M12 wishlist

[evikne]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

15 minutes ago, jaapv said:

Not only a screen, but all gimmicks, even "A" 

I wouldn't miss anything. Except maybe the fake lever.

[jaapv]

20 minutes ago, IkarusJohn said:

Now, many may raise issues like white balance, tethering, EVF and other controls from the digital age.  Trying to do what is possible rather than what is necessary has got us to the M11. With available technology these days, provided the raw file is good, most can be corrected in post.  

 

Yes! It would need photographical skill AND postprocessing skill.  Exactly what digital photography is about. The rest is photographic talent - like it always has been.

[costa43]

My ultimate digital M would be a film camera with a sensor. Advance lever activates shutter. No screen. Lowish megapixel count. Instant start up. No wifi, no Visoflex. Just bare and quick. No distractions and purely designed for the experience rather than trying to be a bit of everything. It’s just way too bloated at the moment. 

The reality is though that Leica relies heavily on its existing customer base to upgrade so the m12 will likely be 60mp or thereabouts and full of tech. A modern camera, less charming than what has come before it. 

Edited December 2, 2024 by costa43

[T25UFO]

2 hours ago, Al Brown said:

For the working man - THIS is the M12 I would gladly pay for. If it freezes you get ice coffee!

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

That’s clever 🙂

[evikne]

20 minutes ago, costa43 said:

The reality is though that Leica relies heavily on its existing customer base to upgrade so the m12 will likely be 60mp or thereabouts and full of tech. A modern camera, less charming than what has come before it. 

I think Leica may have picked up on the growing dissatisfaction with all these technical stuff. I'm hoping it might lead to a split M line, going in opposite directions.

[IkarusJohn]

21 minutes ago, costa43 said:

My ultimate digital M would be a film camera with a sensor. Advance lever activates shutter. No screen. Lowish megapixel count. Instant start up. No wifi, no Visoflex. Just bare and quick. No distractions and purely designed for the experience rather than trying to be a bit of everything. It’s just way too bloated at the moment. 

The reality is though that Leica relies heavily on its existing customer base to upgrade so the m12 will likely be 60mp or thereabouts and full of tech. A modern camera, less charming than what has come before it. 

I don’t buy the wind-on recharge suggestion - batteries are relatively reliable, relatively cheap (except when they have a Leica badge) and convenient - but otherwise, I agree.

[costa43]

Advertisement (gone after registration)

3 minutes ago, evikne said:

I think Leica may have picked up on the growing dissatisfaction with all these technical stuff. I'm hoping it might lead to a split M line, going in opposite directions.

Hope so. I’m not sure if there are enough of us who want a stripped back experience and are willing to pay for it though. 

[costa43]

7 minutes ago, IkarusJohn said:

I don’t buy the wind-on recharge suggestion - batteries are relatively reliable, relatively cheap (except when they have a Leica badge) and convenient - but otherwise, I agree.

Some nostalgia that would be nice for the tangible experience but the least important to me too. I do find it crazy that my old m8 gets me a shot quicker from start up than my m10r did. 

[Velo-city]

15 hours ago, IkarusJohn said:

Sure, make more complex versions, but make this a D version with no screen - happy!  If it must have a screen, then at least make an S version, for simple.  Lose the baseplate if you must (don’t care).

The ‘S’ version (I think this is an SL model?) could be as simple as a one-off first page in the setup menu when you initialise the camera. 
 

Select ‘S’ mode (or classic mode or whatever) and from that point on you will not see any advanced features unless you reset the camera.   If they used an OLED display in the OVF it could literally be made to mimic the classic look.  
 

or ask a series of questions like- enable screen? Enable dual EVF?, enable IBIS?, 
 

Presumably the next model has to offer something new? Looking back it appears it’s historically sensor/resolution based but at 60MP that’s unlikely to be sensible to increase even if physically possible (unlikely). So it has to be something else. 
 

They should also look at pro cameras and other brands starting to introduce onboard LUTs etc. That would be extremely beneficial and a powerful tool that doesn’t change the physical body or shooting experience if someone wasn’t interested in it. 

[IkarusJohn]

Sorry, I don’t understand any of that.

[LocalHero1953]

I drafted a post listing all the features I would like to see removed, all those I would like to see added, and all those that I'd like to see improved or altered. Then decided I still might not buy it. Frankly, none of it made sense: Leica would either offend those in the traditional camp or not sell to those who want something modern.

Leica should take the route signposted by the current MA/MP/M6 line-up: an unchanging simple digital M12 with no extra features beyond what they have in the M10/M11 (the equivalent of the MP/M6) and an even simpler version (like the M-A) that might be a M12D. Then, radical step, stop investing in the digital M line. The only future changes would be those needed to keep up with tech obsolescence e.g. replacing SD cards with CFe, updating physical ports to match newer needs, and refreshing firmware. 

This would release all that M12/M13/M14..... R&D money for lenses and the modern digital lines: Q/SL/S and perhaps a replacement D-Lux.

[fededuran]

My M11 is ok after a hundred firmware updates. Finally. It is hard to imagine an M12 with some hybrid viewfinder (Fuji and Pixii have shown some ideas about how to implement it) after all the technical issues around the M11s, but next year is Leica's 100 anniversary and how knows. I would introduce only two changes in the M12 line: a modest image stabilization solution and less megapixels on the sensor. 

[pgk]

The M12 should be half the MPixels of the M11 and consequently half the price. Otherwise it will hold no interest for me. I can get far higher specified cameras for vastly less than the M11 and despite what some think, they deliver excellent and sometimes exquistie results. I like rangefinders but not at the current silly M prices. 🙂

[jgeenen]

What I like about the digital M is the close relationship to the analog M. I know, they are different cameras and probably only a few parts (if any) are identical on both M variants, but the relationship should be maintained (that is what is making Leica truly unique on the market). Obviously digital technology is still evolving and Leica needs to adjust some bits and pieces, but that is nothing I would consider „major“. But in essence I do want the M sisters evolve in the same direction, so no IBIS, no step-up in resolution, no AI enhancers etc. I honestly don’t care about base plates or open shutters, and this will not influence my future buying decision. 
 

but there is one thing that is (at least to my eyes - literally) outdated since ages: the rangefinder. I want it wider, I want more information in the viewfinder (hey, the red 3.5 digit seven segment display is already outdated since the first M6 generation from the mid 80s) and I want it more eyesight friendly. Built-in magnification would be nice, too. I don‘t need hybrid finders, there are way cheaper options (including Leica) for EVF cameras available. The same (or better similar) viewfinder could bring the MP/M6 onto steroids as well - time for a M6-2!

[WvE]

Wetzlar please keep the physical buttons, instead of doing everything in the menu or the screen, like a Tesla. Go back to simplicity with just a killer sensor.

[lct]

I hope the OVF won't be cluttered with any gadgets. Those who prefer an aircraft cockpit can have that with an EVF.

[jaapv]

17 hours ago, jgeenen said:

What I like about the digital M is the close relationship to the analog M. I know, they are different cameras and probably only a few parts (if any) are identical on both M variants, but the relationship should be maintained (that is what is making Leica truly unique on the market). Obviously digital technology is still evolving and Leica needs to adjust some bits and pieces, but that is nothing I would consider „major“. But in essence I do want the M sisters evolve in the same direction, so no IBIS, no step-up in resolution, no AI enhancers etc. I honestly don’t care about base plates or open shutters, and this will not influence my future buying decision. 
 

but there is one thing that is (at least to my eyes - literally) outdated since ages: the rangefinder. I want it wider, I want more information in the viewfinder (hey, the red 3.5 digit seven segment display is already outdated since the first M6 generation from the mid 80s) and I want it more eyesight friendly. Built-in magnification would be nice, too. I don‘t need hybrid finders, there are way cheaper options (including Leica) for EVF cameras available. The same (or better similar) viewfinder could bring the MP/M6 onto steroids as well - time for a M6-2!

Actually the rangefinder/ viewfinder had a substantial update on the M240. In fact, Leica has been working on it continuously over the years without advertising or making it obvious. Leica would be out of touch with the selling point of the M if they changed the configuration. It would not be a brilliant idea IMO. The revolt would eclipse the video button hoohah on the 240. 

[Alberti]

definitely no dependency  on external vendors technology: just to make it explicit - Apple iPhone or the Apple computer etc. Because this vendor can change it's interpretation of USB protocols without disclosure.

Evidence: the millions of customers having problems attaching previous generation external devices to their newer computer. The new technology is not backwards compatible - often not in any way, they are just not recognized; or are but not visible not useable. 

You don't want to be stuck with keeping an old Macos computer at standby just for this.

 

[Alberti]

and just superior colours. No muddiness (of green grass or snow for example).

Welcome, dear visitor! As registered member you'd see an image here…

Simply register for free here – We are always happy to welcome new members!

[Advertisement]

Hallo,

Look here: Interesting Leica gear

[davorb]

I'd like

* laser rangefinder mechanism

* IBIS

* GPS

* EVF (don't hate me for this)