Survey: Leica M EV1 – Future or mistake?

[S Maclean]

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7 hours ago, davysn said:

It's less about Leica trying out new possibilities than it is about Leica beginning to abandon tradition. 

Yet what made Leica succesful was precisely to abandon tradition and create a new portable 35mm camera system.  Tradition is realtive to our position in the time-line of innovation.  Otherwise we would all be carrying easels and brushes and painting, rather than photographing.

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[charlesphoto99]

I think the mistake Leica has made is releasing it too early.  If I had been a beta tester (alas I don't have a YouTube review site and I'm only 61 with decent eyesight so not a candidate) I would have told Leica to go back to the drawing board. Whether they would have listened or not who knows. But half baked for nearly $9k is a stretch too far, especially as tech changes so rapidly these days. Of course, none of us US users have even had a chance to hold the thing yet, or even look at it through a glass case. 

[Lightwrangler]

vor 2 Stunden schrieb raizans:

Redesigning the body so it looks sexy and adding some focusing aid options like picture-in-picture is all it would take to improve survey responses dramatically, IMO.

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

*deleted my rant*

Edited yesterday at 04:01 PM by Lightwrangler

[LocalHero1953]

29 minutes ago, sebben said:

Guys it costs 7.950,00€!

It's a mirrorless EVF camera without autofocus or ibis.

It's more niche than a Leica without a screen or colour 🫠

 

You want a niche? Have I got a niche for you!

It's a mirrorless camera without autofocus or IBIS - not even an EVF>

And guess what - it costs €8950 !

Edited yesterday at 04:08 PM by LocalHero1953

[pgk]

18 minutes ago, S Maclean said:

Yet what made Leica succesful was precisely to abandon tradition and create a new portable 35mm camera system.

Yes at the right time when technology allowed and it was innovative. The M-EV1 late and uses technology to allow it to look backwards not forwards (M not AF).  Hardly abandoning tradition.

[LBJ2]

1 hour ago, pgk said:

Yes at the right time when technology allowed and it was innovative. The M-EV1 late and uses technology to allow it to look backwards not forwards (M not AF).  Hardly abandoning tradition.

"The M-EV1... uses technology to allow it to look backwards not forwards (M not AF)" Well said. I like this perspective, I'm stealing it. 😎

Edited yesterday at 05:34 PM by LBJ2

[sebben]

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1 hour ago, LocalHero1953 said:

You want a niche? Have I got a niche for you!

It's a mirrorless camera without autofocus or IBIS - not even an EVF>

And guess what - it costs €8950 !

The difference though is significant. The range finder is the quickest way to manual focus normal lenses at normal apertures, as well as allowing you to compose a photograph while being able to see beyond the FOV of the mounted lens (28mm-135mm). It is a unique selling point.

The EV1 has nothing offers nothing beyond a normal mirrorless camera regarding shooting experience unless you highly value shooting an M mount lens without an adapter 🤪

[lct]

30 minutes ago, sebben said:

[...] The EV1 has nothing offers nothing beyond a normal mirrorless camera regarding shooting experience unless you highly value shooting an M mount lens without an adapter 🤪

Besides the M11, the MEV1 is the only mirrorless camera allowing autozoom with M and adapted LTM lenses. Only prerequisite, the lens must be RF-coupled. Such lenses are linked to a mechanical part (aka roller cam) of rangefinder cameras, that Leica cleverly retained in the MEV1. It is dedicated to the auto magnification mode (aka autozoom), which is a unique feature among mirrorless cameras that need otherwise a button or another control to trigger magnification with M or LTM lenses. Such a control exists in the form of a function button, in M11 and MEV1 bodies, AFAIK, but magnification can be triggered automatically with both cameras, by simply turning the focus ring of any Leica or non-Leica RF-coupled M or adapted LTM lens. I have no experience with the MEV1 though. FWIW.

[siddhaarta]

I use occasionally my 5-years old Nikon Z5 with Nikon FTZ II Adapter and Zeiss Milvus lenses (chipped).

The green focus confirmation box implemented in the way, Nikon did it, is the best method of focusing manual lenses with EVF,  I have experienced ( ... that said, I still prefer the good old microprism in film SLRs):

1) It is faster and more precise than with the range finder patch 

2) It is much faster than with focus magnification

3) It is much more precise than with focus peaking

When Leica comes in generation M-EVx with something similar, I am certainly  in ....

Edited yesterday at 06:29 PM by siddhaarta

[lct]

1 hour ago, siddhaarta said:

The green focus confirmation box implemented in the way, Nikon did it, is the best method of focusing manual lenses with EVF

Would be great if this coud work with M and LTM lenses from the 1930s to nowadays. Any idea about that?

[pgk]

2 hours ago, lct said:

Besides the M11, the MEV1 is the only mirrorless camera allowing autozoom with M and adapted LTM lenses.

On a Sony this requires one button to be pressed. The M-EV1 is a pricey way of automating one button.

[lct]

49 minutes ago, pgk said:

On a Sony this requires one button to be pressed. The M-EV1 is a pricey way of automating one button.

All other mirrorless cameras require a button or another control to trigger image magnification with M and LTM lenses. Not only Sony but also Fuji, Sigma and Leica digital CL cameras to name a few i have experience with. Been there done that.

Edited 21 hours ago by lct

[wilfredo]

For myself, I think Leica made the right move, the M camera continues to evolve.  I've used M cameras for close to two decades. My go to camera these days is the Q2M.  I also shoot with a Sony A7RV but don't experience the same level of joy as when shooting with my Q2M.  The simplicity and size of the Q2M is wonderful.  The fact that it's a Monochrom camera serves me well, and add to that the AF and it is a relief.  I would love to use my M lenses again, and hope to do so as soon as Leica introduces a Monochrom version of the EV1.  The Visoflex concept - and expense - has never appealed to me, it looks like a clumsy gadget, and even the name "Visoflex"  sounds like something out of a science fiction movie from the 50's.  At the end of the day, it's about IQ.  My favorite photographs 80% of the time have come  from a Leica camera, mostly M photos in the past, but these had nothing to do with the rangefinder viewfinder.  It's always been about IQ for me, and the smaller size of the camera (which is the reason I have never been drawn the SL series cameras).   I look forward to checking out the new Leica EV1 but will wait for the Monochrom version before I take the plunge.   

[SrMi]

21 minutes ago, wilfredo said:

For myself, I think Leica made the right move, the M camera continues to evolve.  I've used M cameras for close to two decades. My go to camera these days is the Q2M.  I also shoot with a Sony A7RV but don't experience the same level of joy as when shooting with my Q2M.  The simplicity and size of the Q2M is wonderful.  The fact that it's a Monochrom camera serves me well, and add to that the AF and it is a relief.  I would love to use my M lenses again, and hope to do so as soon as Leica introduces a Monochrom version of the EV1.  The Visoflex concept - and expense - has never appealed to me, it looks like a clumsy gadget, and even the name "Visoflex"  sounds like something out of a science fiction movie from the 50's.  At the end of the day, it's about IQ.  My favorite photographs 80% of the time have come  from a Leica camera, mostly M photos in the past, but these had nothing to do with the rangefinder viewfinder.  It's always been about IQ for me, and the smaller size of the camera (which is the reason I have never been drawn the SL series cameras).   I look forward to checking out the new Leica EV1 but will wait for the Monochrom version before I take the plunge.   

+1 for M-EV1 Monochrom.

[jonoslack]

6 hours ago, charlesphoto99 said:

I think the mistake Leica has made is releasing it too early.  If I had been a beta tester (alas I don't have a YouTube review site and I'm only 61 with decent eyesight so not a candidate) I would have told Leica to go back to the drawing board. Whether they would have listened or not who knows. But half baked for nearly $9k is a stretch too far, especially as tech changes so rapidly these days. Of course, none of us US users have even had a chance to hold the thing yet, or even look at it through a glass case. 

Hah! I don’t think any of the beta testers have a YouTube channel, I’m over 61, but I fear that most of the rest are younger than you (and I certainly was when I started), and we all have good eyesight. 

A beta tester’s job is not to tell a company to go back to the drawing board!

If you read the interview with Stefan, they did this at the request of customers, and it is to test the water without spending huge amounts on R&D. 
 

Added to which, making something which is a direct competitor to their signature product ……(which currently has no competition).. and spending lots of money doing it seems to me to be commercial suicide!

The M EV1 might not be the pinnacle of technological advancement, but there isn’t anything else quite like it, and there are circumstances where it’s great to use.
 

If it sells I’m sure they will head to the drawing board. 
 

All the best

[lykaman]

Let’s face it, if your paid or Leica offers you a pre production camera, I doubt you will offer to much negativity! If like many Leica owners you are ‘well healed’ buy it, try it, keep or sell it won’t really matter! Fanatics will either hate’ or love it.. At the end of the day, it’s a Leica camera with a variant of the RF… I might fly to Europe buy an M EV1 and play with it for awhile, thereafter it will be just another box with a red dot… boring’ 🍷

[LocalHero1953]

9 minutes ago, lykaman said:

Let’s face it, if your paid or Leica offers you a pre production camera, I doubt you will offer to much negativity!

Perhaps, if you're just a reviewer.

But I'd be surprised if a beta tester lasted long if they gave only positive feedback. I've been a firmware beta tester, and the feedback has been rigorously critical, reasoned and balanced.
(My understanding is that the beta testers don't get to keep their cameras and must buy their own - but I'm sure one or the other will confirm that)

[jonoslack]

5 minutes ago, lykaman said:

Let’s face it, if your paid or Leica offers you a pre production camera, I doubt you will offer to much negativity! If like many Leica owners you are ‘well healed’ buy it, try it, keep or sell it won’t really matter! Fanatics will either hate’ or love it.. At the end of the day, it’s a Leica camera with a variant of the RF… I might fly to Europe buy an M EV1 and play with it for awhile, thereafter it will be just another box with a red dot… boring’ 🍷

Hah - good points, (especially with respect to influencers) but the Beta testers aren’t paid in any way, and honestly - the conversations on the forum are impassioned and there are a lot of skilful photographers. The job is to find things which are wrong (and we Certainly do). The buzz of having a preproduction camera soon wears off - but the fun of testing and discussing a camera with fun and intelligent people never does!

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[jonoslack]

1 minute ago, LocalHero1953 said:

Perhaps, if you're just a reviewer.

But I'd be surprised if a beta tester lasted long if they gave only positive feedback. I've been a firmware beta tester, and the feedback has been rigorously critical, reasoned and balanced.
(My understanding is that the beta testers don't get to keep their cameras and must buy their own - but I'm sure one or the other will confirm that)

Exactly! No freebies! It’s hard work but It really is good fun. 

[jaapv]

17 hours ago, MinRas said:

In my opinion, Leica's biggest mistake was disrupting the legacy of the Leica M line by introducing the EV1—a picture-making computer—under the same iconic branding. By placing it in the same arena of technical specifications as other brands, Leica entered a competition it has little chance of winning. It was a clever move to use the letter "M" to shield the product under the prestige of the M series, but in doing so, they diluted the magic and mystique that made the M line so special.

For many people, buying an M camera is about more than just photography—it's about owning a piece of history. The joy comes from the timelessness of the rangefinder (RF-Messsucher) system, which remained virtually unchanged for nearly a century. And now… that legacy feels compromised.

I would say that entering a market with the intention to “ win” is rather foreign to Leica.