M8 'Back to reality'

[mwilliamsphotography]

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Some of these answers do a disservice to Andy. He has expectations that aren't being met, and his perspective is simply wanting a camera that doesn't let him down ... especially a $5,000. camera.

 

Now saying his camera is an anomaly because a few others haven't experienced the same issue, while others say they have, dilutes the anomaly factor.

 

I just had the exact same thing happen with a M8 fresh from service. Freshly charged battery, grabbed the camera for a non-critical outing ... worked fine, formatted the SD, and left. Get there, turn on the camera ... nothing.

 

No big deal, except it makes me think twice about counting on it to shoot a wedding ... at least parts that can't be re-staged. I could have a shopping bag full of batteries and it wouldn't make a lick of difference if I were shooting the Bride being escorted down the aisle by her Father ... which I have done thousands of times with a 1 Series Canon, or even a M7, with zero failures to date. That's how trust is built.

 

NOW, all that said, I suspect the crappy charger may be involved with all this.

 

My pal's charger went south, and recently so did one of mine. I suspect it didn't charge the battery even though it said it did. Now it doesn't say anything ... no charge light at all.

It may be a coincidence, but I am suspicious of coincidences when it comes to electronics.

 

Thoughts?

[jaapv]

That is a reasonable thought. The only time the battery went unexpectedly without me being the culprit was indeed the charger, replaced by Leica afterwards.

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[sisoje]

Thoughts?

 

Your camera is still broken! Take it back to the service. I did and after a second time, I got replacement that works great.

 

If all the owners who experienced this kind of problem would take their M8s to service each time it showed up, I am sure some "red light" in Leica would light up.

And than, maybe we would have a recall on particular issue.

 

To report a problem, here on this forum or any other and claim that camera design is an issue won't change anything. This type of camera should be reliable. Period. If it's not, there is a problem with that particular body. You can deal with it or just sell it and let somebody else deal with it. Your choice. You will loose $$ on the spot. My choice was (is) to solve my problem and fix the faulty M8. That is why we have a warranty. Correct? Now, my problem is solved.

I love using the system, and I would try to fix any problem rather than just dump it. Simply because there is nothing like this that can replace it.

[Eoin]

....I just had the exact same thing happen with a M8 fresh from service. Freshly charged battery, grabbed the camera for a non-critical outing ... worked fine, formatted the SD, and left. Get there, turn on the camera ... nothing. .....

 

Again I draw the OP's attention and others attention to the fact that Leica recommend calibrating the batteries to the body by forcing them to fully discharge in the camera by disabling the power off function on the LCD.

 

It's interesting that fotografz has noticed this problem with a unit returned recently from service. I have noted the same issue on each of the 3 returns of my camera from service. This issue disappears when the battery is calibrated in the manner Leica suggest in the FAQ's IMO. Perhaps when the camera is in service it is either wiped clear or the internal battery which powers memory is disconnected resulting in a need for a fresh calibration.

[KM-25]

That is a reasonable thought. The only time the battery went unexpectedly without me being the culprit was indeed the charger, replaced by Leica afterwards.

 

How long did it take you to get the charger replaced? And what was the path of decision making that made Leica do it?

 

Just curious so that if this ever happens to me, I can know what to expect...

[jaapv]

Actually it happened the day before the camera was due to be collected to be updated, as it was a first-series camera. I did not even realize it was the charger I called Leica with the symptoms and they told me to send the charger and the battery with it, and it was returned in the normal course of events in twelve days with a new charger and battery included. I would guess that Leica can get you a new charger real quick, should the need arise. I always, on extended journeys, carry two chargers - and if possible, enough batteries to see me through with careful use. This is not specific Leica btw. I used to do exactly the same with my Canons.

[dalippe]

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Again I draw the OP's attention and others attention to the fact that Leica recommend calibrating the batteries to the body by forcing them to fully discharge in the camera by disabling the power off function on the LCD.

 

It's interesting that fotografz has noticed this problem with a unit returned recently from service. I have noted the same issue on each of the 3 returns of my camera from service. This issue disappears when the battery is calibrated in the manner Leica suggest in the FAQ's IMO. Perhaps when the camera is in service it is either wiped clear or the internal battery which powers memory is disconnected resulting in a need for a fresh calibration.

Eoin,

 

I did not realize that the point of draining the battery in-camera was to calibrate the body and battery to one another. I figured the point was to reset something internal to the battery. Are you sure this is the fact Eoin? If so, does it imply that someone with two bodies must keep of track of which battery was drained in which body, and only use batteries with the appropriate body? My current practice is to use the first battery I grab in whatever body needs it.

[jamriman]

I have this issue also. Do you suggest I fully discharge as described via disabling the LCD screen shut off? If this doesn't work, then send in the charger to Leica for calibration? Thanks.

[calvinboy24]

I have experienced the exact same problem as the original poster. While shooting in continuous mode as well as shooting in single shot mode in rapid succession, my M8 "died". Now when I say "died", I mean that the LCD would not display, the shutter would not activate, and the battery and shot count would not display. Popping out the battery and placing it back in did not fix this, although the red LED did flash when putting the battery back in. I don't know if this means that the battery has some power left, but I can't say for sure. In the 2 or 3 times I've experienced this, I would say the battery had 2 bars. A new battery does work fine. I always shoot RAW only.

 

My speculation is the same as what others have suggested, that its something with buffer-overload when trying to save multiple files to the SD Card. I remember one time the weather was cold, but another time may have been indoors, so cold draining the battery may not have been an influence.

 

I've tried recreating the situation so I can pinpoint the exact scenario and pre-conditions that could cause this, but I haven't been successful.

 

Like Andy, I'm not disappointed in the M8, its a fantastic camera and I have no regrets purchasing and using it. Every electronic equipment I own has some foible in it, which I learn to live with. This ranges from the very rare lenses not registering on my 5D and 20D to my iPod skipping songs to my computer shutting off by itself due to faulty wiring. If I expected everything to work perfectly, then I'd be living in an idealistic world, which this world certainly is not. If Leica can fix this problem, then I'd consider sending it in to have it fixed. Otherwise, this is just a minor annoyance and my workaround is to always carry a spare battery, which I always do for my dSLR's. I even carry a travel charger for my iPod, whose battery life I'm always disappointed with.

 

I'm not directing my response towards anyone, but seeing the defensiveness in some of the posts (both positive and negative towards Leica or the M8) makes me uneasy. We all purchased the M8 knowing (more or less) Leica's reputation, but responses stating (paraphrased): "go ahead sell your M8" or "I expect M8's to perform 100% of the time" just cause us to devolve into inane arguments.

 

In sum, my recommendation, as someone who's experienced this problem, is to carry a spare battery and try not to shoot in continuous mode. Sure you lose shots changing batteries and becomes an annoyance as its unexpected, but when has everything always gone one's way? Ask the metaphorical bitter fisherman whose complained his entire life about "the one that got away". Get over it and take more photos (or in this example, keep fishing!)

[jamriman]

I have experienced the exact same problem as the original poster. While shooting in continuous mode as well as shooting in single shot mode in rapid succession, my M8 "died". Now when I say "died", I mean that the LCD would not display, the shutter would not activate, and the battery and shot count would not display. Popping out the battery and placing it back in did not fix this, although the red LED did flash when putting the battery back in. I don't know if this means that the battery has some power left, but I can't say for sure. In the 2 or 3 times I've experienced this, I would say the battery had 2 bars. A new battery does work fine. I always shoot RAW only.

 

My speculation is the same as what others have suggested, that its something with buffer-overload when trying to save multiple files to the SD Card. I remember one time the weather was cold, but another time may have been indoors, so cold draining the battery may not have been an influence.

 

I've tried recreating the situation so I can pinpoint the exact scenario and pre-conditions that could cause this, but I haven't been successful.

 

Like Andy, I'm not disappointed in the M8, its a fantastic camera and I have no regrets purchasing and using it. Every electronic equipment I own has some foible in it, which I learn to live with. This ranges from the very rare lenses not registering on my 5D and 20D to my iPod skipping songs to my computer shutting off by itself due to faulty wiring. If I expected everything to work perfectly, then I'd be living in an idealistic world, which this world certainly is not. If Leica can fix this problem, then I'd consider sending it in to have it fixed. Otherwise, this is just a minor annoyance and my workaround is to always carry a spare battery, which I always do for my dSLR's. I even carry a travel charger for my iPod, whose battery life I'm always disappointed with.

 

I'm not directing my response towards anyone, but seeing the defensiveness in some of the posts (both positive and negative towards Leica or the M8) makes me uneasy. We all purchased the M8 knowing (more or less) Leica's reputation, but responses stating (paraphrased): "go ahead sell your M8" or "I expect M8's to perform 100% of the time" just cause us to devolve into inane arguments.

 

In sum, my recommendation, as someone who's experienced this problem, is to carry a spare battery and try not to shoot in continuous mode. Sure you lose shots changing batteries and becomes an annoyance as its unexpected, but when has everything always gone one's way? Ask the metaphorical bitter fisherman whose complained his entire life about "the one that got away". Get over it and take more photos (or in this example, keep fishing!)

Did you try the LCD technique to fully drain the battery to solve the issue? Just curious.

[jaapv]

Eoin,

 

I did not realize that the point of draining the battery in-camera was to calibrate the body and battery to one another. I figured the point was to reset something internal to the battery. Are you sure this is the fact Eoin? If so, does it imply that someone with two bodies must keep of track of which battery was drained in which body, and only use batteries with the appropriate body? My current practice is to use the first battery I grab in whatever body needs it.

 

I think it is just the battery electronics- I cannot see a difference in response by my two bodies.

[plasticman]

In sum, my recommendation, as someone who's experienced this problem, is to carry a spare battery and try not to shoot in continuous mode. Sure you lose shots changing batteries and becomes an annoyance as its unexpected, but when has everything always gone one's way?

 

I'm fascinated by how faulty everyone's belongings are.

 

I've owned a few p&s digital cameras and now the R-D1s, and also an M6 and M7, a few Olympus OM1's, the Dlux2 which started me off with Leica; I've used the bureau's Canon 10D (along with everyone else who totally mishandles it); I've also owned various cars (no Ferraris though), and I've been using Mac computers for the last 15? years. I have 2 iPods and a hi-fi from Quad and the usual assortment of LCDs and other gadgets and cellphones...

 

I can honestly say that the worst thing that has happened to any of these at any time in my entire life is when I willfully destroyed an earlier Ericsson phone because its System software was so buggy.

 

Judging by people here who carry 2 camera bodies, 2 chargers(!), 5 batteries, 8 SD cards and whose lives still seem to be filled with malfunctioning gadgets - well now I realize I have a charmed life.

[Guest Ridder Cornelius]

"Judging by people here who carry 2 camera bodies, 2 chargers(!), 5 batteries, 8 SD cards and whose lives still seem to be filled with malfunctioning gadgets - well now I realize I have a charmed life"

 

it's called taking ones hobby to the limits :-)

[Jamie Roberts]

{snipped}In my view the honest critics actually do Leica a better service in the long term.

 

Mani, you're probably right. The only problem with your statement is that everyone posting here is totally honest, though some are mis-informed, and some just want to stir the pot .

 

Look, Andy does have a defective camera if he can lock it up in C mode with a couple of bursts. Even if he sells he should get it fixed.

 

Otherwise, what you are effectively saying is that those of us who successfully use the camera all the time--and in arguably more strenuous condition than a studio--are just deluded.

 

Now, maybe Leica had a bad manufacturing run. Maybe the contacts on the battery are faulty. Maybe there's a bad circuit board. Maybe a lot of things, but the camera as designed is not faulty; at least, no-one here knows if that's true or not. Only Leica knows, and as far as I'm concerned, they should fix any situation like this.

 

So no-one is being a head-in-the-sand apologist by saying "it's a good camera; get it fixed if you can't rely on it".

 

Hold Leica accountable: don't just whine on an Internet forum. They can't fix something if they don't see the issue.

[Guest rweisz]

Wow,

 

you are right it is my decision and I was not asking you for your opinion.

All this BS about 'not having a backup' is rubbish, I am an enthusiast, not shooting for NATGEO..

And if you feel comfortable to call me an idiot without knowing me, then I feel sorry for you my friend.

 

FYI (and anyone else reading) I never called you an idiot. What I said was

The days of dropping your Nikon F in a river and drying it out with a hairdryer and keep on shooting are long gone, and even then, only an idiot would not have a backup and expect Murphy's Law to leave him be.

. My reference was back to 40 years ago before all these electronics people still got caught with there pants down if they didn't have a backup.

 

What really made you cough up a loogie and spit it at me? Maybe it was that I was the one who said straight out what a lot of people are thinking, that you probably basically wanted to sell the M8 and blaming this little hiccup as the final straw. In fact I see that after wasting everyone's time who tried to offer you help, you admitted it:

The purpose of my post was to share the event that finally brought me to decide to sell it.Not to ask for how to prevent it happening again.

 

So then, by your own words, the only reason you started this thread was to stir the pot. I had the shutter bend and crash in my M8 week before last, it's now on it's way to Solms for God knows how long. I have no intention of selling it though, because sh#t happens. It's been a good and reliable camera otherwise, as it has been for the majority. They've sold more than 20 thousand of them, if they were all POS there would be 10 thousand in Solms getting repaired (and turnaround time would be a year), and another 10 thousand on eBay.

[Guest guy_mancuso]

"Judging by people here who carry 2 camera bodies, 2 chargers(!), 5 batteries, 8 SD cards and whose lives still seem to be filled with malfunctioning gadgets - well now I realize I have a charmed life"

 

it's called taking ones hobby to the limits :-)

 

For a Pro it is not a charmed life at all just a normal one. LOL

 

 

Andy since you are in Germany I would also think it is worth a trip to Solms. Batteries are suspect , charger maybe suspect and cards maybe suspect and if you feel comfortable after checking those out that there running normal than i highly recommend sending it in for service. Let Leica look at it and see what was your cause and fix it. Than if still not happy than sell the thing if it really is annoying and just not up to your expectations. I do know from shooting runway stuff with the M8 the buffer is very slow and a several shots in continous mode will hit the buffer. You really have to pace yourself with the M8 when constantly shooting like this but several frames and stopping like you did should not cause what you run into normally. Yea it's slow but it should clear and not die on you either. Just a few thoughts there from what you wrote. Usually when things like this happen batteries are my first attempt at fixing it because i have run into several battery issue along the way. My batteries are suspect at this point but only because of heavy use. But if in your mind it was not a battery issue than send it in. No reason to be unhappy

[Guest rweisz]

I just had the exact same thing happen with a M8 fresh from service. Freshly charged battery, grabbed the camera for a non-critical outing ... worked fine, formatted the SD, and left. Get there, turn on the camera ... nothing.

 

No big deal, except it makes me think twice about counting on it to shoot a wedding ... at least parts that can't be re-staged. I could have a shopping bag full of batteries and it wouldn't make a lick of difference if I were shooting the Bride being escorted down the aisle by her Father ... which I have done thousands of times with a 1 Series Canon, or even a M7, with zero failures to date. That's how trust is built.

 

I agree, I'd call that trust. But not confidence that it can't or won't ever happen. Having gear go south so you miss an un-repeatable shot is a pro's worst gear-related nightmare, mainly because we all know it can happen with any brand, even if we have a bag full of backups.

 

 

 

NOW, all that said, I suspect the crappy charger may be involved with all this.My pal's charger went south, and recently so did one of mine. I suspect it didn't charge the battery even though it said it did. Now it doesn't say anything ... no charge light at all.

It may be a coincidence, but I am suspicious of coincidences when it comes to electronics.

 

Thoughts?

 

No, but a question: I get it that the charger display can indicate a full charge even if it hasn't fully charged the battery. What I don't get is how when you put that battery in the camera, the camera's battery guage thinks the battery is fully charged. Does the camera not measure the actual charge level in the battery?

[andym911]

@rweisz

 

you are, I believe, misinterpreting my post as a stir up.It is nothing of the sort.

regards

andy

[Guest Ridder Cornelius]

As a first time owner of an M8, and that only for 4 weeks or so it does make me feel at least a bit uncomfortable reading about the M8 issue posted in this forum. There are quite a lot actually, now I understand this is probably not representative over the complete line of M8 users. And I'v used mine in C mode often, my battery is ok and so my charger just like I would expect from a 4000€ camera .... And if a problem occurs and I would note it on any forum I would probably feel more pee'd off with answers like; well Look at Canon ERR99, my mobile blew up too, most of my other electronic devides have faults, while this all maybe true, this is not the issue here. We speak about an expensive camera of which any owner has the right to expect top notch quality stuff, at least I do, just for having invested a lot more money in a, what I would think, high quality contraption.

Now making Leica aware of these malfunctions by sending your camera to service is pointless, if they are the sort of company they proclaim to be they are obviously aware of this already, sending your camera in however is ofcourse the way to go, but only to have it fixed, not to make Leica aware of the situation.

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Hallo,

Look here: Leica M

[andym911]

@Guy

 

I sent the camera back this morning and am planning to be in Solms Friday to 'see with my own eyes' what the cause is/was

 

keep you posted

 

andy