Jono: A Leica M EV1 Review

[jonoslack]

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41 minutes ago, rustyrus said:

Thanks for the direct response Jono- 

I hear what you are saying- As a long time Leica user and lover of the RF patch, I was really hoping Leica took the same level of care of thoughtfulness it did when the rangfinder came out initially and changed photography for ever. 

I thoughtthey would take the same approach here and try and come up with a fresh perspective on how to achieve focus in a digital world and set them up for the next 8 decades. Sadly its just a re-tread of a M11 with a visoflex. This Should have just been the M11-e and not made a big deal out of it. Pretty disappointing  - I have 9k in my pocket and was really looking forward to this camera. Not anymore. Cheers and as always, thanks for all of your reviews and reading between the lines, your honest perspective. 

Well . . . . I think this camera is a toe in the water - all the technology already exists and it probably wasn't the moment to bring out a radical new camera, the M12 is a way away, and the sensor for the M11 has no AF points on it. 

What you are asking for would require a great deal of R&D - some people have been saying 'just stick a small sensor at the other end of the camera and use it for triangulation for a new patch" . .  it's a great idea, but what happens when you put on a lens with a different focal length? do you still use the same other camera with the WATE and the 135 APO (of course not). 

I agree a fresh perspective on symbolic focusing would be fabulous - and I think that Leica agree as well, but It would (will) cost a huge amount of money in R&D, and perhaps nobody wants a manual focus camera with an EVF anyway? (Lots of people think that - both here and at Leica - just look at the threads here). 

So expecting them to spend tens of millions on something which most people don't seem to want?

I think this is a brave first step - if you don't want it - fine (I'm not sure I do either - as you have gathered by reading between the lines ) But if enough people do, then maybe the M EV2 will have an electronic rangefinder patch!

All the best

[jonoslack]

2 minutes ago, RQ44 said:

I read an interesting comment on a youtube channel, " the leica M ev is like a lamborghini converted to EV, it no longer has it's mighty roar, what it was known for" The M series was known for its unique rangefinder. Is this model now just a normal digital camera? Every video and review I ever watched and read on the M series discussed the rangefinder and how the photographer was compelled to own one because of this feature. This new M EV in my opinion is no different now to a Fuji camera. Cmon Leica, why take the roar from the Lion and turn him into a domestic cat.

They haven't taken away the roar from the lion

they've just made another lion (or pussycat) without a roar (to see if anyone wants it!)

[SrMi]

1 minute ago, RQ44 said:

I read an interesting comment on a youtube channel, " the leica M ev is like a lamborghini converted to EV, it no longer has it's mighty roar, what it was known for" The M series was known for its unique rangefinder. Is this model now just a normal digital camera? Every video and review I ever watched and read on the M series discussed the rangefinder and how the photographer was compelled to own one because of this feature. This new M EV in my opinion is no different now to a Fuji camera. Cmon Leica, why take the roar from the Lion and turn him into a domestic cat.

Leica is offering another option for those that use Visoflex or LCD most of the time. What is wrong with that? Not every Leica camera is for everybody.

[RQ44]

1 minute ago, SrMi said:

Leica is offering another option for those that use Visoflex or LCD most of the time. What is wrong with that? Not every Leica camera is for everybody.

Valid point, So why not re-badge it a Leica EV and isolate it from the M series all together? Put it in it's own class.

Edited yesterday at 10:17 PM by RQ44

[IkarusJohn]

6 minutes ago, RQ44 said:

Valid point, So why not re-badge it a Leica EV and isolate it from the M series all together? Put it in it's own class.

Because it uses an M mount and is primarily for M lenses …

[CDodkin]

38 minutes ago, jonoslack said:

Hi There

First of all I would like to say that I really think the M11 colour is good, and I'm responsible for the colour in these images (all adjusted in Lightroom)  - but I understand that others don't - none of these pictures were taken using the new firmware WB adjustment tool - so the magenta can now be put any way you want it  - you don't need manual remediation beyond a once off setting change - do it, save it to your profiles and it's done! There are lots of further possibilities with this (saving different settings to different profiles etc.). 

But you can't use the Visoflex II on the EV1 - the connections aren't there.

 

Thanks for the info on the Visoflex II - pity, but I get it.

Regarding a fixed camera-based Magenta offset - which is I think what you are describing? That doesn't fix a variable magenta WB tint issue - you can just get yourself a fixed WB offset that's more to your liking if I'm reading it correctly.

Which is fine, but not what I'm after. I'll keep setting manual WB in camera with a transmission target in that case, for each lighting/shooting set-up. Magenta offset changes based on lighting/latitude etc, so a fixed offset is of limited use.

Edited yesterday at 10:38 PM by CDodkin

[Printmaker]

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7 hours ago, jonoslack said:

Hi There Tom

Thank you - Glad you enjoyed it. I can still do the rangefinder okay - like most of us I have the start of cataracts … "why not just pay and do them now? you never know when the colour will be affected, and afterwards you will only need glasses for reading" Food for thought!. 

all the best

I was surprised how yellow my vision had become when I had my eyes done. The doctor did one eye at a time a few weeks apart. The fixed eye was so much sharper and brighter. The old eye had a distinct yellow color cast. It was like shooting through a filter.

Back on topic, thanks for the review. Excellent as always. I began using the SL system because the EVF clipped onto my M10 was such a PIA to use. This new camera makes sense for anyone who shoots wide or long. But I won’t be trading in my SL2 or SL2S for a MEV1 anytime soon.

[plexi]

6 hours ago, alanlwilder said:

Does anyone know the purpose of the cam roller inside the lens mount? I've seen it pictured in the Leica instruction manual but no explanation or details. As we all know, it use to be used for normal M camera's rangefinder patch coupling to the lens. Since there is no conventinal optical rangefinder, what's it for? My guess is that it any movement of the cam roller automatically activates the EVF/LCD screen magnifier aid whenever the focus ring is turned on any rangefinder cammed lens. This function will not work on an R adapted lens since the is no rf cam.

 

Yeah that's what I figured as well as it says in the manual you can set it up to automatic magnification via the focus ring.

[Bill W]

Jono thanks for another great review. As I near 80, my eyesight is still sort of ok but could use some help. In addition to Leica, I use a Hasselblad X2D and rarely use the viewfinder and rely on the back screen and focus assist. I look forward to getting my hands on the EV1 as I have a nice collection of M lens.

[AmbientLightNZ]

I am over the moon this has finally been announced. As a photographer with (very) poor eyesight I have been stuck using my m lenses on an old CL Digital due to not being able to focus a rangefinder. The SL series has always been just a bit too big to consider as an every day driver.

This looks like it will be the answer, for me at least! 

[harmen]

7 hours ago, RQ44 said:

the leica M ev is like a lamborghini converted to EV, it no longer has it's mighty roar, what it was known for

Well… it would be like an EV with stick shift.  It still has manually focused lenses after all.  

[viramati]

If they could implement MF confirmation in the way Nikon can with giving a small green confirmation box of the area in focus then this camera could make sense but for anything other than static objects focus peaking and magnification is just to slow and cumbersome.

[SrMi]

4 minutes ago, viramati said:

If they could implement MF confirmation in the way Nikon can with giving a small green confirmation box of the area in focus then this camera could make sense but for anything other than static objects focus peaking and magnification is just to slow and cumbersome.

Most of the images shared in the M11 image thread have static subjects. For the fastest focusing, even rangefinder shooters did not use the rangefinder, but prefocused instead. Still, the rangefinder is probably much quicker to focus than the EVF.

The MF confirmation in Nikon requires probably on-sensor PDAF (must know direction and distance) and electronic contacts. Neither of which has a chance to get on M sensors.

[Smogg]

15 minutes ago, SrMi said:

Most of the images shared in the M11 image thread have static subjects. For the fastest focusing, even rangefinder shooters did not use the rangefinder, but prefocused instead. Still, the rangefinder is probably much quicker to focus than the EVF.

The MF confirmation in Nikon requires probably on-sensor PDAF (must know direction and distance) and electronic contacts. Neither of which has a chance to get on M sensors.

Electronic contacts are not required for this. For example, focus confirmation and eye detection work with this adapter.

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

[pgk]

11 hours ago, newtoleica said:

Sony cameras have never performed well with wider M lenses and if you want a decent EVF you need big body like the A7IV - quite different handling.

Well, it depends. They perform well enough and, as I have repeatedly said, cameras are about compromises, none are perfect in all roles.

We will see how the M-EV1 fares post honeymoon period, when the flurry of excitement has subsided and the reality of results kicks in.

[Viv]

Thank you for this excellent review.

I am tempted, but the lack of focus confirmation disappoints me.

I will reflect some more before deciding whether or not to trade my M11 for this new camera.

[SrMi]

32 minutes ago, Smogg said:

Electronic contacts are not required for this. For example, focus confirmation and eye detection work with this adapter.

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

Thanks for the correction. I assume that the adapter (6-bit) provides the camera with the focal length and, therefore, has electronic contacts. Is that correct? An M camera reads the 6-bit code directly and would not need any electronic communication.

[IkarusJohn]

1 hour ago, SrMi said:

The MF confirmation in Nikon requires probably on-sensor PDAF (must know direction and distance) and electronic contacts. Neither of which has a chance to get on M sensors.

It was on my F5 - a film camera!

[SrMi]

6 minutes ago, IkarusJohn said:

It was on my F5 - a film camera!

I assume it has PDAF.

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Hallo,

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[Smogg]

25 minutes ago, SrMi said:

Thanks for the correction. I assume that the adapter (6-bit) provides the camera with the focal length and, therefore, has electronic contacts. Is that correct? An M camera reads the 6-bit code directly and would not need any electronic communication.

Exactly. The Leica M, thanks to lens coding, has sufficient information; the only thing missing is PDAF.