Consolidating into one system around M11

[sanyasi]

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I often photograph protests, rallies, marches, and demonstrations.  I use three cameras--21mm, 28mm, and 75mm.  You've got to be careful with the 21mm because you can get distortion on the edges, but it is great for a march, with people holding a wide banner.  The 28 is the standard lens for the street scenes.  The 75 is for portraits of people with their signs.  All of this is a matter of personal choice, personal style, and the desired look.  I do not like 35mm or 50mm.  If I need to get closer or farther from the subject, I use my feet.

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[sanadsaad]

So I think ive come up with a small list. 

Camera: M11 Black paint or M11-P. I absolutely love how the black paint looks and feels but people keep mentioning the sapphire glass and increased storage on the P. 

Lens:

1. 21mm Super Elmar

2. 35mm APO Summicron/35 Summilux steel rim

3. 50mm Summilux

4. 75mm APO Summicron

I need to decide between skipping the 50 or the 75. Im not sure yet. I will probably shoot a few rolls with 50mm and see if I miss the 35 much? Maybe when I have the 21, I won't go to the 35mm. I love shooting 50mm and only go to 35mm when I need a bit more space and there isn't any to move back with a 50mm and get everything in frame. 

[sanadsaad]

On 7/12/2025 at 2:12 PM, ronaldc said:

Summaron 28 5.6 👍👍

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Gorgeous lens and camera!

[jakontil]

On 7/15/2025 at 4:44 AM, sanadsaad said:

So I think ive come up with a small list. 

Camera: M11 Black paint or M11-P. I absolutely love how the black paint looks and feels but people keep mentioning the sapphire glass and increased storage on the P. 

Lens:

1. 21mm Super Elmar

2. 35mm APO Summicron/35 Summilux steel rim

3. 50mm Summilux

4. 75mm APO Summicron

I need to decide between skipping the 50 or the 75. Im not sure yet. I will probably shoot a few rolls with 50mm and see if I miss the 35 much? Maybe when I have the 21, I won't go to the 35mm. I love shooting 50mm and only go to 35mm when I need a bit more space and there isn't any to move back with a 50mm and get everything in frame. 

Dont worry bout sapphire glass or increased storage.. at the end of the day you will have a screen protector and use sd card….

unless if u need that content credentials signature 

[Knightspirit]

On 7/11/2025 at 5:18 AM, jgeenen said:

Although 90mm is said to be THE portrait lens, I sometimes find it‘s field of view too narrow in studio or environmental portrait situations. With Leicas, the lack of viewfinder magnification adds additional challenge for framing, composition and precise focusing. In my point of view a 75mm lens is the better choice, especially combined with a decent 35mm lens (on M11, this combo can make the 50mm lens redundant). 

The 75mm F2 APO is a definite winner - expensive - but worth it...

[Kiwimac]

At the moment I’m satisfied with an M11-P, a 28 Summilux, a LLL 35 f2 8 Element and a 50 Apo Summicron. 
 

Based on past experience, I stay away from longer lenses on the M. If I wanted to use them (anything longer than 50) I’d buy a used SL series body and do it on that with the M adapter. It’s not impossible to use them on an M but it’s very hard using the rangefinder unless you’ve exceptional eyesight. 
 

I’ll probably get a 35mm in a newer design.  The 8 Element homage by LLL is certainly very good indeed. However, as a reproduction of a very old design using replicated very old glass and coating, it is what we might call ‘characterful’ and what Peter Karbe might call “flawed”! A bog standard current Summicron 35 is almost certainly less flawed and of course you can’t see the flare and ghosting through a rangefinder so you might not realise it’s there until you check. Sometimes you want the old look and sometimes you don’t. 
 

I would like an M11 Monochrom if I win lotto. 

Edited July 19 by Kiwimac

[SrMi]

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I find the iOS app Mark II Artist's Viewfinder to be a good tool for visualizing the framing of different focal lengths and how they complement each other.

[LeicaR10]

Sanadsaad,  As you have read, there are many most excellent recommendations to your OP question from well intentioned and experienced photographers.  It looks like from your post #22, you have narrowed the field.  Based on what I read in your posts, I highly suggest you keep it simple.  The camera that meets your needs appears to be a M11-P.  A now solid performer after some initial fielding hiccups with firmware.  The M lenses are really the key for your intended genres of photography.  I would most higly suggest you keep your kit to 3 lenses.  Master those focal lengths and your results will speak volumes based on the content of your photographs.  Personally, I use the; 18 SEM, 35 and 75 Apo Summicrons for my color landscape photographs.  For B&W, I use the M11-M, 24 Elmar, 50 and 90 Apo Summicrons.  Two different bags, mediums and renderings.  If I had to neck my kit to one camera and 3 lenses, my choice would be M11-P, 24 Elmar, 50 and 90 Apo Summicrons.  Last, the good news, you have excellent choices and ultimately only you can decide what is best for you.   r/ Mark

Edited July 19 by LeicaR10

[sanadsaad]

Ive been reading a few reviews and I dont get why the M11 is getting so much hate. Issues with freezing, bad colours, bad viewfinder. Is this true? I can see freezing was an issue that firmware sorted.  

[spersky]

On 7/12/2025 at 1:27 PM, Tseg said:

Here is the Leica starter set:

• 28mm Summicron ASPH III
• 35mm APO Summicron
• 50mm Summilux ASPH II
• 90mm APO

From here you can build out your 'character lenses.

 

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Now that is a great kit!.  Is it trouble knowing when to use the 35vs the 28?.  I have all 3 but I fo not have the 35mm APO.

[IkarusJohn]

On 7/15/2025 at 9:44 AM, sanadsaad said:

So I think ive come up with a small list. 

Camera: M11 Black paint or M11-P. I absolutely love how the black paint looks and feels but people keep mentioning the sapphire glass and increased storage on the P. 

Lens:

1. 21mm Super Elmar

2. 35mm APO Summicron/35 Summilux steel rim

3. 50mm Summilux

4. 75mm APO Summicron

I need to decide between skipping the 50 or the 75. Im not sure yet. I will probably shoot a few rolls with 50mm and see if I miss the 35 much? Maybe when I have the 21, I won't go to the 35mm. I love shooting 50mm and only go to 35mm when I need a bit more space and there isn't any to move back with a 50mm and get everything in frame. 

Good list!

I would decide between either the 50 or the 75 - I would get the 75 Summilux over the 75 APO Summicron.  Another thing to consider is that you’re likely to take out lenses in pairs - typically (in my experience, anyway) I take my 21 or not, and then it’s a case of 28 & 50 or 35 & 75.  So, 21-28-50 or 21-35-75 would make more sense to me.

You might also consider if you want all modern lenses, with similar character or a mix of Karbe & Mandler designed lenses.  So, on your list, all the lenses are Karbe designs (apart from the steel rim, which was a re-release in his term).  Adding the 75 Summilux would give you the added option of a lens of which Mandler was most proud (soft wide open, sharp stopped down) - a lovely portrait lens.  The 35 Summilux pre-asph is similar, and much loved (though prone to flare).

Sounds like you’re close to a decision!

[bcaslis]

The 75mm APO Summicron is my favorite lens.

 

[sanadsaad]

Thank you so much all for your advice. The following stuff is on it's way out:

Nikon FM3a
Nikon F6

Nikon F3HP

20mm f2.8 AIS
24mm f2.8 AIS

28 f2.8 AIS
50 f1.2 AIS

85mm f1.4 AFD

Possibly will sell the 50mm f2 summicron and 35mm f2.8 biogon.

Also possibly making its way out will be the Nikon Z8 with 40mm f2 which I never quite gelled with even though it is an AMAZING value camera. 

 

Incoming:

M11/M11-P. Need to decide used vs new. If new, I will go with black paint M11. If used, M11 for sub-£6000 price to minimise losses on future upgrades (if needs change, not tech). 

21mm Super elmar - definitely getting it as need a solid performer at wide angle and people are nearly unanimous with this one. 

Either 35mm summilux or 50mm summilux. Still debating. Shooting 2 rolls each with each focal length over next two weeks. 35mm I like for street but 50 for reach which makes me think I should buy a 35 and a 75.

75mm summilux has now thrown me off a bit as I was looking at the £2000 75mm summicron but now I WANT the 75mm summilux after researching when it was mentioned here. 

Upgrade will be as money comes along so I might keep upgrade body first, use my summicron and biogon with it and then upgrade lenses. That way I keep shooting while upgrading. 

[sanadsaad]

Update: Ive added my M6 to the list as well. This would give me enough funds to get a camera and Lux lens to get started. And then add more lenses later as needed. There is an M11-P and an M11 black paint glossy both ex-demo for sale at the same price which is a dilemma. 

[Tseg]

On 7/23/2025 at 8:38 PM, spersky said:

Is it trouble knowing when to use the 35vs the 28?. 

I generally take only 1 lens out for the day.   My 28mm is almost exclusively used for when I go into "the city" and do (attempt) street photography, with the wide FL and wide DOF for zone focusing, etc...

For me, picking between the 35mm and 50mm for most of my other photography is the more challenging choice... but not really, because both are awesome.

[sanadsaad]

Update: Sold most of my camera equipment and bought the M11-P! Picking it up this Friday. Ive kept my M6, 50 summicron and 35 Biogon for now but debating if I should trade these in for a new 35 FLE II? There's an APO going for the same price so not sure if I should go with the Lux or the APO? 

[IkarusJohn]

4 hours ago, sanadsaad said:

Update: Sold most of my camera equipment and bought the M11-P! Picking it up this Friday. Ive kept my M6, 50 summicron and 35 Biogon for now but debating if I should trade these in for a new 35 FLE II? There's an APO going for the same price so not sure if I should go with the Lux or the APO? 

Have a look at the 35mm images on the forum.  I’ve had two copies of the first version of the Summilux FLE, and didn’t like either - primarily because the bokeh was nervous and distracting.  I appreciate that depends on subject matter, composition and aperture, but I just didn’t like it.  Whereas I love the 35 APO Summicron.

An alternative is the pre-FLE 35 Summilux ASPH - nice lens, but does suffer from focus shift (apparently - never tried one).  I did have the 35 Summilux pre-asph (not sure which version, but the last one, not the steel-rim).  Nice, characterful lens; soft wide open, sharp stopped down, but prone to nasty veiling flare.  I also tried the 35 Distagon ZM - reasonably typical Zeiss lens, with great contrast but I didn’t like the colour cast so much and it was really very big …

The 35 APO seems to meet my needs, and more.

[lct]

On 8/7/2025 at 1:12 AM, sanadsaad said:

Ive kept my M6, 50 summicron and 35 Biogon for now but debating if I should trade these in for a new 35 FLE II?

Summilux 35 FLE or FLE2 are significantly bulkier than your Biogon 35/2.8. I would consider them if you shoot in low light though. I own the Summilux 35/1.4 FLE (no experience with FLE2) but i find it too harsh rendition so i now use a 6-bit coded Summilux 35/1.4 asph pre-FLE which matches well lenses like your Summicron 50 and has no focus shift issues. Another good idea would be the current Summicron 35/2 asph but if you don't shoot in low light, the Biogon is hard to beat. Happy snaps

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Hallo,

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[mjw3]

On 7/18/2025 at 7:44 PM, Kiwimac said:

At the moment I’m satisfied with an M11-P, a 28 Summilux, a LLL 35 f2 8 Element and a 50 Apo Summicron. 
 

Based on past experience, I stay away from longer lenses on the M. If I wanted to use them (anything longer than 50) I’d buy a used SL series body and do it on that with the M adapter. It’s not impossible to use them on an M but it’s very hard using the rangefinder unless you’ve exceptional eyesight. 
 

I’ll probably get a 35mm in a newer design.  The 8 Element homage by LLL is certainly very good indeed. However, as a reproduction of a very old design using replicated very old glass and coating, it is what we might call ‘characterful’ and what Peter Karbe might call “flawed”! A bog standard current Summicron 35 is almost certainly less flawed and of course you can’t see the flare and ghosting through a rangefinder so you might not realise it’s there until you check. Sometimes you want the old look and sometimes you don’t. 
 

I would like an M11 Monochrom if I win lotto. 

We're almost twins. M11 (silver of course) + 21 SEM + 28 Lux + 35 Simera + 50 APO Lanthar

The Simera is serviceable - more of my single-lens snapshot kit. Would love to get the smaller APO Summicron 50, but as you say - lotto material.

Edited August 8 by mjw3

[sanadsaad]

So I picked up the M11-P today and traded in my M6 as well as the 50 summicron. Tried the 35 APO and the steel rim summilux in store. The steel rim is slightly smaller than the biogon but has character where the biogon is clinical. The setup was very light! The 35 APO was really good in hand and the pictures are gorgeous. They didn't have the FLE in store in Mayfair but showed me the 50 Lux as that has a similar heft. I am leaning more towards the 35 APO.  The weight of the M11-P is significantly less than the M6! Im shot with it with the biogon and I really enjoyed the weight. Very glad I pulled the trigger on the M11-P. Loving the experience so far. And thank you all for all your guidance.