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M8 'Back to reality'


andym911

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Jaap...

I disagree....I never have spare battery for a couple hours shoot with my 30d, my cellphone, my ricoh, my M6, my M7..

For longer photo trips for sure......common sense.

 

Anyway what would that have helped me here when the 'shoot' was only a few seconds?

 

It is n ot a battery issue, it is a product issue.

andy

Never forgotten to switch it off and left it in the bag with the shutter half-depressed? I have....

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Dear all,

 

If this was the first time the camera had locked up on me,then you know, give Leica some slack and go through the 'battery' process.

 

It is not the first time.

Last year on a trip to Israel it died on me almost immediately after arriving, it went back to Solms as then it could not be revived.(no camera for an 8 day trip:D )

 

Jamie, I don't think the camera is faulty as you say....it is just unpredictable, as many posters also mention, a few bursts in C mode can bring it to a stop.

And as I noted once I got home, fresh battery in and all is well.....until the next time.

No for me its going, I am glad to have 'got to know it' but it does not cut the mustard.

 

andy

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You'll have to change your code-words now the Canucks are taking over. A table full of booze doth not make "dinner". Canadian rules require a bit of food on the table :D

 

cheer's

Robert

 

Robert,

 

I checked the EXIF data...it was after we'd got the food behind us:D

 

andy

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It's either a battery problem or a problem in that specific camera. If you want to sell your M8 as a result of this, that's your decision. But a lot of people haven't had such a problem. A lot of people have had other problems (like shutters giving up the ghost, as happened to me recently). You want a battery-operated complicated computer/electronical/mechanical camera to work flawlessly with no chance it will conk out during a shoot? Join the club, so do we all. I've had top-model Nikon and Canon (before and since digital) hiccup and pass out in the middle of shooting too. Battery problems, camera problems, card problems now with digital. Cost of the camera has nothing to do with it. The days of dropping your Nikon F in a river and drying it out with a hairdryer and keep on shooting are long gone, and even then, only an idiot would not have a backup and expect Murphy's Law to leave him be.

 

Wow,

 

you are right it is my decision and I was not asking you for your opinion.

All this BS about 'not having a backup' is rubbish, I am an enthusiast, not shooting for NATGEO..

And if you feel comfortable to call me an idiot without knowing me, then I feel sorry for you my friend.

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Guest Ridder Cornelius
But it is indeed Murphy's law. I can tell you all about Canon and error 99....

 

on a 375€ 350d yes ... I think thios might be one of the more important issues here

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Guest Ridder Cornelius

But gratefully Canon is not the issue here, it is after a leica forum

 

 

I'm sure many companies have had problems introducing new products, perhaps you could mention some more of them this would surely put andy's mind at ease about his M8

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I am sorry to read your troubles, Andy.

 

Posting them, as you have, you surely must have expected the usual gumbo of reactions that you've received. Some trying to be helpful (take the battery out, swing it over your head, and rub it with motor oil), some defending / excusing the product (most M8s are fine, yours is just a statistical quirk), others blaming you (why didn't you wear the standard Leica battery bandalero?).

 

In fact, it's well known here (although still denied by some) that the M8 has significant production consistency and engineering issues. It's not a secret.

 

If my M8 experience was anything like yours I'd dump the camera immediately, as you're now doing, with no hint of remorse. Being a casual snapper you're getting no practical benefit from an M camera. In fact, it's probably a far more limiting tool than that little p&s.

 

Enjoy your new cash-out wealth and enjoy your next camera. Remember, all that counts is the image.

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What I meant to say - there is no digital camera that does not behave like the electronic device it is. The M8 is no exception - I have been lucky, I only suffered empty batteries through my own fault. Others have had the equivalent of Window's "blue screen" Annoying, but a fact of life. Restart/reset and off we go again.....

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{snipped}Jamie, I don't think the camera is faulty as you say....it is just unpredictable, as many posters also mention, a few bursts in C mode can bring it to a stop.{snipped}

 

Andy--if a few bursts in C mode bring it to a stop, then it's broken! Really and truly. This is not how an operating M8 actually works.

 

Look, some faults are constant--like a broken wheel or shutter. Some are intermittent. It's always the hardest to fix these, but they still need to be fixed.

 

Your camera is broken and is not working as designed. They are not "quirky" when working properly, believe me: I've used my in a torrential downpour, in -20C temperatures, and for almost a year and half now with nothing like the inconsistency you've had.

 

I'm not lucky; you're *unlucky* in that you have a broken camera.

 

Why not let Leica fix it? Really... even if you're going to sell it, you should let them fix it first.

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I am sorry to read your troubles, Andy.

 

Posting them, as you have, you surely must have expected the usual gumbo of reactions that you've received. Some trying to be helpful (take the battery out, swing it over your head, and rub it with motor oil), some defending / excusing the product (most M8s are fine, yours is just a statistical quirk), others blaming you (why didn't you wear the standard Leica battery bandalero?).

 

In fact, it's well known here (although still denied by some) that the M8 has significant production consistency and engineering issues. It's not a secret.

 

If my M8 experience was anything like yours I'd dump the camera immediately, as you're now doing, with no hint of remorse. Being a casual snapper you're getting no practical benefit from an M camera. In fact, it's probably a far more limiting tool than that little p&s.

 

Enjoy your new cash-out wealth and enjoy your next camera. Remember, all that counts is the image.

 

Ken,

 

I am with you, on all points...whilst I love my other M's and have done for years...this will now go, as you say without a hint of remorse....

It doesn't feel that bad....;)

andy

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{Snipped}In fact, it's well known here (although still denied by some) that the M8 has significant production consistency and engineering issues. It's not a secret.

 

If my M8 experience was anything like yours I'd dump the camera immediately, as you're now doing, with no hint of remorse. Being a casual snapper you're getting no practical benefit from an M camera. In fact, it's probably a far more limiting tool than that little p&s.

 

{snipped}.

 

Ken--really--why encourage this "oh-Leica! Producing a weird little device that sometimes works and sometimes doesn't" attitude?

 

The M8 is not a tempermental peice of garbage. It has its problems (notably on the sensor side), but quitting in the middle of a burst is not one of them, unless the camera is defective or the battery is not connecting.

 

That's it--really.

 

If my "anything" experience was like this I'd hold the manufacturer to fix the freaking thing or get my money back.

 

 

Why would anyone accept it as as "quirky" but "loveable"? As "factually" engineered to be as finicky as, what?? You know, I can't think of any Rube Goldberg device that fits the bill here by way of analogy!

 

EDIT: saw Andy's post about letting Leica fix things. Really--I don't want them to get away with producing things that people only think work if you look at them right and the stars align and all that...

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Andy,

 

I haven't had any issues with my M8 which I bought over a year ago. However, I haven't shot on continuous mode much, only a few times. As much as I love the M8, for a sports event I would never use it. That's when my 5D comes into play. Even a less expensive DSLR would fair better in a situation like that. I feel for you because to add insult upon injury your friends were probably wondering why you spent a fortune on a camera that crapped out on you so easily.

 

I would not give up on the M8, it's not a sports camera. I previously owned an MP and a M7, both had to be returned to Leica for repairs under warranty. The M8 has been the best camera experience of my life, but not for sports or fast moving events. If I were in your situation I would drain the batteries, re-charge them, and try again. Sorry it's not been a good ride for you. Leica does not equal perfection, that myth isn't really very helpful. I have learned that buying a Leica is pretty much like buying any other reputable brand name, none are perfect, and sometimes things break down.

 

Regards,

Wilfredo

Benitez-Rivera Photography

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I'm a hobby photographer too, I've never even been thinking about getting a second battery.

I've used all my cameras owning one battery for each model.

 

I'm lucky that I've never had any big problems.

 

However, I think the idea of "must of minimum 2 batteries" for a family event without the pressure of getting the pictures or be without bread for a week, is simply stupid.

 

We aren't walking around with double batteries for our mobilephones, laptops or cars are we?

 

Andy's M8 has somekind of problem, and most likely all of the M8's draining or impairing their battery has some kind of problem, either due to manufacturing or user error.

 

2 batteries shouldn't be a must.

 

Now my M8 has worked flawlessly, besides a couple of "pop the battery" incidents.

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I'm a hobby photographer too, I've never even been thinking about getting a second battery.

I've used all my cameras owning one battery for each model.

 

I'm lucky that I've never had any big problems.

 

However, I think the idea of "must of minimum 2 batteries" for a family event without the pressure of getting the pictures or be without bread for a week, is simply stupid.

 

We aren't walking around with double batteries for our mobilephones, laptops or cars are we?

 

Andy's M8 has somekind of problem, and most likely all of the M8's draining or impairing their battery has some kind of problem, either due to manufacturing or user error.

 

2 batteries shouldn't be a must.

 

Now my M8 has worked flawlessly, besides a couple of "pop the battery" incidents.

 

Hmmm I'm an amateur too, and I have had two cameras and I think six batteries from the beginning. I admire the minimalistic approach, but when I crashed one camera in the middle of Africa, I was very glad to have a second. As for batteries, I think to risk carrying a dead piece of metal instaed of a camera for the lack of a relatively cheap piece of gear is unwise. I would be seriously annoyed by draining a battery and losing the rest of a photo-opportunity.

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I've thought about selling out, too, and for the same reasons -- I reported my own problem here a few days ago, when the camera quit in 32F/1C temperatures. The thing that has stopped me is that the glass is great, and the usability is wonderful, the camera is fun to use, and I have high hopes for the next version, the M9. However, if somebody told me today that there would be no M9, the M8 would be gone tomorrow. Not only do I not trust the M8, I wouldn't trust the M8 with a backup.

 

For my non-fun photography, I've begun re-enlarging my Nikon system, and I will tell you, the D3 and D300 are pretty easy to take when all you want to do is think about the image, and not about the camera.

 

JC

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Talk about timing. After posting my last two messages in this thread I went with my son and wife to a local duck pond. I brought both M8s. So I had two cameras, two lenses, two batteries and two sd cards. No one can accuse of me of being without backup!

 

Anyway, it is somewhat cold here (my dashboard weather widget claimed 42 F). Both M8 batteries died, one after only 20 or so shots. One started the shoot showing three bars, the other two. I don't know if I lost shots in the sense of the something I took not getting written to the card. But I did lose shots in the sense of having to stop earlier than I wanted to. This was the coldest weather in which I had used my M8. I wonder if the M8 battery is even more sensitive to cold than other camera batteries? After all, 42 Fahrenheit is not *that* cold.

 

So if Jamie is correct that there is no inherent design flaw in the M8 or its battery that makes it flaky, then at the very least a large fraction of M8s / M8 batteries are defective! Now I know a bunch of people will respond telling me that I should have taken this or that precaution and only an idiot doesn't know what the cold does to a battery, etc. But I've shot with my Canons in far colder weather than this without problem. And my cell phone didn't poop out, and I certainly haven't explicitly drained and recharged that battery after throwing it in a cauldron with newt's eyes...

 

I think I would have done better if I had been able to keep shooting, but I did get a couple of cute shots of my son. So as not to be entirely negative, here's one:

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Andy, I fully empathise you're M8 and battery situation and view point.

 

How many people here supporting the multiple battery argument for an M8 would really be that happy to have to carry multiple batteries for your Cell Phone, or Pace-Maker...?

 

I know I'd be very annoyed to have a fully charged Cell Phone, and to find out moments into receiving an important phone call from my 'stranded child'.... to have the phone go dead.

or for those here who are childless, the negotiations for a business contract, or just when

that hot-lady decides to ring you......

 

I have 4x Leica (D1, D2, D3/L1 and DL-2) cameras, plus Leica Ultravids and heaps of other Leica accessories..... so I am no Leica basher.

 

I want to see Leica get on top of this quickly, as I have my sights set on the the next M product.

 

I really hope Leica sorts out it's field testing (QA) for future M8 / M9 "out of the box" products.

 

Maybe Leica should out-source the final engineering design/manufacture of the M9 to the Japanese, who have a "6-sigma attitude" to manufacturing...

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