summaron 35/3.5 and the Elmarit 24. All files straight out of the camera, converted in jpeg and scaled. No other interventions. The magenta casts are visible in variable fashion and it's interesting to note how the three lenses colored the same portion of overcast sky. Cheers, Bruno Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here… Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! Link to post Share on other sites Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members! ' data-webShareUrl='https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/189057-any-plans-to-move-to-an-m9mem/?do=findComment&comment=2139221'>More sharing options...
wda Posted October 12, 2012 Share #35 Posted October 12, 2012 Bruno, I see what you mean. It is common to all three lenses which suggests a sensor problem. In monochrome it is easy to neutralize that cast but it is difficult to tell whether the same is true for RGB files based on this evidence. You say the price from your dealer was quite 'lowish'. I would be inclined to pay him a visit with the camera and some files on a spare card and ask his opinion. There could be a sensor issue involved and he should investigate this matter. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
WestMichigan Posted October 13, 2012 Share #36 Posted October 13, 2012 No plans to Upgrade from my M8 at all. I carefully, carefully weighed getting one 15-16mo's ago. I do not have need or want of more Megapixel, I enjoy intentional IR Photography, I am comfortable with 'cropped' sensors and the associated -/+'s of that, I dearly love the luscious feel of it in my hands, and above all else I have found Viewfinder photography very much to my liking. Were I to have a signifigant 'windfall' for some reason I see a lot to like with the 2012 M, but would definitely still keep my M8 because of the Intentional IR Photography feature. :-) Sincerely Richard in Michigan Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaques Posted October 13, 2012 Share #37 Posted October 13, 2012 i am lucky enough to have an M8 and an M9-P. I was considering selling the M8 and some lenses to buy the new M. I must say I am excited by its new features: liveview, video, macro, tele, higher ISO, almost infinite vintage 35mm lens possibilities... etc. These are all things I might use. I do want to wait though until the experts have dissected the IQ from the new M camera. But now I am changing my thinking: I may sell the M9, keep the M8 and grab an M. It seems silly to have an M9 and the M. and the M8 might be more versatile as a second camera: crop factor is actually useful, infrared, and good B&W. My only concern is the plummeting prices of M9's. Looking on ebay I saw a few minty M9-P's selling for around 4.5K only... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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